• NAXJA is having its 18th annual March Membership Drive!!!
    Everyone who joins or renews during March will be entered into a drawing!
    More Information - Join/Renew
  • Welcome to the new NAXJA Forum! If your password does not work, please use "Forgot your password?" link on the log-in page. Please feel free to reach out to [email protected] if we can provide any assistance.

New Jeep...new problems!

CheapJerokee

NAXJA Forum User
Location
CA
Hello everyone. This is my first post and first time owning a Jeep or anything four wheel drive. Scratch that, my Cherokee is only RWD...for now:D.

1997 Cherokee Sport two door RWD

So, I went to look at the Jeep from the person I bought it from. The person was 25 years old. I had brought with me a new oil pan gasket because the previous owner told me that it was leaking really bad. I asked where and he said, "the oil pan seal". I was worried he meant the rear main seal but he kept saying the oil pan seal. I asked to clarify if he said the oil pan gasket or not and I didn't really get anything satisfactory. My friend and I were looking it over and it had a lot of new parts on it, including a/c parts as well as power steering pump, water, pump and lines so I thought maybe it might still be a good deal for $1,500.00

Having said all that, the Jeep had multiple misfires. If I recall correctly, it was showing 4 codes including the po300, po302, po303, and po305. We ran that while we were there and looked as best as we could at the rear main seal. It looked like it was possible that the rear main seal was fine but the previous owner recently changed hte oil and had spilled oil that had probably ran down the motor and perhaps hit the exhaust.

The passenger door is not in good shape. The previous owner told me it needed to be rehanged (is that proper grammar?) the passenger door is able to open but closing it is another story. It needs to be lifted like an inch or so.

The interior is...well let's just say it has seen better days. The kid was a smoker and the goo covering everything that is vinyl or plastic - like the center console etc. is out of this world. It does NOT want to come off. It even laughs at Goo Gone.

Test drive while with the seller: I have never driven a Cherokee before but it wanders ever so slightly. The steering wheel is not straight when going straight. It probably needs an alignment we thought. My friend told me there was a dip coming up so I hit the brakes. The rear brakes almost immediately locked up. Yay! We tested the a/c. It worked on full blast. I don't remember trying any other setting. So, we drove around a little more and then returned to the place of the previous owner.

So, we popped the hood again and I looked at the master cylinder and discovered that it looked like molasses. Perfect!

w1TmL8kG


https://postimg.cc/rDrKSVrg

Long story short, after the previous owner asked me how the ride was, I responded with a little nerve racking because of the brakes. After negotiations I drove the new Jeep about 30 miles to my house.

It drove okay despite the misfires. I kept my foot out of it and stayed to the right on the freeway and drove it as gently as possible. I'm glad we made it safely because the brakes really worried me.

After a wash here is what we are left with

w1xt40VP


Front

q6zrC6X1


Right Front

Ok. So, there was the day I bought it. That was day one.

Day 2:
I knew I needed to fix the brakes so I bought some cheap DOT 3 fluid from Autozone. I bought two of their big bottles. Turns out that wasn't enough. Here is a pic after Round 1 with the right rear

XrVwLynx


Actually, it was hard to push the pedal to the floor and there was a weird, hard-to-describe sound coming from the rear. I think the sound was somewhat similar to something being forced through something a little too small. I think there was gunk partially clogging the lines.

Long story short, I went through 3 big bottles of cheap DOT 3. I then went to the Bosch stuff. I actually prefer ATE Blue but I guess we're not allowed to have that anymore :nono:

So, after the equivalent of about three and a half big bottles of brake fluid, I test drove and what do you know!? No more locking up the rear. I can stomp on the pedal now.

I also bought new brake light bulbs and replaced the two brake light bulbs. I didn't know there was also a third. :huh:

So, now i had two working brake lights. Turn signals work two.

Day 3: I wanted to change the oil and get the Jeep ready to start being worked on. I figured I would want to change the oil pump (just in case). So, I changed the oil but had some problems with the filter. I went to WallyWorld (Wal-Mart) and got two cheap filters because I was only going to be using them with cheap oil and for short bursts to help clean out the crank case. Well, the filters I got from them were way too big. Here is a pic of the oil filter that was on there.

KK5jFL8V


So, for now, I put the new oil in and put back on that pos filter. It was only going to be for a day.

Day 4: I hooked up the scanner to the Jeep and scanned again. I now have 7 codes: po300, po302, po303, po305, po118, po171, and po133. Only 7 codes! :hang:

I put some Seafoam in the crankcase and in the gas tank and drove it around for about 25 miles. I looked at the gas gauge and I was shocked. I was almost out of gas. I did the math and I must have been averaging around 10 mpg.

