Can't decide 6pt cage or roll bar

Can't decide cage or roll bar

I'm trying to decide what to do on this XJ, it's a well-built wheeler & DD (Long Arms, Rock sliders, D44, Detroit, etc on 32's) and I picked up a cage kit (D & C) for cheap. After test fitting the cage, it eats up a lot of interior space in the front of the cab. Head contact seems an obvious concern, add some padding and it get real crowded.

So. . . I'm considering NOT installing the full cage. Just the B-hoop and back. Adding additional triangulation to the B-hoop, and tying it into the upper seatbelt mounts, and rock sliders. And adding some additional triangulation/gussets to the down-supports and C-hoop.

No debate on the advantage of a full cage on a TJ or CJ, where there is significantly more head-room and a rag-top but, on the XJ, it seems I may be more likely to bounce my head against a cage, than the original interior and that kind-of defeats the purpose. . .

I also think it may allow me to cut/sleeve the uprights on the B-hoop and maybe do most of my welding and paint outside the vehicle.

Any thoughts on how much rigidity and protection I'd give up with this plan?

if your just gonna add a b pillar hoop then your wasting money, the b pilliars dont colapse in a roll, its always the a pillars that give in

ROBZ95Xj said:

if your just gonna add a b pillar hoop then your wasting money, the b pilliars dont colapse in a roll, its always the a pillars that give in

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Agreed, if you're gonna skip the a's and halo, it's worthless to put a cage in. All pictures I've seen of severely rolled xjs show collapse of the a's. If you're worried about headroom, remove the headliner before installation to get as close to the roof as possible, and use legit padding, not noodles or pipe insulation (I'm guilty of this).

shmoken875 said:

Agreed, if you're gonna skip the a's and halo, it's worthless to put a cage in. All pictures I've seen of severely rolled xjs show collapse of the a's.

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X2 Every pic of a severly rolled ANYTHING I've seen, the A pillars fold back and sometimes back and sideways, the Bs collapse out or sideways, and the roof comes straight down on the headrests. Check out Gojeeps website. He has pics of his former XJ rolled over. It is truly scary pics at the bottom of the page

If you're going to do it, do it right and put the "A" hoop and spreaders in, and attach it to the a pillars and the roof. If you want to make more room, pull the dash out and place the hoop close to the wind shield, then trim the dash and remount it(lot of work, but it looks nice when finished)

Re: Can't decide cage or roll bar

3XJFamily said:

I'm considering NOT installing the full cage. Just the B-hoop and back.

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I've considered the same thing, for the same reasons.

I understand that a B-hoop won't prevent the worst of the damage in most soft rolls. But the soft rolls (that only crush the A-pillars) won't collapse the roof enough to squish your head.

The pics tb linked to show the kind of roll that'll hurt you, and the kind of damage that a B-hoop would prevent.

In fact, I don't really see what the A-posts would protect. The rig is still totalled, but assuming you wear a seatbelt, your head is back out of the way.

I think the B is enough...

But I've been wrong before.

Robert

I ran a b piller back cage before i steped it up to my 8 point cage. I rolled it twice on that cage, first one cage didnt do anything, but it was a really slow soft roll. The second roll it saved my dome and it keep the Jeep from being totaled.
Id say if your cageing it to keep you alive then b-back is fine. If you know your going to roll it more than one time and want to salvage the XJ then youll have to go full cage.

99xj4x4 said:

I ran a b piller back cage before i steped it up to my 8 point cage. I rolled it twice on that cage, first one cage didnt do anything, but it was a really slow soft roll. The second roll it saved my dome and it keep the Jeep from being totaled.
Id say if your cageing it to keep you alive then b-back is fine. If you know your going to roll it more than one time and want to salvage the XJ then youll have to go full cage.

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I agree here. I've also been thinking about the B-pillar and back cage. When it comes to cars, drag racers and road racers alike both mainly use roll bars that are behind the driver, with door bars up front to protect the side of the driver. The way my Jeep bounces around offroad, I know for a fact I would be smacking my head all the time on a roll cage. I mean, I've hit my head on the side of the ceiling of the Jeep without a cage while offroading.

