Car audio people, need some good help & advice

Hey all,

I am going to put a subwoofer enclosure in the back of my 97 4 door XJ and wanted to find out exactly what kind of amps you would recommend and other accessories.

I currently have a Kenwood Excelon receiver upfront, the 789 version, and I have Pioneer 6 1/2's up front and in the rear speaker bar all running from the stock amp. I want to add either one or two of the new Pioneer shallow subs in their shallow sealed enclosure:

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/product/detail/0,,2076_4061_90400838,00.html

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pna/product/detail/0,,2076_4061_97957030,00.html

The subs specs are:

Watts MAX. Music Power 1200W
Watts Nominal Power Handling 300W
Frequency Response 18Hz ~1kHz
Sensitivity 88dB
Ohm Rating 4 Ohm
Recommended Enclosure 0.6 ~ 1.0 Cubic Feet

The box's specs are:

Dimensions: 30-5/8" x 14-3/8" x 6-3/8

The pioneer 6 1/2 specs are:

Watts MAX. Music Power 220 Watts
Watts Nominal Power Handling 35 Watts
Frequency Response 30Hz ~ 33kHz
Sensitivity (1W/1m) 90dB
Ohm Rating 4

So basically what I am looking from you all is help on deciding what kind of amp (and how many) I need for this setup to run nice. Didn't know if I need a mono to push the 300 for the sub and a 4 channel for the rest, etc. I am pretty set on getting the sub, so not looking to get talked out of it. I had originally thought about a Bazooka, Infinity Basslink, or custom install in the rest side hole in the back, but that really wouldn't give me room for a 12". I could have an installer do a setup on the right side in that hole in the back using that same shallow depth sub, but it would cost more than just getting the box that was made for the sub. I am also looking for advice on whether I need any other additional components that I forgot about (capacitors, etc)

Also, not looking to get high dollar amps, just looking to get some good amps that will really perform well and last.

Thanks in advance,

Chris

My system is all eclipse and infinity.
I spent about two months of going into car toys and bugging them and listening to the different setups there. Looking online and researching.
Then i bought all but headunit from ebay:

Component front speakers and full range rear in the sound bar
all infinity kappas then a 10" infinty kappa sub.
2 Eclipse amps and the eclipse headunit.

Ok so i consider myself an audiophile.. if i wasnt going to be spending so much on armor and other stuff for the jeep i would have gotten the FOCAL's but alas thats WAYYY to much $$$

Why am i telling you this?

Just so you know where i am at and what i did.

I see that you have most of your audio parts already and have figured some of this out SO.......

What kind of music do you listen to?
How loud do you listen to it?
How much can you spend?
Does that include installing it yourself?

Ok with that out of the way.

I believe that a 10" sub is all you need.. Naysayers may say more [huh? LOL]
BUt i am going from my experience.. so

i will answer the questions i asked you just now

What kind of music do you listen to? TECHNO, HOUSE, DEEP DISH, Sander Klienenberg, Doc Martin Etc... and Sabbath [ozzy] and Led Zep and P Floyd [i am in my thirties hehe]
How loud do you listen to it? FUCKING LOUD AS SHIT I MEAN OH MY GOD seriously sometimes my ears DO actually ring.. iknow iknow...
How much can you spend? I spent around $1200 ebay used new and on sale items.. retail would have cost me about $2300 and around 2800 installed!!!
Does that include installing it yourself? I did the complete install myself, everything saving well over 500 on install of component front speakers and amps.

Ok so this is the wiring :
I have the headunit powered and the preouts all go to the amp and thats all that it does [powered! duh LOL]
I have a 400W amp pushing all of the speakers. ie: headunit does nothing, sounds best seems like you allude to doing that too.
200 watt amp for 10" sub.. NOW i know and have heard the difference on more power for the sub. I could push it with a 1000 watts as that the max itll take [on paper] but really even having stood in front of a wall of JBL's at plenty o raves and clubs.. its plenty enough to shake the car up and bug the people next to me if i want .. i have the sub amp turned down a little too as its just really thick..

