Hello, and help me decide...?

Greetings kids, My name's Paul, I'm 31, live in Eastlake (just south of the U district on lake union) and work at a Machine shop in Redmond (no sidework is not a possibility for me at my shop, though given machine access, I am rather handy)

I've lurked here for awhile on and off throughout my years of in the back of my head wanting an XJ trailrig. I'm finally in a position to make it happen (as a 2nd vehicle to boot!) But i'm a bit torn. Currently I've got 2 appealing possibilities One's a '93 in fairly decent shape with low (145k) miles. THe other a '99 with about the same mileage for about $2k more. I guess the money's not as much of a big deal asmuch as my concerns for howmuch I'll spend getting either to where I want. I know there's no way I'd ever get back what I wind up putting into either of them, but I feel the '99 could possibly net less of a loss in that situation. I've looked into some pre-lifted jeeps, but all seem to be somewhat tattered, and with lift setups that I don't really like or trust somuch.
At anyrate, I know alot of you have been into your xj's and wheeling for awhile, in my situation which way would you go?

-'93 with low miles for it's age, and a fairly known socer-mom history in fairly decent shape save for minor age-related rough-around-the-edges kind of things of which nothing struck me as urgent.

-'99 with high miles for it's age, a less-known history but definately newer and nicer steering's tighter, etc though the seller claims it's got a bad bushing on the front lower control arm link (which I did feel test driving but is fine seeing as a replacement with the lift's going right onto it)

Both are essentially stock vehicles. My plans are for a RE 3.5" superflex lift and likely 32's or maybe 33's for whichever I wind up with. A couple other things would likely happen including some form of lockers a winch and some mild cladding. I'd like to avoid the SYE/driveshaft expense if possible, but I do understand that it's likely necessary. Planned use is primarily moderate trails. I will be keeping my reliable, fuel efficient mazda for daily driving/commute, but I'd like to be able to pop on the highway with a pile of friends for roadtrips/camping with the XJ. Though I have yet to really be seriously into wheeling by myself (rode with friends before) so who knows where I may go with it. I'm also staying open to the possibility that like many other directions my life has gone, I'll get distracted by something else and windup selling off this new toy. hence the desire to only dump necessary un-recoverable money at it

I suppose I'm also open to other possible rigs if anyone's aware of any, and if it's built well, I wouldn't mind a turnkey rig, though I'd like to make this happen soon and I've got the affore-mentioned 2 essentially ready to go. I'll also likely be getting a small bank loan either on my current car for cash sales, or towards the jeep I buy, so hopefully price should be within spitting distance of NADA listed values.

At anyrate, Hello all, I'm looking forward to getting to know some of you.

Welcome. I'd go with the 93. Parts rigs are cheap. :guitar:

do they both have same drive trains.
if not i would go for the one that has a 4.0l.
if they both dont have a 4.0l i would look somewhere else.
if they both have 4.0l i would go for the one with the np231 transfer case.

the 99 might have the 8.25 with is a tad bit stronger then the d35.

if they are both same drive trains the go for the low milage older 93 and spend the extra money on parts.

Welcome!

The '93 will have the 4.0l HO so you are in the right engine territory. From there you should look at the axles and see if one is already equipped with something better thant he Dana 30 / 35 that is most common. Beyond that is up to your own taste. I would trend towards the '93 just to save some initial cash.

A couple of differences you are going to be looking at are

95' and newer will have the dual diaphram brake booster.

older than 95' you won't have to deal with OBD II

No airbags to mess with on the older one.

I have heard that the new XJ's are more prone to drive line vibration when lifted. (my 94' sits at 4.5" without a SYE)

At pull aparts I have never seen one yet newer than a 98'

Just some food for thought.