Seems to me that the way the XJ is setup with so much glass above the body line, the whole roof structure could be vulnerable to bending and flexing in a rollover. I'd rather have at least some sort of cage to prevent it from folding up on me. Yeah, the a-pillar can be crushed, but my head isn't all the way up in the windshield normally, so it shouldn't matter too much. I just want to protect myself and whoever I have in the jeep with me at the time from considerable harm, and I think a B-pillar and back cage would do that just fine.

Re: Can't decide cage or roll bar

WrenchMonkey said:

I've considered the same thing, for the same reasons.

I understand that a B-hoop won't prevent the worst of the damage in most soft rolls. But the soft rolls (that only crush the A-pillars) won't collapse the roof enough to squish your head.

The pics tb linked to show the kind of roll that'll hurt you, and the kind of damage that a B-hoop would prevent.

In fact, I don't really see what the A-posts would protect. The rig is still totalled, but assuming you wear a seatbelt, your head is back out of the way.

I think the B is enough...

But I've been wrong before.

Robert

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We had this discussion at work yesterday after looking at a couple of the kits for my rig. Just wasn't impressed with all the crap clogging up the front... Having flopped mine on the road, I saw the A-pillar shove in 5-6", but my head was nowhere near it. My injury came from the B-pillar moving inward about 4-5" and my left shoulder taking a hit (not serious, just bruising).

99xj4x4 said:

Id say if your cageing it to keep you alive then b-back is fine. If you know your going to roll it more than one time and want to salvage the XJ then youll have to go full cage.

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Right, but even a full cage won't "save" the body. The A pillars will still crush some, the doors still won't open, the windshield will break and not be replaceable.

ie: It may still be 'wheelable, and barely streetable, but certainly not daily-drivable anymore...

Not with anything less than a full (ugly-ass) exo...

Robert

I'm looking at it for protection for the driver and passenger. It is interesting to see with GoJeep that despite the damage, both occupants got out with "only a scratch". I'd also note that in that crash, the B-pillar and A-pillar deformed near the same. A well triangulated B-hoop would have held that B-pillar up, and gave the occupants more room.

I’ve seen the value of a simple B-hoop over and over again in the “old days” with CJ’s = seen people escape injury in highway speed roll-overs because of them, and saw a guy get paralyzed in a Scout because he lacked one. A B-hoop will keep the roof off the headrests. It’s a DD so I don’t intend to drive it as hard as my CJ.

Either way I go, the A-pillar is FUBAR in a roll over taking the XJ out of DD status. Putting in the A-hoop/halo increases the chance for head contact on a hard bounce. Having banged my head riding in a comp buggy the other weekend, I’d like to avoid that experience again . . . I hit my head on the XJ door frame sometimes as-is. Are the people with full cages wearing helmets? I just can’t bring myself to that!

I'd build a B pillar hoop that goes up through the roof to a mini-halo(nothing over the cargo area). Run bars externally down the A pillar, inside the front fenders. Then tie them into the cowl, then the rock rails.

Ronbo said:

I'd build a B pillar hoop that goes up through the roof to a mini-halo(nothing over the cargo area). Run bars externally down the A pillar, inside the front fenders. Then tie them into the cowl, then the rock rails.

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I've already got the internal B-hoop but this has me thinking that putting short stand-offs through the roof would allow for a mini-halo over the cab, and running exo-bars over the A-pillars as you suggested. Worrying a little about leaks and wonder if plates allowing to bolt through the roof might be better.

The cage that I want to do would be similar to Ronbo's idea.
I would do the B and C (and D?) pillars internal and punch through to a roof line halo outside and run the A pillar bars outside, then punch through the fenders just below the level of the hood. (ideas from some of the different cages I've seen on here)

I like the idea of a halo at the level of the rain gutters. I put a big nasty dent in the side/roof of my last XJ when I was off camber and smacked the trunk of a tree with it.

I also worry about hitting my head on an internal cage.