Feeler - Replacement Battery Cables...

All -
I've gotten a couple enquiries about making replacement battery cables, and I thought I'd see who all was interested. I may have to order materials for the ones I've got in the pipe now, and if I can order more material when some cash I'm waiting for comes thru, I can get it for a little less.

I haven't priced the Jeepers & Creepers set for a while, but I remember a pair of cables being something like $80 - with Painless in the same area.

I'd like to know who all would be interested, since I already have the tool to crimp these heavy damn lugs and I've made a whole slew of these cables for industrial applications anyhow...

Looks like I'd be best using either #1 or #1/0 cable as a compromise between ampacity and shipping weight (#1 is good for 250A over 50 feet, and #1/0 for 350A over 50 feet - so both are overkill with our starters drawing about 140A @ 13.5VDC last time I checked.) I'll have to finalise prices, but it looks like I'd go for about $1.50/foot (or fraction) + $3 to terminate the #1, and about $1.80/foot (or fraction) or so + $4 to terminate for the #1/0 - this will serve until I can get some standard sizes, and these prices would remain for any "custom" cable lengths needed. Cables would be terminated with industrial copper crimp lugs for 1/2" studs, and marine-style battery terminals would be required (I recommend brass, and I may offer those as well for a nominal fee.)

I would also make custom-length heavy cables for winch applications or for heavy-duty jumper leads, and could also terminate with "Greylocks" upon request. (Greylocks are the heavy-duty battery connectors with the Lexan shell. They are typically grey, but other colours can be had.) For instance, I use 1/0 cable for my jumper leads, they are 50 feet long, and are terminated with a greylock (with a mating greylock under the hood.) Two advantages - 1) you can hook up the clamps and just plug in on your end, 2) it keeps my kids from making off with my jumper leads. I did something similar for my battery charger - same reason. I'd have to check on parts to give a price for jumper cables.

Mainly, I am gaging interest right now - the prices are currently tentative, and are subject to change. Also, how likely and how soon custom jumper prices will surface depends entirely upon interest - but I've found it handy to be able to jump a battery from two parking slots away, and to not have to jockey a K-turn in the breakdown lane on the freeway...

Of course - since everyone so far has asked so nicely, I'd forego my usual colour-coding pattern of using red & black HST for using actual red and black cable. Connections would be ox-garded, crimped, and sealed with HST to match the cable colour.

Availability of colours other than red or black would be by VERY special order (since it has to be ordered in "spool lengths") and would be subject to availability of the jacket colour.

See what you guys started? (You know who you are...)

5-90

I purchased some replacement cables from someone else and am very happy with one exception. The cables do not include the connection between the alt and the power distr. center. This seems like the weakest link. On a 96 btw. How much would you charge just for that?

Since I don't have a 96 handy to look at, I'll need to know:

How thick? (Easy question - what's the biggest alternator that will fit - output-wise?)
How long?
What size studs on the ends?

Since it sounds like the alt-PDC link doesn't have anything to do with the starter, it may not need to be as big as a battery cable. Of course, I need to know a little more before I can answer that question - which is why I have questions of my own. The problem I'm likely to run into with the very large cables is that the holes tend to stay up around 1/2", but that may be workable. I'd have to see waht sort of room there is and what needs doing to fit the lug.

Did you get your book? I never heard back from you, and I was wondering how long it took to get there...

5-90

Yes, I did get my book and its great. I'm looking forward to non-naturally aspirated add-on sections. I was on my honeymoon, thats why I didn't respond.

I've been looking into making a set of battery cables and the one to the main junction. I'd be happy, though, to buy them rather than investing in a crimper and enduring the hassle of gathering all the right parts and making them.
I believe the lugs for the main junction cable would need to be 5/16" and that it would need to be at least 4 gauge.
How soon would you be making these up?

My cable between the ALT and the junction box was about 20" and I used 1/0 gauge with the standard lugs.

Oh - I forgot to mntion, but I'd also offer engine grounding cables (to replace the aluminum braided strap that came from the factory) and other miscellaneous heavy cables to order.

How soon? Depends on when a couple things I'm waiting for come in - hopefully, I'd be able to start doing this in the next couple weeks...

5-90

Depending on the cost, I might be interested. PM me if you do end up making them. Would you be able to make a lead off of one of the terminals so that I could wire in a fuse box for lights and stuff?
Thanks

Sure - secondary leads, extra ground cables, and suchlike can also be made to order - I need the same thing I'd need for any other cable (which would be the length in between ring lug butts, and if it needs to be a different size.) I'd like to stay with one or two wire gages if at all possible (at first, anyhow) which would simplify my supply line considerably. Additional wire sizes beyond #1 or #1/0 would be added if there is enough interest to justify ordering "spool quantities" of 25/50/100/250 feet in that size (to save cutting fees.)

Also, bear in mind that just about any ring for #2 and up will probably be for a 1/2" stud, but I can look around on that as well. I've got them on my marine battery terminals and distribution post - both are 3/8" stud - and they work fine. I just put a washer overtop the lugs for contact insurance... If I had a lathe, I'd make "fill washers" - but I may be able to find something if I look...

5-90

Okeh - I've done some more digging...

Painless sells their kits with #1 or #2 cable, and J&C uses 2/0. I used 2/0 when I did mine because I had some left over from a few other heavy wiring jobs I did.

However, if #1 is good enough for Painless, it's plenty good enough for me (and 2/0 is WILD overkill!)

A little more digging about showed that Warn, Ramsey, and most other winch makers offer their winches with #2 cable for direct hookup, so #1 should be able to support everything including the winch if necessary.