Now, I know that Seafoam is a solvent and therefore, it smells like a solvent. However, when I started to change the oil it really smelled like gasoline. This time, I took the filter off, took a picture and got a similar filter but a Mobil one. It was a M109A if I recall correctly.

Here are some pics of the drain pan though.

xqJx4PC6


7bKBhQRP


I cleaned out the oil pan before I drained any oil so I could see what, if anything, would be left behind. This wasn't too reassuring.

For the first oil change, I used 5-30 oil but for the last one I threw in 10-30 and even some lucas stabilizer. I'm guessing that I broke either the oil sender or oil pressure sensor (i'm not sure if those are different pieces or). The oil pressure gauge was at 0 and the "check gauges" light came on.

I'm unfamiliar with these motors, or Jeeps for that matter. What are oil pressures supposed to be? On the way home from buying the Jeep it seemed like the oil pressure at idle was around 9 and when on the freeway it went anywhere from 22-33ish psi. However, it vary rarely was in the 30's. I wasn't sure if that was normal, the pump needed to be replaced or the sending unit was bad.

When trying to take a picture of oil filter mounting bracket thingy I noticed that I caught a good glimpse of coppery, shiny bits on one of the plug wires.

VdDFs7K9


Here's a better pic below.

DJTGPsCy


I believe that plug wire goes to cylinder number 2. Cylinder number 2 is one of the cylinders that is misfiring. So, that might be the reason for the misfire for that particular cylinder.

After assessing all this, including the fact that I broke the sender or the oil pressure sensor itself, I put-putted the Cherokee outside my apartment complex and turned her off.

To rule out ignition, and for good measure (due to the previous owner), I am replacing the distributor, coil, spark plugs, and spark plug wires. The a/c, upon further analysis while driving, only works on the 4th setting. That's probably the blower motor resistor. So that is on its way. Both o2 sensors came up with the codes so those parts are on their way. All in all, i also have a new oil pump and gasket coming as well. There is also a chunk missing out of the belt so a new belt is coming too.

Wow, well I just wrote a book. I know nothing of Jeeps, except that my Dad has had a 1970 Toyota Landcruiser since before I was born and I hope I can get this thing back on the road with the parts that I bought and some time and ingenuity. Unfortunately, my best friend who has a wrangler and roped me into this buy, has said that I made a terrible mistake and that Jeep stands for Just Empty Every Pocket. :tears:

Any help getting this thing back on the road is appreciated. :D
 
Obviously first do a full tune up, that will probably fix your misfire. Replace the oil pressure sender and report back with the numbers, your other ones are low but kind of acceptable. 4.0s typically have high oil pressure. With 270k mine still has 60 at road speed 25 hot idle.
 
Pics aren't showing for me.

When you pull the plugs it would be a good idea to run a compression test.

It sounds like you have quite the fluster cluck on your hands. Don't assume that any of the new work was done right. Also don't assume your brakes are going to stay functional. I don't see that you have fixed any leaks, and without having done that the odds are good your fluid is going to disappear again, unless I missed something about a fixed leak.

If you are pulling the oil pan (required to replace oil pump) I would recommend pulling a bearing cap to take a look at bearing condition. And if I were in there I would be replacing the RMS.

In terms of oil leaks, pay special attention the the oil filter adapter that bolts to the block. The adapter has a set of O-rings which if they haven't already been replaced they probably need to be replaced. Do a search on that topic. The big honkin' Torx screw has a bad reputation for making folks' lives difficult. Expect to need some leverage.
 
Poor Jeep sounds like a victim of "Crimes Against Mechanicals", as I heard it described on another forum I frequent...

Anyway, don't forget the valve cover gasket - from what I've read, a leak on those can also masquerade as a RMS leak. Might be best to clean the engine and run it a couple days before starting to fix leaks just to be sure you're looking in the right places.
 
Forgot we can't edit posts (whats up with that?)

Anyway, when your O2 sensors are out your PCM will enrichen the fuel mix as it reads the system is lean when its really not. That causes a BIG dropoff in fuel mileage and could be why you smelled gas. I recently picked up a 99XJ and had a bad downstream O2 sensor that caused that problem for me.

I would suggest you use NTK 02 sensors, they are supposed to be the makers of the OEM line and have the fewest problems I have read.

I hope your vehicle does not require the CA emissions test, I hear they are a bear to pass.

Good luck!
 
Thanks Sig. Yeah, I was going to try and edit my earlier post with pics but I'm not aloud to??? I'm not sure why that is.

Yes, I am in Commiefornia. I had to plant 100 trees and swear off meat just to register the vehicle. Smog, well that's a different story.
 


Right Front



Front



Overhead view of master cylinder



Here's what remained in the drain pan after first change of oil.



Here's a closeup
It looks like some metal shavings and one big chunk of something. I'll have to go investigate when I get home.



