XJ won't turn over

Hey guys,
It's been a while since I have posted. My XJ has been sitting for around 6 months after breaking down and me leaving the state for a while, but now I'm back and trying to get it running again.

When my Jeep broke down I thought it was the crank sensor, but after a similar issue with my van I am fairly certain it was the map sensor. I have replaced the sensor, but now the Jeep won't turn over. When I turn the key the engine will turn slightly, so it is not seized up. I had the starter tested at AutoZone and it tested fine. I have checked the connections and hit the terminals with a wire brush to make sure it has good connections to the battery. I have swapped the relay. When I try it acts like the starter is bad, the lights dim and there is no clicking like I would expect if the starter was engaged. The engine ground and positive to the starter are getting hot. So hot I can smell the insulation burning and it hurts to touch.

I am thinking that the starter is weak, but not completely failed, hence why it worked on the bench. Does this sound right to anyone else? Anything else I might have missed? I am probably going to order a new starter on Amazon instead of getting a reman from the parts house. It is cheaper and has great reviews, but I wanted to get some other opinions first.

Thanks for the help!

Sounds to me like you have major corrosion in your battery cables. Buy some new ones, clean and lube all the connections.

I hadn't thought about the cables themselves. I'll give it a shot and see what happens, thanks.

Quick check on properly grounded starter. Run a separate battery cable from battery negative (ground) terminal directly to a starter mounting bolt. See if it starts.

Best regards,

CJR

Had a similar problem once. Sometimes it would crank (and start) sometimes not. Took the starter out and used my jumper cables to the battery on my other vehicle and sometimes it would run and sometimes not. Took to AZ for a test, it passed. When I explained, they tested it several times in a row. It finally failed. Since I bought it from them some years earlier and had my AZ rewards linked, they found my receipt. Gave me a new one (rebuilt) for free as part of the warranty.

Having written that, check your cables as others have suggested. Corrosion can hide under the insulation increasing the resistance. Resistance creates heat. Inthis case, resistance is not futile, it's the enemy.

Ditto on the auto store test not being reliable. Also probably a good time to replace the major battery cables if they're the originals.

Thanks guys, I'm going to replace the cables tomorrow. I have a new starter coming in on Friday. The cables are original, so the definitely need to be replaced anyway.

Dacrane,

Just replacing the battery cables may or may not cure your no-start problem. If your starter is not properly grounded it still may not start. If it will not start after new battery cables, take ONE of your two jumper cables and attach one end to the negative battery terminal (i.e.ground) and attach the other end to a starter motor bolt. If it starts, then you'll know the starter has a poor ground which has to be corrected. My 00XJ permanent fix was to install a No.2 welding cable from the battery negative terminal to a starter mounting bolt. That provided an additional grounding path to the starter.

Best regards,

CJR

I'll keep that in mind. I haven't been able to work on it yet, it has been raining non stop for three days now.

Ok, update time, I replaced the starter with the new one, replaced all of the major battery cables (engine ground, chassis ground, positive to starter), and tried connecting the starter body directly to the battery negative. Same as before, it turns slightly (it even made a full rotation, but very slowly), but it will not consistently turn over and when it does turn it is very slow. I am at a loss at this point.

Sound like the starter is not getting enough voltage. Maybe the battery is weak? Try jumping it with another battery when starting. Have you tried measuring the voltage at the positive(+) starter connection, with a good negative ground(-), while the starter is cranking? If the voltage at the starter is low, work back to the starter solenoid. Then measure to see if there is any voltage drop across the starter solenoid (i.e. increased internal resistance) when the starter is cranking.

Best regards,

CJR

Yeah, do you have a voltmeter or battery load tester?

low voltage to starter.

how old is the battery? Auto Zone will test for you as well. if still nothing, pull connections off starter. also make sure starter is securely bolted up, it grounds through the mating surface.

personally had oil leak from oil filter adapter eventually funk up my starter connex.

