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JunkYard Alternator Upgrade Renix and HO help!

Rags

NAXJA Forum User
Location
AZ
I have been searching here and on the web for alternator upgrade for the 87 to 90 Renix 4.0, so many articles and alot of conflicting info on a better set up then the cs130 Delco alternator.......... Many articles incomplete, no pics, or just here say for us 87 to 90 Renix owners.....

I am looking to do a sticky write up if my write up is good enough for us Renix people whom have the crappy little Delco Alternator and want to do an inexpensive salvage yard upgrade for our charging systems.....

We all know about rewinds and hot rodding the cs130 with bigger end bearing and case, over drive pulley and so on, but that can get expensive in a hurry......

Alot of good write ups and info on 91 up XJs for salvage yard alternator upgrades, but info overload and flicking to this page, this link this sight and so on.....its nuts! I look at so many threads I forgot how i found it and god forbid how to find it again..... lol ;)

My goal here is for a salvage yard alternator upgrade for the Renix that does not modify the alternator itself in anyway( grinding.cutting) so you can change it on the trail without your roll away tool box and compressor, alternator is easily available,plentiful and inexpensive...and if you decide to get a rebuilt or new one you are not hacking it up that voids the warranty......

So far this is what I have, I have a 1990 Renix, I picked up a 91 to 96? alternator bracket assembly off a 92 XJ and a cs144 altrernator off a Caddy, I looked at 30+ cs144 alternators off different GM vehicles, majority are 12 and 6 oclock mounting ears and some have a third ear around 4 oclock, caddy one is pretty much the same as the 95 5.7 Roadmaster alternator with 2 ears at 12 and 6.........

First thing I noticed is the cs144 alternator will not work with the stock Renix alternator bracket, first is its case size, no room as it hits the unibody lip, even with hacking on the unibody for clearence would end up with to much cutting and fab on the unibody which I would rather avoid, also the Renix alternator bracket postions the alternator lower then the 91 up alternator bracket, between hacking the unibody, brinding the tabs on the CS144 for belt alignment and making an extension bracket set up for the lower ear to mount to the bracket would end up with a hacked up mess..... about the only plus of the cs144 alternator is it would plug right in and charge and work as it has internal regulator like the cs130, even the stock renix plug fits....just all the physical mounting of the cs144 and hacking does not make it friendly for someone whom or does not have the time, skill or tools to make it fit or side of the road /trail alternator replacement in the future if need be...........

Second thing I tried and mocked up is to mount the cs144 on the stock 91/96 alternator bracket...... it is alot closer then the renix alternator bracket/mount to make the cs144 alternator to work, I bolted the renix alternator bracket to the 91 up alternator bracket like a mirror, the mounting points are very very close and on the same plane for the alternator ears , only problem is the 91 up mount is for the nippondenso alternator which uses 2 ears for the main mounting point and the bracket mounting point goes in between the 2 ears where the CS144 uses a one solid mount for the main mount bolt, you could rotate the cs144 so its upside down and put the thin ear up top and the main mount point on the bottom of the bracket opposite of the cs130 alternator, but you would still have to to shorton the alternator mounting points on the bracket itself and on the alternator to get proper belt alignment...... cutting the thickness of the 91 up bracket and cutting the alternator mount points would really make this set up weak....cs144 alternator weighs a good 7 pounds more then the cs130.... hate to have broken stuff far from home........

Also you would have to trim alot off the steel front alternator bracket and grind down the aluminum alternator bracket because of the bigger case size to get alternator as close to the engine as you can to get alternator mounting holes to line up on bracket.....

Grinding the aluminum bracket and trimming the steel bracket would be fine , but still have to hack and grind on the alternator which we want to avoid.....

Also would have to use the cs130 cooling fan blade , pulley and spacer on the cs144, the plastic fan blade is just to large on the cs144 to clear the steel bracket even after you trim it, would be trimmed way to much for cs 144 fan for the bracket to clear and would make to bracket weak...... fan off the cs130 is smaller in diameter, but looks like it would cool the same as the stock plastic cs144 fan and have the benifts of a steel fan that wouldnt break like the plastic one...... have to use the stock cs130 pulley and spacer to get belt aligment closer or the solid overdrive pulley with built in spacer which I have off my cs130 as the cs144 stock pulley I got spaces the belt about 1/4 inch to far out away from alternator..........

Also if you have a trans crossmember drop kit like i do for driveshaft alignment it drops the whole drive train down at a slant and the rear alternator bearing plate/case on my stock cs130 alternator set up rubs the unibody lip under hard load...... so the 91 up alternator bracket is the way to go as it moves the alternator up away from the lip.........

So what i have decided for myself on the Renix 87 to 90 Xj's with 4.0 is to use the 1991 to 1996? alternator brackets off a 4.0 to mount a Nippondenso alternator that was used on so many Chrysler vehicles............