I bought by current rig for my wife,a 94' "mechanics special" with some electrical issues for under 2 grand with 145,000 on the odometer and have probly invested twice what it will ever be worth. But I love my XJ bar none :loveu:

Some food for thought:
1. The 93 is a good engine/driveline combo with the exception of the D35 rear axle so you will want to swap that out ($200 or so for a 8.25 wich is capable of your plans for 33's locked). It might be able to get away without the SYE, but it is a good upgrade anyway ($200 with a PORC and junkyard front DS)

2. The 99 has a better rear axle but a low pinion front D30 (still fine for what you want but a slight disadvantage. It will need the SYE so you are in the same ball park as the 93 cost and effort.

I don't know what you are thinking of spending but I have found recently some VERY nice, original 98+ with VERY low miles (100K) for less than $2500-$3000. the 98 is probably the best platform to start with if you want the newer body style.

Either way, I wouldn't be taking a loan out for anything!!

Personally for a trail rig I would go with the older Jeep (get one original) and plan on doing all of the work yourself as you find the part at the right cost. There are more parts rigs around and easier to get cheaper parts.

Michael

99 was the last year they used the high pinion D30.

Oh yes, they're both 4.0's with D35's (I believe the ABS on the 99's puts them back to dana's? Fairly sure both are the 231's (same shift pattern no fulltime 4hi on either) I'm fairly certain I'll not go bigger than 33's, but if I start getting any kind of serious my venture into locking will likely involve a stouter rear end anywhich way.

Thanks for the input guys, I have been mostly leaning towards the '93 I s'pose... Either way I'd likely feel alot better chopping up it's fenders... I have seen that reportedly pre-96 is better for the Slip yoke driveline issues, but if $200 is all it'll really take (I wasn't aware of the junkyard DS possibility) then I'll probobally just do it to nip that potential issue in the bud anyway... I've done a decent bit of research as far as what I'm getting into, etc, but I lack the actual hands-on experience that I hope to be gaining REALLY soon. As far as my available facilities, I've got friends with garages and tools over in Yakima who owe me favors form helping with their lifts on Toyotas and Nissans and was planning on tackling at least my initial round of things that way. I AM a city kid now, and have fairly limited space at home unfortunately (I do have a private parking space in my alley with a nearby electrical outlet at least but that's it)

newer bodystyle admittedly does have a bit of appeal, but who am I kidding it's not supposed to stay all THAT pretty. The 98 I was looking at was higher mileage and 3.5k, perhaps I should comb a little harder if I opt for that route... The only real sellingpoints for a newer one at this point's the possible 8.25 and a bit of pretty/creaturecomforts for roadtripping... The loan bit is primarily just a credit-building exercise seeing as I stupidly paid cash for my NEW car a couple years back.

Also, Are there any local RE dealers worth giving business to I should look to before just finding a good deal online? I know some of the forum sponsor vendors give deals and I plan to check with them as well.

Another question for locals, are there many trails around here involving anything that's going to really make me yearn for a more aggressive setup than 4" of lift and likely 33's? I'm generally of the LCG kinda camp when it comes to offroad, I've ridden with alot of friends in scary tippy high-rigs on trails where it seems more careful line choice would get the job done just as well and less height would be hugely beneficial as far as sidehill pucker factor is concerned. Perhaps if I just commit to accepting that I'm doing the SYE, the RE 4.5" superflex might be in order, but again, I don't want to go TOO high, and as long as I clear 33's alright, I presume that should keep me pretty happy.

Welcome, Paul. Since there will essentially be no resale value to either rig once you're done building/wheeling them, go with the '93. '91-'94 are considered the best of the early XJ years, the only weak link being the rear D35. If you plan on 33" tires and a rear locker, swap that out for a Chrysler 8.25" or Ford 8.8". Both can be had cheap and are pretty easy swaps. In addition to smaller purchase price, on the older rig you'll be less worried about little trail mishaps, which will happen. Since you've already admitted you don't plan on keeping it forever, save some coin and buy/build the '93. There is tons of advice and ideas here about which suspension, lockers, tires, bumpers, etc would be best suited to what you want to do with it, so once you've purchased the XJ, get comfortable with the search function and post up questions as they arise. Good luck, hope to see you on the trail at some point.

