• NAXJA is having its 18th annual March Membership Drive!!!
    Everyone who joins or renews during March will be entered into a drawing!
    More Information - Join/Renew
  • Welcome to the new NAXJA Forum! If your password does not work, please use "Forgot your password?" link on the log-in page. Please feel free to reach out to [email protected] if we can provide any assistance.

Two broken wheel joints...shaft damage?

ghettocruiser

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Norristown, PA
Hey all. Not sure where to put this as there isnt a carnage forum :) Anyway...last night I was goofing around in my 94 and I managed to destroy both front wheel joints at the same time. Snapped them right apart. I have 4.56's and 33" tires so I know where my weak links are. BUT... they are brute force u-joints and I always heard good things about them. And I snapped them both at once...with an open front diff.

My question is... I didnt notice they were broken because all looked normal. I have those aluminum axle tube seals at the end of my axle tubes so it was holding things steady. In fact Im convinced they are the only reason I drove it home without incident. Didnt hear a thing on the ride home. BUt...when I got home I tried 4-wheel drive again just to see what was broken and heard the clunking. Could I have messed up my shafts to the point where just installing new u-joints wont help??? I have spare shafts, but I have to pull them from another jeep, in the snow and cold...

What do you all think?? Anyone else have problems with brute force joints?

Justin
 
You might have had brute-force joints but your axle yoke is the weak point and I'm presuming your talking about a D30.

Running the gears your running and with 33's, what you experienced is not uncommon. Either lay off the right foot or get alloy axles. Even the axles won't be enough if you don't have good eye/foot coordination. You can still blow up your carrier.
 
If the shafts haven't exploded then you won't know if they are still usable until you get them out. If the ujoint cap spins in the yoke of what ever is left then the yoke is egged out and you should replace the shaft. A good visual inspection will tell ya if you can reuse them.
 
So you are saying my axle yolkes will break before the u-joints? I always figured the smaller u-joints that I have were the weak point. Thing is... I wasnt into the skinny pedal that much. I wasnt doing anything extreme. And my eye/foot coordination is fine... I didnt think that being in all snow with an open front carrier would snap both u-joints....
I plan on upgrading my front shafts eventually. OR doing a front 44. But for now, I just need 4-wheel drive for the crappy weather we are getting.

Daffy: Thats pretty much what I figured. Doesnt look like the ears got egged at all. The caps are still firmly in place. Just the cross part of the joint failed. Clean break. They both went in one big pop... I just hope it all makes it to the garage Im using tonight.

I guess Im gonna just pull those other shafts just in case. Keep the ones that are in there now as trail spares. I just dont want to take it apart, then find out I need the other shafts, and have to pull them out at midnight or something.

J.
 
From the Dana 30 FAQ:

Question:

How can I tell which U-joint I have in my 30, and are there upgrades available?

Answer:

There are three common sizes of U-joints in light truck applications: the ¼ ton 260 joint which uses a 1.063” diameter cap, a ½ ton 297/760 joint which uses a 1.188” diameter cap and correspondingly larger trunion (the part that the cap rides on), and the 1 ton 332 joint which is a Dana 60 joint. The 297/760 is a strong and popular upgrade for the 260. All of these are made by Spicer corp. Lately, a slew of aftermarket joints have become available in the 297/760 size. OX, CTM, Jantz, Longfield, etc are all making joints which in one way or another increase the strength of the units. All have benefits and weaknesses, but most replace the needle bearings in the caps with bushings. This allows an increase in trunion diameter and a corresponding increase in strength. The downside is that the joints may see increased wear when driven in a vehicle that does not have hubs that unlock.

These joints should be used in high strength axle shafts such as a Warn or Superior. They can be used in an OEM shaft, but the ears of these shafts are fairly soft, and routinely rip off of shafts when using even OEM 760 joints. If you use these joints in any shaft, you must use a full circle clip to retain the cap. As axleshafts stretch, especially OEM Spicer shafts, they allow the cap to loosen and walk its way around. Eventually the little half-clip that retains them falls out and the joint is expelled from the shaft with extreme prejudice. Running a full-circle clip on an OEM shaft requires some clearancing of the shaft ears to allow room for the clip.

OEM Spicer shafts are like condoms. You use them once and then you flush them. The axleshaft itself rarely survives a U-joint break intact, as the four ears usually collide at a high rate of speed deforming them beyond recognition. Sometimes, though, you may think to yourself “Self, I could get a new joint in there. That Crash guy is off his rocker.” Trust me, the shaft is a goner, as it will usually be stretched and stress fractured. You may be limp it off the trail, but replace it ASAP. This is why I’ve never hesitated welding caps in, they are a permanent installation anyway. Unless you like using your condoms twice.

Two more words on shaft breaks. If you hear the dreaded “Snap, Crackle, Pop”. STOP RIGHT WHERE YOU ARE. If you drive even 5 feet on a broken u-joint, you run the risk of the shafts riding up on each other and popping the ball joints out of their sockets. If you don’t have a spare shaft with you, and you need to move, you may be tempted to pull just the outer shaft out. DON’T DO THIS ON A D-30. The Dana 30 used in TJ’s/XJ’s/ZJ’s/MJ’s/WJ’s is not a full floating axle, that is, the shaft itself plays a role in carrying the weight of the vehicle. With the shaft removed, the bearings will fall apart, leaving you wheel-less.
 
