China

Ok I want to shed a little light on some thoughts i have and some reading ive done......See what some of you have to say or contribute.

China..

I have, for a long time been worried or at least concerned about them and the military build up that they have underway..

Yes i know we are powerfull and have lots of everything [relativly]..

They have the worlds largest Standing army.. [conscripted]

Anyways i had just finished the second part of an article in the SOF magazine...

Been reading lots of different sources namely newsmax, Life after the oil crash, from the wilderness, and others.. now some of these are lefty sites and some are righty.. all say the same thing about the eventual conflict over taiwan and
recouces in general..

Quote from Soldier of fortune magazine, Jan 06 volume 31 #1
page 81 the last of the article:

" Richard Fisher, vice president of the International Assessment and Strategy Center, said that in 10 years, the Chinese army has shifted from a defensive force to an advanced military soon capable of operations ranging from space warfare to global non-nuclear cruise-missle strikes. "lets all wake up. The post Cold War peace is over," Mr. Fisher said " We are now in an arms race with a new superpower whose goal is to contain and overtake the United States".

End Quote

ok so i always take everything with a grain of salt but i wanted to start a post for us to talk about China and what it means to our future..

I have alot of thoughts i want to share but need to formulate them and also have to go now anyways so this will be post #1

thanks

aaron

I know a really cute Chinese chick.

aroncull said:

...
Quote from Soldier of fortune magazine, Jan 06 volume 31 #1
page 81 the last of the article:

" Richard Fisher, vice president of the International Assessment and Strategy Center, said that in 10 years, the Chinese army has shifted from a defensive force to an advanced military soon capable of operations ranging from space warfare to global non-nuclear cruise-missle strikes. "lets all wake up. The post Cold War peace is over," Mr. Fisher said " We are now in an arms race with a new superpower whose goal is to contain and overtake the United States".

End Quote

...

Click to expand...

Riiiiight...

We are their single largest customer. It would not even remotely be in their own best interest. Who would pay our bill?

On the contary, get your hands on some of the latest State Department Assesments.

Taiwan, can you say "No Go".

--ron

PS:

No one on this board would let anything happen with China.

Without Harbor Freight, where would you get all of your tools?

--ron

GSequoia said:

I know a really cute Chinese chick.

Click to expand...

<--- worthless without pics!! :laugh3:
(sorry, i had to say it!)


:us:

Captain Ron said:

PS:

No one on this board would let anything happen with China.

Without Harbor Freight, where would you get all of your tools?

--ron

Click to expand...

a sad sad truth, how could i make my poop cage without them.

what are you fishing for?

someone to say they hate chinks?

im not sure i understand your post...

Captain Ron said:

PS:

No one on this board would let anything happen with China.

Without Harbor Freight, where would you get all of your tools?

--ron

Click to expand...

X2 billion scream'im Chinaman

If China does make a move, eastern Russia seems likely. Then maybe into the Caspian sea area, can you say oil? Wouldn't it be a hoot, if Russia applied for membership in NATO.

Ramsey said:

a sad sad truth, how could i make my poop cage without them.

Click to expand...

That's how I did it!

CaptTrev said:

<--- worthless without pics!! :laugh3:
(sorry, i had to say it!)


:us:

Click to expand...

No need for pics. Just go look at a 5' 2x4 and you get the general idea! Thanks God or some mad scientist for his greatest creation...silicone!
BSD

Thai food is much better than chinesse.

red91inWA said:

Thai food is much better than chinesse.

Click to expand...

I wholeheartedly agree.

xj_ranger:

not fishing...
looking for input..
thanks for yours.. LOL

no i am not racist and no i have no personal issue with any certain race...

i stated clearly why i made the post. please do not use this as a means of upping your post count... real discussion, not antics thanks..

so just to be the devils advocate in discussion terms...

we are thier largest customer.... ok but did you also know that they own a great deal of our debt and also own a good deal of our banks notes? that means that we owe them money yes but they actually own a good deal of our money and realestate through bank notes.. there is not many financail reasons that would stop them from going into taiwan.. thay have us over the barrel...


the bottom line here, i believe is the recource base.. and eventual collapse of diplomacy over heating oil and control of oil and the true power it has...
thats when the SHTF, we can like to think that they have no ability to project power and control resources near to them but recently that has changed.

some food for thought:

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/free/ww3/092502_endgame.html


a qoute from a different FTW article:

"China – The Number One priority

There are three reasons why China is the US's number-one geostrategic concern. First, within the next decade China and the United States will be the largest users and competitors for the world's rapidly diminishing oil reserves. Both the US and China will be importing as much as 80-90% of their oil within the next twenty years and together – in order to sustain their economies – will be using as much as 60-70% of all the oil that is produced globally. Second, China vehemently opposed the US invasion of Iraq. Third, the expanding Chinese economy and China's stranglehold on the US trade deficit has placed China in a position to challenge the US for global economic supremacy.