I know would have to use an external voltage regulator, but that would be alot easier then hacking up alternators to make them fit.......... Modding mounting brackets is fine to a point, not hacking alternators is my goal.....

I found a nice kit that uses the tried and true old school Chrysler external voltage regulator and is adjustable voltage with harness kit for $54 bucks..... and would keep some what purist thinking its Chrysler stuff, but Renix Jeeps are not even Chrysler stuff...lol , just dont want to use GM or Ford External regulators, point style or solid state...the old school style Chrysler external regulator will handle quite a bit of amps and handle the heat...... better off with the voltage reg external and not in the alternator anyways from heat...... They make alot of different universal aftermarket external voltage regualtors and kits , but will stick to stuff I know works.

I would like some help on links and write ups from the 91 and up people whom have done the salavge yard Nippon alternator upgrades from Chrysler vehicles so I can put it one write up for us Renix people and 91 to 96 people.

SALVAGE YARD UPGRADES:

Level 1 upgrade for example for Renix 87 to 90 owners:
Highest output cs130 alternator install. and main charge wire upgrade.
OR Swapping guts from the correct cs130 GM high output alternator into Jeep cs130 Alternator housing.


Level 1 upgrade for 91 to 96 owner:
All bolt in with highest output Nippon Alternator and main charge wire upgrade. main fuse upgrade if needed.

Level 2 upgrade for Renix owners 87 to 90:
91 to 96 alternator bracket assembly, largest bolt in Nippondenso alternator with no grinding or modding bracket or alternator.
External Chrysler style Voltage regulator and harness install and main charge wire upgrade.

Level 2 upgrade for 91 up owners:
Bracket mods for largest Nippon Alternator, main fuse upgrade, main charge wire upgrade.

Level 3 upgrade for 87 to 90 Renix owners:
91 to 96 Alternator bracket assembly, bracket mods, largest Nippon alternator after bracket mods, Chrysler style external voltage regualtor, main charge wire upgrade.....

Basic examples above.


So my opinion and conculsion for 1987 to 1990 Jeep Renix owners on a budget like me looking for a larger alternator swap if you have extra load from aux lights etc, or just want more amps is to use a NipponDenso Chrysler alternator and external regulator.........

Installing an external regualtor is alot easier then hacking and modding on the unibody, the alternator itself, grinding the bracket to the point where it might fail, pulley alignment issues, mounting bracket issues or not having the proper fabbing tools just to install a cs144 in stock location with A/C......

Only cs144 benifit I can see is it plugs right in....lol

Well if you got this far, thanks for reading........ ;)

Please send me your Alternator upgrade links and personal opnions..

Anybody whom contrbutes will get credit where it is due........

ps: will get some pics of what I am doing soon......

Thanks!:yelclap:
 
Hmmm.., there are some really good experts on this subject here on NAXJA. Hope they chime-in. That said, I also have a need to upgrade the alternator.

However, I will not attempt to mess around with the low mounted issue, but rather get my alternator up high, i.e., in the place where A/C units usually go. (Don't need no stink'in AC where I live). My exploration into the said modification has been on the shelf of things to do for so long, yet I must re-address it before this winter. For now, I avoid deep muddy holes big time in order to not contaminate the low mount alternator with dirty water/mud debris, etc., as I do not want to replace alternators as a hobby.

Unless I mis-read your intentions, it would seem you are hell bent on a low mount mod. I guess you have, and want to keep your A/C, correct?
 
Yea, I am looking to keep my A/C working, living in the Arizona desert my old soft self has to have A/C, especially crawling around in the 115' degree weather :) 30 years ago none of my vehicles had A/C, I have gotton so where I dont like the heat or can even take it anymore, I dont even venture out on the motorcycle anymore when it's hot..... gotton soft in my old age :dunno:, lived in the desert all my life........:yelclap:
 
Well spent some more time playing and measuring with micrometer and straight edge and compass on the alternator stuff, I figured I already have the used CS144 alternator and it was inexpensive, it looks I can modify and hack on the alternator itself and minimal work to the 91 up alternator bracket to mount the cs144 on the bracket,but still not cut up or grind on the bracket to the point I cannot mount a Nippondenso on the same 91 up bracket later down the road after I pick one at upull and order a Chrysler Style adjusatable voltage reg and harness kit........grabbed the camara, will keep updated....
 
I took the grinder to the CS144 alternator and HO alternator bracket I got from the bone yard, I made the CS144 fit the HO bracket, removed a ton of material off the alternator and bracket to make it fit.........

Then I installed bracket to look how much i needed to grind off block like the Nippondeso 136 amp alternator install, then went to install alternator to get an idea how it will sit.....