I went with a small sub box non ported very simple and good enough i lucked out on ebay and got it for 60$ infinity and box mounted ready to go.
Both amps are mounted to back of rear seats and i have my wiring split between the two running boards. AMP wiring up through firewall and line + fuse at the battery. Amps are grounded to the jack post under the rear seats and there you go..

All i see that you need is to add the wiring kits in your shopping list.
That sub looked great for what you have and want.

I would consider a JL amp for your sub and would go with whatever you can afford anything above 300 watts as the specs indicate on your post...and can be bridgable or switchable 1/2 channel or mono.
Keep in mind that it will be good even at 300 watts and more wattage you give it the more bass and better staging and sound you will get.. whether that is neccesary or not is up to you and your pocketbook.

the other amp: again choose one that you can afford. But it does need to be a 4 channel, try to go with solid brands like Alpine, Kenwood [like your headunit] or Eclipse and JL there are many but i would stick with the knows also MTX is sapposed to be good too. Power? go with at least 400W.
You can ask me whatever Q.s you have

I think i went on and on enough for now :speepin:

aaron

my choice for that would be either MTX or Phoenix Gold mono amps. MTX if your looking for serious power. My fav of all time. PG is great for SQ/SPL combo... A mono amp simplifies things. PG makes a great amp. Xenon. Available in 1200.1, 600.1 and 400.1. I'd use the 600.1 for that application. These amps put out the rated power at 4,2 and 1 ohm.... No mater what. if its 600 watts at 4 it will be the same at 2 ohms and so on. Hard to screw that up and fry an amp. I have personal experience with these and love them. Another PG route is the Octane series. Great little amp and bang for the buck. This series has mono amps from the 300W range (at 2 ohms) to 1500W (at 2ohms). Great value series and sound good to. Remember, distortion kills speakers long before "over powering" will. Get ample wattage and lessen your gains.
MTX... If you get a (just for reasoning sake) 500 watt amp...expect to have it put out well over that. I used a (2) 1500D and they pushed 1718 & 1731 watts well over the rated 1500w max. These are a bit more pricy than some amps but well worth it. If you get a bigger MTX. LARGE cable is a must. I had 0 ga. running to both.
For your application...PG octain series sounds fitting....or another brand of similar out put. I just like MTX and PG. Mmats and memphis are good as well. Never been a fan, but look at rockford to. somewhere between 500 and 700 would be best but 4-600 is sufficent. Just my two cent!

if you want "bang for buck" look at Clarion amps. i bought one of their mono amps because it fits under the passenger seat, had enough power to run two 12" subs at 2 ohms, and was less than 200 bucks. as for your full range speakers, i wouldn't drop money on an amp to power those, unless your stock 4-chan. amp is rated under 20watts rms/channel, or you get some 100 watt rms full range speakers.

So if I am only running one of the 12" subs, then I need a mono amp that can push the sub easily over 300W and get close as I can to 1200, etc. What about Lanzar? I have heard great things about these amps and I was thinking about these two:

http://www.lanzar.com/itempage.asp?MODEL=VIBE600D

http://www.lanzar.com/itempage.asp?MODEL=OPTI1400D

The question is, if I am only running one speaker, then I am guessing that I will only be able to run at 4 ohms? Is that correct or can I push the amp to 2 ohms to give the sub more power?

Thanks,

Chris

If you want to run a 2 ohm load on your mon (!) amp, get two 4 ohm subs... Or buy a DVC (dual voice coil) sub with dual 4 ohm coils and wire it in parallel. This will show your amp a 2 ohm load. Do not attempt this with a two channel amp brigged...unless it is stable for 2 ohm mono/ 1 ohm stereo. IT WILL FRY!
Here is the rule...when ever you add an impedence to an amp (a peaker, lets say 4 ohms) the amp puts out that power. drop another speaker on it (same type and impedence) and you drop the impedence to 2 ohms. Add a third 4 ohm driver and you have a 1.33 ohm load. add a 4th speaker and you have a 1 ohm load. thiss is how it would go for a 2 channel stereo amp. per channel. thats 4 drivers per channel for a total of 8 speakers. Few amps can do this I am just painting the picture for you.
Now, bridge that amp. Add one 4 ohm driver to it. = 4 ohm load. Add a second driver to that (4 ohm speaker) and wha la.... 2 ohm mono load. BAD for most 2 channel amps. Mono amp....can take 2 ohms all day long. I personaly know many that run MTX amps at 1.33 ohms (amp is only rated at 2 ohms) and never had a problem. They do however run 0ga. wire and atleast 1 cap for each amp. I hope this explains a little to ya...if you have specific ?'s...PM me...good luck.