The first SARS case appeared almost at the same time that Western financial institutions were forecasting a record growth in China's gross domestic product of between 7.5 and 7.6 percent. They also appeared just before the US invasion of Iraq which China was opposing. According to Beijing Mayor Dr. Jiang Yangyong, the first case of SARS was reported on March 1, 2003, when an elderly man was admitted to a Beijing military hospital with the disease. At this time China had openly opposed the US invasion of Iraq and the military invasion itself was just eighteen days away.

The outbreak was reportedly covered up in order to avoid any disruption of the Chinese National People's Congress, which began in Beijing on March 5. When the disease began spreading and Chinese officials finally scurried to deal with the virus, the economic cost to mainland China had become devastating -- $2.2 billion according to the Far Eastern Economic Review. SARS also cost Hong Kong an additional $1.7 billion. The first public reports of the SARS virus appeared in press stories on March 19th and 20th. The US invasion of Iraq began on March 19.

Coincidence?

China had been outshining the US in the eyes of the non-aligned world. For the Bush administration, in the middle of America's worst economic downturn in ten years and spending billions on the war against Iraq, the idea of a booming Chinese economy did not sit well. China was also in the final stages of planning its first manned space launch at a time when the United States had lost its second space shuttle due to incompetence. The contrast between an economically vitalized China and a United States caught in the malaise of recession, war, and technological failure could not have been more apparent."


the article is huge and goes on to say that sars will have a major impact on the growth of the chinese economy. Read at you leasure LOL its huge...

ok so i have more research to do.. i will do that after the kids go to sleep...

anyways this is not a racist post of anysort nor am i "fishing" for hate mongering or anything.. just want some discussion...

aaron

Thai food is still better.

red91inWA said:

Thai food is still better.

Click to expand...

What about Korean?

Kalbi and Bulkogi?

Chinese is ancient and Thai is passe'

China is ready to implode. I give them ten years max. Think I'm nuts? I called the fall of the USSR ~10 years out too.

Tender steak with rice with soy sauce and some shrimp. Mmm. That's a good meal.

I don't know what to think about China, though. I'd hate to have to live there, and I hate it for the folks who do.

Your point about Chinese investment in US debt, or securities is interesting. But, rather pointless. The first act after an active war declaration would be siezing absolutely every single penny of Chinese investment in this country. The treasury would also declare any debt owned by them 'null and void'. All US government debt held by a foreign power or resident can be so declared. Only government debt held by US citizens or headquartered corporations cannot have this done to it. Notice I said citizens not residents, even legal aliens can have the same done to them.

Ask Iran how much would they like the 300 plus million sitting in US banks back.

Actually, they do have alot to lose financially. How damaging would be a trade embargo against China? Ask the longshoreman in Long Beach, or workers at the intermodal terminals in Chicago how much Chinese freight they handle.

A conflict with China is a scary, scary concept. The crux of the problem, is that simply we can't kill Chinese troops conscripted or otherwise fast enough to stop them. I sincerly doubt wether the conflict would take place in the US or China. The most likely place will be in Southest Asia.


BTW, I believe Russia, or one of the other former USSR countries have already applied to NATO, and at least one of them has already joined.


EDIT: Bulgaria, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Romania, Slovakia and Slovenia. Joined NATO 2004

Croatia and Macedonia are both in the 'Membership plan' for joining NATO.

From the NATO website concerning Russia:

What is Russia’s status – is it a partner country?

A: Yes. NATO and Russia made a reciprocal commitment to work together to build a stable, secure and undivided continent on the basis of partnership and common interest in 1997.

This commitment was strengthened in May 2002, with the establishment of the NATO-Russia Council, which brings together the 26 NATO Allies and Russia to identify and pursue opportunities for joint action at 27 as equal partners.

OK! great points!!

Very interesting about the new members of NATO...

i do believe that if the lefties in China want taiwan they would get it.. mostly due to our economy and theres being so closly tied to each other...

mutal distruction in a wierd way...
but then again it could go both ways...

i think i am to tired to go on right now i will post later... thanks for the good info..

aaron