Doug

you know how it is, Opinions are like A-holes and no one wants to hear yours... but hear it is.

I would go with the 99.

It has the high pinion Reverse Rotation D30. ( I read some earlier could have the TJ style) Could have a 8.25.
Wiring is said to be simpler, in some documentation I have read
The unibody was strengthened in 94
I believe the Alternator and other components were also improved.

Go with the 99.

I just bought a 97 in Sep 08 and have added old man emu lift 5" garvin rack. still plan on lockers winch and bumper ect. I love my 97 it has a high pinion 30 in front 8.25 rear end 231 transfer case. if it has abs pass it up. I like the newer body style better. just because its the last of the cherokees and i think its stonger body and axels. and i like the fact that my wife drives it and it has air bags makes her feel safer. Just my dumb opinion though HastaHasta

I vote the 93 based on the same theories of other posts here.

I thought that my 3.5 lift came with the SYE.
To be safe, budget extra to cover the cost of the Driveshaft and SYE, whether you need them or not.

If I were to do it again? I would go to the 4.5" especially if you have the intentions of 33's. My wife would have bitched more, but it would not have been as bad as a 5.5" on the Bitching Scale.

^What he said as far as tires go. You'll be putting meats under there that are too big for the wheel wells. You'll need to go AT LEAST 4.5" to accommodate the 33"s.

The '99 is what I have. Its got the creature comforts and safety features already. Feels less like a shell and more like a tank. I used to have an '86 and when I drove the '99 for the first time...boy let me tell you. I was in love. Plus I love the styling more than the older style. As far as parts go, check out here and jeepforum.com for the part out sales.

Ya, what he said.

We can look through and find threads about 32's and trimming away until they fit. BUT, opinions aside, we need more clearance on NW Trails to deal with the Rocks, Roots, and Stumps.

Wow, thanks for all the replies guys.

So I picked up the '93 last night. It's in WAY nice shape, actually better than the newer ones I was looking at. I decided definately to start with a stock non-abused platform, thatway as I build I get to grow that intimate knowledge of what's underneath me. Not to mention being a machinist, I'm kinda picky and I like to know things are done not only right, but right according to my way...

as far as lift, I am now sorta leaning towards the 4.5" RE, or perhaps the 4" DPGoffroad RE hybrid kit. I was initially shooting for smaller tires, but as long as I'm at it, I may as well just do it right from the start.

Thanks again, hope to see you on the trails soon...

Yamayama said:

as long as I'm at it, I may as well just do it right from the start.

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Excellent attitude to take. Learn as much as you can, spend as much on the best stuff as you can afford, and build the best rig you can from the get-go. You'll never regret building it up this way. Most of us here have done some version of the "it's good enough for now" build, and you only end up spending money twice on stuff you could have done right the first time.

RE makes pretty universally regarded excellent suspension products, that's a very good place to start.

Yamayama said:

...as long as I'm at it, I may as well just do it right from the start.

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That will save you a bunch of money over the long haul. I would go RE, it's just hard to beat. As to a rear axle, the 96+ Explorer 8.8 would be ideal (disc brakes) but an 8.25 would be just fine for 33's. BTW, I think you made the right choice on rigs...I've had both a '94 and a '98...I have to admit to kind of missing the old one. See you on the trail.

-----Matt-----

IXNAYXJ said:

That will save you a bunch of money over the long haul. I would go RE, it's just hard to beat. As to a rear axle, the 96+ Explorer 8.8 would be ideal (disc brakes) but an 8.25 would be just fine for 33's. BTW, I think you made the right choice on rigs...I've had both a '94 and a '98...I have to admit to kind of missing the old one. See you on the trail.

-----Matt-----

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Do you miss the stick?

WaXJ_Skier said:

Do you miss the stick?

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Yes, most of the time I do. I also prefer the old bodystyle interiors to the new ones.

-----Matt-----

good choice on xj and RE. i think the 4.5 lift with trimming is great 4 33s