I tried every which way but loose, cant even get it close, I eventook the bracket off and cant physically fit the alternator in the spot where its going to go, I have the radiator and mech fan out already for radiator rod out, so alot of room.....CS144 will not fit in the space, it hits the unibody rail......, I could have spent some time and ground more of the alternator case down as the CS144 has one heck of a thick case, but I already defeated the purpose of grinding the crap out of the alternator already to fit the bracket which was ground past the point I didnt want to do..... so to make a long story short, I ruined a used CS144 and an HO alternator bracket........ But the good thing is I know for sure the CS144 is not an easy fit if you want your A/C compressor in the stock location and will end up to butchered for my taste, maybe this will help with all the wondering and here say and vague stuff I have read about cs144 swap in a Renix Jeep with working A/C in stock local......Maybe they make a CS144 with different case or style? I dont know..... I looked at many CS144 alternators at the bone yard. and they all looked to be the same size........

So next go around is going to be a Nippondenso Alternator 117 amp or larger on a 91 to 96 Alternator bracket with a clean external voltage regualtor set up.........

I ran across another thread about using a ZJ 4.0 alternator bracket and YJ 4.0 A/C bracket and it would fit a Nippon 136 amp with no grinding........ I will see if I can find some brackets at the bone yard..... Nippon Alternators are very plentiful as the CS144 are......

I will figure a nice way for us Renix people to have a decent junkyard cheap high output alternator set up!

Or if you have a good CS130, you can hot rod it with the 140 amp IceBerg kit with new housing that supports larger rear bearing that the stock one is prone to failure and alot of other parts for $119.00 + shipping.......
http://store.alternatorparts.com/7140-140amp-cs130-series-iceberg-finned-high-output-alternator-upgrade.aspx
 
You are way over doing this. It's getting confusing with all the back and forth of cs130 ,cs144, nippon, and delco. None of it's worth all the reading. and there still is no bolt on solution. It's still a bunch of stuff hacked up to fit or requires other stuff such as a voltage regulator for 54 bucks. So far your intentions of cheap and easy are not met. I'd rather have my stock one beefed up. It costs about 100 bucks to do. and then it's just bolt in. If I were going to go through all the trouble of hacking brackets and such I would be looking for a better mounting place all together. I'm not trying to bash you so please don't take it that way. But your basically going over the same bs that has been done already. Just face it renix guys are screwed when it comes to alt upgrading.
 
LOL....I agree us Renix guys are screwed...... seems all my typing and carrying on has put me in the realm of all the other incomplete or scatter gory info I have run across here and on google for a cheap junk yard alternator upgrade..... I just wanted to try and see for myself how hacked up such an endeavor would be..... also no offense takin , I know you are not bashing........... Bet you have searched and googled and ran into the same jumbled swap info for the renix....just wanted to put my 2 cents in one place so other people dont waste time and money doin what I did........

Seems best thing for us Renix people is the under $150 stock alternator beef up :)
But my stubborn self will figure out a way for a good junk yard upgrade that dont end up with some huge alternator mounted on tooth picks....... Wont hear a peep out of me about anymore alternator stuff till I have it all done and working...... Then you get the story book with pics ..... :)
 
Yeah.., it all can get confusing, lol, but I, as just another 'screwed' RENIX XJ owner can say I really appreciate all things related to RENIX, and any upgrades 'borrowed' from other more recent models, (...and aftermarket parts), to make the RENIX as best as it can possibly become. Sure, wading through the day-by-day, blow by blow, updated process of an alternator/mounting upgrade can appear to be daunting, even frustrating to some. I think the effort gets an "E" for said effort. Hopefully Rags will remain motivated enough to wade through his efforts, and give a complete detailed A--Z description of the mod., complete with either drawings, and/or photos detailing said.

Me? My alternator upgrade will be a top mount, not a low mount.

However I appreciate the willingness of Rags in volunteering an educational 'treatise' in which to provide a low mount alternator for those who would like to follow through with the method in a similar manner. It is a method that other RENIX owners could have been actively involved with Rags.., if'in had they'd only shown up during this past week to engage into the discussion. Since none did, i.e., those who want to do a similar mod., offer up what they had discovered, other speculations, etc., then.., well it's all a moot point now.., for now.

If Rags does follow up with a 'spot-on' successful proceedure for said mod., I'd want to see it up for a 'sticky'.

I'd also like to see a section of NAXJA dedicated to those specifically interested in the OEM, and Mods. of the ancient XJ, the RENIX! For now, 'googling', or yahoo seem to be the only best ways to connect to fellow RENIX owners who are "screwed". Type RENIX, or renix in the NAXJA search field, and one has a long list, (mostly unrelated to RENIX), too long to sort through. Better, again, to go through the second sentence search as per this paragraph above.