I do have a multimeter I can use to test once my brother gets off work today. I tested from the starter positive to the body yesterday and it was reading 12.8, but that was not under load. I may also try connecting jumper cables to the starter positive and body then trying it in the mean time. I tried two different batteries. One is a Walmart special that is about 7 months old, the other is a duralast gold that is only a couple months old, both start other vehicles fine.

It would not be the first time a "new starter" was bad out of the box . Have the new starter checked.

The only thing that comes to mind on very, very hard starting is a " hydro-locking engine". That's when you have coolant leaking into and filling a cylinder bore. In that case, the starter is straining to turn the engine crankshaft during starting because liquid is NOT compressible. Sometimes a connecting rod gets bent in the process and must be replaced. Pull all the spark plugs and see if the engine turns over easier. Likewise, see if coolant is being blown-out the spark plug holes while the starter is freely turning over the engine.

Hard starting can also be caused by over advanced distributors.

Best regards,

CJR

Plot twist time, I did a battery bench test on the new starter and it would barely turn when given direct power. Tried with the old one and it did great. Gonna swap them back and see what happens

Tried pulling the plugs, same result. I tested the new starter with the battery and a set of jumper cables. It turned freely. My initial test failed because I connected the cables to the nut holding the cable going into the starter. When I connected it directly to the cable or post it did fine. The old starter also tested fine using the same method. I cleaned the mating surface on the bell housing with some carb cleaner and a wire brush until it was shiny, same with the starter and the bolts. It will still turn slightly, but it will not turn over completely. I did manage to melt the positive terminal partially during my last attempt.

So to recap, I have cleaned all contact points to shiny (engine ground, chassis ground, Bell housing mating surface, starter) I have replaced all relevant cables (positive to starter, engine ground, chassis ground), replaced the terminals, tried a different battery, replaced the starter, removed the spark plugs. It does turn, but only slightly each time. Sometimes it turns more than others. The cables are getting hot which makes me think current is flowing, but there is no clicking like I would expect to hear if the starter were struggling or the engine was seized.

Should I send the starter back and get a different one to try? It spun up well when I did the battery test and even jumped a little from the torque. I am strongly considering just putting her out to pasture and getting another XJ to move my parts to.

I would be inclined to remove the front accessory belt and see if everything up there spins freely.

I would also try turning the engine by hand (ratchet with a socket on the harmonic balancer) and see just how hard it is to do that. Best without plugs.

Anak,
Thanks, you just helped me confirm my worst fears. Even with a cheater I wasn't able to turn it by hand. The crank bolt just kept getting tighter to the point I was afraid it was going to break. She is seized up, but not completely. Like I said, she turns slightly when I turn the key. My guess is some coolant got into one or several of the cylinders while it was sitting and rusted the walls and rings. I doubt it would be worth trying, but should I get some fogging oil and see if I can get it to break loose? I was planning on swapping the engine in a few months anyway, so I might just borrow my brother's truck until I get the money for a reman from AutoZone.

On that note, has anyone done a swap on one of these? Seems like it would be pretty simple, remove the front clip and radiator, remove all sensors and hoses, unbolt the transmission, support the transmission in the front so it doesn't drop, unbolt the motor mounts and pull. I've done a few old Fords, but never an XJ.

Thanks again for all the help on this everybody

Sorry to hear about your engine problem. Glad to see you solved your no-start problem. Freeing piston rings, rusted to the cylinder walls could be done, but why even bother? The engine most likely wouldn't run right with rust pitted cylinder walls and damaged rust-covered rings. Likewise, the crankshaft may also be damaged/rusted since coolant dripped onto it. If the crankshaft journals rusted, the main bearings are most likely scored from the attempted starts.

I have pulled XJ engines with and without the transmission attached . Personally, I like to pull the engine with transmission attached which seems faster to me. This also gives me better access and allows proper torquing of the transmission/engine mounting bolts. The reinstall also goes faster as well.

Good luck on your engine replacement effort!

Best regards,

CJR