Haha... well I dont want to re-use my condoms... nicely put by the way. Ill be changing the shafts out. Thanks. Im sure that the inner parts of the shafts are intact. And I think those outer axle seal tubes kept the inner part of the axle centered pretty good. It has to make about a mile drive so it should be alright. I really have no choice there. Even to pull the shafts I need to move it. Thanks for the info tho... my main question about re-using those shafts is no longer in question.

J.
 
so you drove home with the shafts binding on each other? with no u-joint in there?

pictureing thatgive makes me cringe...
 
rstarch345 said:
You might have had brute-force joints but your axle yoke is the weak point and I'm presuming your talking about a D30.

actually, i would say the brute force joints are the weak point. the yoke only broke after the joint went

DSC00080.JPG
 
XJ-Ranger: Well when I first checked things out I didnt notice the joints were messed up. I have those seals that go in the end of the axle tubes. Those billet jobs. The shafts were not binding at all. There isnt even any physical damage to the ears...as in gawling of the metal. I realized when I got home and crawled under what broke...and couldnt believe it wasnt even making noise. Drove like it normally does... I guess those seals serve more of a purpose than just keeping water/dirt out. Still... I realize how bad that could have gone. So i gotta milk it out about a mile or so to the garage IM using. Keep the fingers crossed.

Intrepid: Thats what my joints look like. But my shaft ends look brand new.

J
 
WOW, Brute force sounds more like Brute Crap!
I will say this once so please make a note of it... Spicer
accept no substitutes. THe ear on the inner shaft in the pic is bent also.
at the very least I would suggest a new set of TJ shafts with ...... u-joints.
 
Thats not a pic of my breakage... but good observation. I gotta check mine real good once they are out...even tho Im not re-using them. So do you think spicers are better than those brute forces? Ill get them instead if so...

Also, and Im sure a search would yield and answer to this, but whats the deal with TJ shafts? Better u-joints? Stronger?

J
 
Rawbrown said:
WOW, Brute force sounds more like Brute Crap!
I will say this once so please make a note of it... Spicer
accept no substitutes. THe ear on the inner shaft in the pic is bent also.
at the very least I would suggest a new set of TJ shafts with ...... u-joints.

that pic was taken about a year ago. the inner was junked when i got home also. running alloy shafts with longfield joints now.
 
Last edited:
I say TJ but you can also get fronts from a late XJ. TJ is easier to spec, thats all. they have the 760x joint. Thats about it. yes Brute force is not a substitute for the real joints.
or save up and get CrMo shafts with full circle clips and be done with it.
 
Hey guys thanks for the replies. Im going to hit quadratec for some spicers joints. Ill use the brute forces for spares.

In light of this breakage, Im am upgrading to the bigger u-joints now. But I need to get her moving so Ill atleast put the good joints in it. Ill have a decent set of spares after I upgrade then. Thanks again!

J
 
Has it been verified that you don't allready have the larger u-joints?
ghettocruiser said:
Hey guys thanks for the replies. Im going to hit quadratec for some spicers joints. Ill use the brute forces for spares.

In light of this breakage, Im am upgrading to the bigger u-joints now. But I need to get her moving so Ill atleast put the good joints in it. Ill have a decent set of spares after I upgrade then. Thanks again!

J
 
ghettocruiser said:
Im going to hit quadratec for some spicers joints.


I dont know how parts stores are in PA, but here in Cali i can make a 5 minutes trip to Napa to pick up Spicer 760's. I cant imagine that Quadratec's price + shipping + waiting for them would be worth the cost difference...

So, just in case you didn't already know, you can likely find these joints at most local auto stores...

And what were you doing to pop them both @ once? I am guessing you got the front end in the air while on the throttle - popped once you came down?

-jm
 
Hey guys... Well she's fixed. I didnt order them from q-tec... I went and got them. 15 minutes away. And the price difference between the brute forces and the spicers wasnt all that big. The napa by me kinda stinks...I try not to go there if I can help it. And the dealership doesnt stock u-joints... Why the heck doesnt the dealer stock some u-joints?

Anyway...here are some pics of where it broke. Doesnt look like its all the way through, but its just the way I turned it to take a pic.
I will say... those axle tube seals... well worth the money I spent on them. Besides keeping water and crud out, they keep the axle almost perfectly centered. Now...Im not saying I should have driven on those broken joints. But...the seals allowed me to unknowingly drive home from work without so much as a rattle from the front end. I will recommend them to anyone I come across working on a D30. The rubber part where the shaft passes through got alittle stretched out... But after I pumped some grease back in, it still should seal against water until I can get a new set.

The pics...drivers side.

648974_103_full.jpg


648974_104_full.jpg


648974_105_full.jpg


J.
 
Back
Top