A dwindling family of XJ's? Somehow to keep 'em up, and fit enough to endure for the long haul through the coming mad-max projections... Hmmm...
 
So, you state on your level 1 upgrade for 91-96 get the highest rated Nippon alternator. Well, what is it? Does it require grinding?

Also, is there a similar kit to the Iceberg kit that is for the Nippon alternators?
 
Yah rags did go the distance! A for effort. But as far as I can see there just isn't an easy cheap way to go about alt upgrading. Especially if you keep the ac. Just a shitty design altogether. Jeep f'ed us. They knew what jeep owners do with their vehicles and they still decided to put the power source on the bottom of the vehicle. I have done the power cable upgrade from Kelly (5-90). Made a huge difference. His cables are very well priced and nothing other than QUALITY. I couldn't even make them myself for what he charges. My lights seem more crisp, my radio tunes in better, my blown speakers sound better, and the jeep just feels smooth. I have rebuilt every thing on my jeep these past 2 years and I'm just about to put it back on the road. The cables complemented everything else nicely.
 
Jeep still does stupid crap like this. The jk, their flagship off road vehicle, uses a non-sealed electric fan. My mother in laws fan died after 2 mud holes at hollister. Engineered and designed for off road until the bean counters start pinching pennies. I've found a piece of lexan mounted directly below the alternator works wonders in keeping a few ud holes from taking out the xj alternator.
 
Yah rags did go the distance! A for effort. But as far as I can see there just isn't an easy cheap way to go about alt upgrading. Especially if you keep the ac. Just a shitty design altogether. Jeep f'ed us. They knew what jeep owners do with their vehicles and they still decided to put the power source on the bottom of the vehicle. I have done the power cable upgrade from Kelly (5-90). Made a huge difference. His cables are very well priced and nothing other than QUALITY. I couldn't even make them myself for what he charges. My lights seem more crisp, my radio tunes in better, my blown speakers sound better, and the jeep just feels smooth. I have rebuilt every thing on my jeep these past 2 years and I'm just about to put it back on the road. The cables complemented everything else nicely.

Works really well, doesn't it?

Try this to help your instrument panel and gauges.
Improving the Instrument Panel Ground
The ground point for the complete instrument cluster on your XJ or MJ is located up under the driver’s side dash. If you lay on your back and look up under there with a flashlight, without wearing a hat, you will see a black wire attached to a shiny piece of metal almost directly above the hood release knob. The screw will have either a ¼" or 5/16" head on it.
This ground point is responsible for handling the ground circuit for the following items: Dome lamps, Seatbelt and key warning, trans comfort switch, wiper switch, headlamp switch and delay module, fog lamp switch, cargo lamp switch, all instrument panel grounds and illumination, power windows and door locks, cruise control dump valve, and a few more things.
The problem is that where the ground point is located does not have a good contact with the chassis where the ground should be. The solution is simple.
Make up a jumper wire with #10 gauge wire about 10" long. On one end, crimp on a ¼" round wire terminal. On the other end, crimp on a 3/8" round wire terminal.
Remove the screw from the existing ground wire and attach the small terminal of your jumper so that the original wire and your new jumper share the same attaching point, one over the other.
Look above the driver’s side plastic kick panel just forward of the top of the hood release knob. You will see an 8mm stud there. Attach the large terminal end there with a washer and nut over it tightened securely.
**Special note for Comanche owners: Make your jumper wire 12" long and attach it on the driver’s side kick panel close to the fusebox on the 8mm stud.**
 
Revised 11-29-2011
 
Hello,

The Level upgrades was just a quick example, I think it would be the easiest way to break down an alternator upgrade and what is involved in one thread...... my goal is to have a good and complete thread/sticky to have all the different alternator junk yard upgrades on one thread for 87 to 96 Xj/s...... if you have done a search on Google and here on alternator upgrades it will make your head spin...... and even less incomplete info on a good salvage yard alternator upgrade for us Renix Cherokee owners....But I finally did find a good thread on another forum for Renix Salavge yard upgrade, going to refine it and add it to upgrade info list and give credit to where due........Its hard to compress and say in simple terms on how things are done and I get long winded and scatter brained when I do...... I just want to help out for the next person whom has searched and came across the same things I have and is confused a bit, just want to get it all on one thread and what works and what level you want to choose to hack and grind on stuff ! also to make things easier for people like myself whom is not the best at searching on the internet..........just made me nuts all the different articles and threads........:confused1 Alot of good stuff I have found for sure.... :compwork:, but info overload :)

So, you state on your level 1 upgrade for 91-96 get the highest rated Nippon alternator. Well, what is it? Does it require grinding?

Also, is there a similar kit to the Iceberg kit that is for the Nippon alternators?
 
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