Double Down said:

So if I am only running one of the 12" subs, then I need a mono amp that can push the sub easily over 300W and get close as I can to 1200, etc. What about Lanzar? I have heard great things about these amps and I was thinking about these two:

http://www.lanzar.com/itempage.asp?MODEL=VIBE600D

http://www.lanzar.com/itempage.asp?MODEL=OPTI1400D

The question is, if I am only running one speaker, then I am guessing that I will only be able to run at 4 ohms? Is that correct or can I push the amp to 2 ohms to give the sub more power?

Thanks,

Chris

Click to expand...

make sure you dont get rms watts and peak watts mixed up when you buy your sub and speaker.

subs can come with 2 or 4 ohms resistance. you cant push an amp to lower ohms by itself; you either buy one sub with 2ohm or wire two(4ohm) in parrallel to get your 2ohm resistance.

I am running a boss 3000 watt max mono block 2200 watt rms at 2 ohms to one audiobahn immortal sub (with quad voice coils) and I am hitting about 135 db to 137 db with some distortion due to box not being larg enough (4.57 cubic feet I need 5.2)and I also have a 1000 4 channel boss amp for my 2 sets of audiobahn 5.25 component speakers also have an extra battery which is I think an ever start it is 1000 cold cranking amps.... any way I would go with boss amps because you can get them on ebay for cheap and they have a 6 year warranty (also they have high peak watts with a high rms)


overall reliable cheap power with a high rms for the money

should be good for what your subs can handle
http://cgi.ebay.com/Boss-RIP-696-Ri...793688975QQcategoryZ79818QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Alright i'm late, but I do know about all things sub's from experience. In my xj I was pushing 2000 watts rms and 4000 max. A good quality amp that will not break the bank or its self is hifonics. If you have one or two 300rms subs I would recomend the 500 or 1000 watt hifonics. Now for the door speakers you will need a multi channel amp. I would just stick with a good head reciever and good speakers vs. an amp for them. DO NOT get a boss, I have never heard anything good about them and had the same one as the guy above. Wired correctly it blew up after a month and it was only half turned up. Then I got it fixed and after 5 min it did the same thing. Even when they work the quality is very poor and I doubt it realy is 2200 rms because my 1000 rms hifonics sounds much louder and clearer. O and what did I have that took 2000RMS 2 directed 1100 d about 750 a peace and 2 rockford power xh2's a optima batt and 5 farad cap. I actualy melted a 4ga wire and had to go 0/1ga to the cap and 4 to each amp. TOO LOUD. have fun and good luck.
PS. Buy a good amp the first time, its much cheaper than buying a new one to replace the blown up one.

I have had my boss amp for about 2 years now and i have it turned as loud as it will go and has been their since the sub got broke in...Never had a problem, but you are right about the sound quaility but that is not what i am going for if i would of wanted that i would'nt of gotten a comp. sub... all i know is i havnt had an problems at all and i would recomend them!!!
Why didnt you send it in on the warrenty because the do have a 6 year warrenty... If yours didnt it prolly was a referbished one... That might explain y it farked up!

Did not buy from a BOSS dealer. It was brand new, but because they were not a dealer there was no waranty. Also the reason it broke was probably because what boss claims as 2200rms watts was not up to the task of REAL 2000rms subs. I got the amp for $150 and got my hifonics for $180. Get a good amp, dont waste money on bad quality amps.