So, here are my thoughts:
Cable Ampacities at 50' OAL:
#2/0 - 400A
#1/0 - 350A
#1 - 250A
#2 - 200A
#4 - 100A

Given that they typical XJ starter is good for about 140-160A when cranking, I think we can take that as a peak load. Unless you get a good shop (like I did,) I seem to recall that the 150-160A range is about tops for a replacement alternator. Therefore, we can figure that 160A is about a practical limit for wiring (I'm assuming, for the moment, that winch makers go into "overage" a little when selecting wiring.)

Therefore, I'd like to know how all of you feel about using #1 cable - since it handily exceeds our figured maxima and is larger than anything OEM (I think the oem cables were about an 8 gage, which doesn't have a listed ampacity on any chart I have handy, but is probably right on the edge and the factory counted on a low duty cycle for cable longevity.) I'm also thinking of using #1 cable for two reasons - 1) Cost (both in terms of material cost for me and final cost for you all,) and 2) Cost (#1 cable is lighter than the other options, and won't clobber you in shipping costs.)

This doesn't change how I'd actually MAKE the cables - I still plan on crimps strong enough for you to use them as winch extensions and sealing them to work underwater!

In fairness (since the lengths will be odd, and I'm planning on custom cables and extensions for things like battery relocation and the like) the prices I gave earlier for #1 cable are going to stand, except I'd charge by the inch (so it would be $0.13/inch + term & seal.) The billable length of the cable would be the distance in between the connector butts, and that would be the measurement specified when you order.

#1 cable is also suitable for jumper leads to 25 feet or so, longer would probably want to be longer (and I'd probably order materials for the first few, with a prepayment required.)

I'd also have to price battery clamps (for jumper leads) before I can offer up some prices, but the cable cost would be as for the gage ordered (the term charges would be different - higher - since it's not just a ring lug anymore. Yes, the per inch charge would be double for the jumpers - two wires.) I've got to dig up a few more info-bits for pricing these, so let me know if you're intersted. The only thing that's up in the air there is the termination.

For other cables (grounding straps, alternator bonding cables, power extension cables, &c.) they would be ordered just like the regular battery cables (with ring termination.) I'm just going to have #1 cable at first, which will work for pretty much anything you'll need.

I can also source 6/3 cable for high-power lighting, but that's going to be an "order item" at first as well (it's not hugely cheap - I'd be letting this stuff out for about $2.25/foot in bulk.) 8/3 can be broken out and terminated like regular primary wire with common hand tools (a staking or crimping tool shaped like a pair of pliers.)

I'll also offer brass battery clamps for those who don't have them or can't find them locally. These would be solid brass, marine style, with the binding post for attaching cables. I've stacked something like six leads on one of these (carefully!) while being able to maintain a good connexion. In practise, I'd limit this to four lugs, which is still plenty. I can also get separate binding posts (brass, with a plastic base and can be bolted or rivetted to sheet metal without "grounding out.") I use this for alternate power distribution - which saves me having to run so many leads onto the battery.

Any questions? I've got two interested - if I get a couple more, I'll order sooner...

5-90

I just bought a 6 foot length of 2/0 that terminates with a 3/8" lug on one end and 5/16" on the other. It is longer/beefier than I need, but it was too cheap to pass up.

So...large AWG / smaller dia lugs are out there.

I have typically used 1 or 1/0... still way overkill, but a little easier to work with given it's smaller diameter.

I may be interested in a few lengths when you get ready to produce/ship.

OK - found lugs and ordered cables and some battery clips (for jumpers.) I'll get brass clamps as they're needed - they're easy enough for me to find.

I did find a source for lugs with 3/8" eyes, so no fill washers, shims, or other goofy things (I really didn't want to have to do that anyhow...)

Crimp, Ox-Gard, and HST like I said before - I've got most of the stuff on hand or on the way...

I'll use the lengths given to me - the billed cable length is going to be the distance between the barrels of the lugs.

I will need it specified if one of the cables is for the block-to-chassis ground - because that's 3/8" on one end and 1/2" on the other. Pretty much everything else works with 3/8" lugs - but I'll have to check the starter terminals. If need more than a 3/8" hole, I'll ream it out and mark it.

Watch this thread for a price schedule - and I'm just going to have to get around to creating a page for everything I'm doing sooner or later... The prices I put up here earlier weren't set in stone, but should be pretty damn close to what I finally do!

Of course - orders ship when paid, and I accept money orders and I've just opened a PayPal account to [email protected].

Oh - and #1 cable it is! It's my effort to strike a balance between power capacity and shipping rates (and weight, size, and handling,) and I'm happy using #1 cable for my own ends if/when I buy it...

Tom - I'll do yours up first - since you asked first.
Adam - yours will be next.

Who's next?

5-90

Hi there,
I've got a 92 and was wondering what you would charge for a complete set -- main wire, charging wire, and ground wire. I'll have to look under the hood this weekend to see exactly what I need. I bought this Jeep about 8 months ago, and the battery finally died and the cables look pretty bad.

Don't know what year you have, and if the wiring is exactly the same.

Thanks,
Steve

My XJ's are 87/88/89, and I unfortunately don't have access to a 91-96 or a 97-up to look at at the moment. I'd look them up in a battery cable catalogue (like Exide's,) but I note that they tend to go overlong when they spec lengths.

If you can measure your cables, I can use that. If you're going to keep them essentially stock, let me know and I'll record the values for future reference. If you're going to do any sort of "reroute" work with your cables, make sure you let me know - not so I can record the values, but more so I don't! If you want me to make nonstandard cables I can handle that, but I'd like to know they're nonstandard so I don't list them as a "standard" value.

The only cables I can measure directly for OEM length are the RENIX cables - but I'm highly tempted to suspect that the later years are quite close, if not exactly the same...

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