This was the original oil filter (from previous owner). Looks small



I was trying to take a picture of the oil filter male connector but the heater hose(?) got in the way. But it led me to problem with the plug wire.



Better pic of bad plug wire for cylinder #2



This was an overflowing, formerly clear bottle, of used brake fluid. I went through 4 of these.



Used oil collected and shot of engine bay.



Another shot of engine bay and big used oil jug. I was trying to measure the amount of used oil I had taken out because I thought previous owner might have over filled it and thereby causing the rear main seal to fail (if it even has). My attempts to accurately measure didn't go that well as you can see by the big container. I think there is a little over 4 quarts in the big jug there and 56 oz. in the small one.

I hope these pics work.

Thanks for looking.

That's the majority of the pictures for now.
 
Welcome!

Before you decide to wrestle with the oil pan, check the valve cover, the oil filter adapter, and check for a cracked oil pressure sensor. Looks like a lot of caked oily dirt around the filter adapter. All of these common leaks usually drip off the back of the oil pan. If the back of the block is oily, it's probably the valve cover. Oil all over the starter is usually the oil filter adapter o-rings.

Your heater core isn't hooked. I suspect it was disconnected because it leaks.. The oil pressure sensor looks disconnected in your picture. If it's really low, I'd suggest Rotella T6 5W-40 diesel oil if the pressure seems low. I'm not sure that bare wiring harness along the firewall is normal. I would think it would normally have wire loom over it.
 
Thanks for the reply Lawson. Yeah, I can put some loom over it. The previous owner says he paid someone to get the wiring together because it was a real mess. My car suffers from POS (Previous Owner Syndrome). :skull2:

There is no oil on the starter. The starter looks brand new. So, hard to tell.

I bought a new oil pressure sensor so maybe that will fix it.
 
Oh that poor thing

Pics do work. Good job there. Lots of folks can't seem to get that far.

Being a 2 door I imagine your hinge problem is that the hinges have torn loose of the body. That is a welding issue. You won't be re-hanging those with replacement hinges from the junkyard. There are aftermarket products to help with this repair. Here is an example: https://www.hooliganoffroad.com/products/xj-door-hinge-support

Search around and you will find some threads and a handful of manufacturers of similar pieces to help fix that door hinge problem.

It has taken a while, but I finally got my XJ over a case of POS, and have now adopted a ZJ that is undergoing similar treatment. It is a shame how some folks abuse a vehicle.

Commiefornia is a big state. Depending on where you are there may be some folks who can lend a hand. Might be worth an inquiry in the appropriate chapter section of the forum. Pizza and beer may help.
 
Hey Anak, thanks for the info. I'm in southern California somewhat near the border of Riverside and San Diego Counties (in Riverside county).

Are you a local? I wonder what other forums I should hit up. I'm definitely willing to buy beer, food, etc.

New parts I have coming are: new plugs, wires, coil, distributor, blower motor resistor, oil pan gasket, oil pump, oil pump gasket, valve cover gasket, some bulbs and both O2 sensors.

If those don't cure the misfire then :dunno:
 
I used to be in San Diego, but I escaped several years ago. I am still a member of the SoCal chapter though. There is no chapter where I am now, and I am more likely to participate with SoCal events than with any other chapter, so I am still a SoCal member.

I know of at least one member in Fallbrook. He might be close to you.
 
Well, nice to meet you. I'm Matt and I'm in Hemet. It's about 30 minutes from Menifee or about 40 minutes from Temecula. Probably about 65 minutes from Fallbrook. I'm used to driving at least 45 minutes so 65 minutes isn't bad. Hemet is the only place that is still somewhat affordable for us right now. In a year or two we might move closer to Menifee or Murrieta. Eventually, in five years or so, we will probably move out of Commiefornia.
 
Hemet probably puts you just about in the middle of the SoCal chapter. But not exactly close to anybody.

Still wouldn't hurt to ask.
 
I lost a 4.6 in an Explorer once. PO had changed the oil regularly but apparently drained it while cold. Sludge had built up in the oil pan blocking the screen on the pickup tube.
 
Ok, so I put a new oil sender in and changed the oil to 10w-30 with Lucas Oil Stabilizer (about a quart and a half). Oil pressure started off around 50w. Now, it fluctuates mainly between 40 and 52ish. Oil pressure does go down when fully warmed up at idle to around 32-35.

Does this sound healthy? I have a new oil pump and oil pan gasket.

I also changed out the plugs. the old plugs were...let's just say bad. Massive carbon buildup. She's been running RIIIIIICH. I'll post pics later today.

I also changed out the blower motor resistor. That kick panel is a nightmare. It works but the plug needs to be changed out. It's partially melted. :eek:
 
Back
Top