ac compressor replacement

Kejtar · Apr 12, 2008

So my ac compressor seized and cooked (kind of spectacual too as there was smoke coming out). Anyways, I have a spare so the big question is can I empty it (if anything is left inside) put new one on and refill myself or should I get an aC shop do it for me?

GrimmJeeper · Apr 13, 2008

if you want to be environmentally sound go to an AC shop, have them evacuate the system, then replace it. you can get the tools and r134a at any auto parts store (NAPA

) to refill the system. it wont kill you to just take the schrader valve out and depressureize the system, it will just kill the rest of us eventually

xjbubba · Apr 13, 2008

Replacing a compressor requires special tools, as well as an understanding of what you're doing. It's not just the compressor you're dealing with, but the whole system. I'm afraid your questione indicates you do not have the basic knowledge to do the job. However, I wouldn't want to discourage your interest in learning all about refrigeration, so, I'd suggest you buy a book or two, or get to the library, and arm yourself with "knowledge". What knowledge you garner from a little study will be beneficial in working with a shop in getting your A/C repaired.
Even if you know what needs to be done, if you're like most of us you probably don't have the necessary vacuum equipment to suck all of the air (and more importantly, moisture) out of the system, prior to re-charging with freon. And if you don't get every last molecule of water vapor out of there, the system won't work correctly.

Kejtar · Apr 13, 2008

xjbubba said:
Replacing a compressor requires special tools, as well as an understanding of what you're doing. It's not just the compressor you're dealing with, but the whole system. I'm afraid your questione indicates you do not have the basic knowledge to do the job. However, I wouldn't want to discourage your interest in learning all about refrigeration, so, I'd suggest you buy a book or two, or get to the library, and arm yourself with "knowledge". What knowledge you garner from a little study will be beneficial in working with a shop in getting your A/C repaired.
Even if you know what needs to be done, if you're like most of us you probably don't have the necessary vacuum equipment to suck all of the air (and more importantly, moisture) out of the system, prior to re-charging with freon. And if you don't get every last molecule of water vapor out of there, the system won't work correctly.

OK, I have to say this that this is a first I think on this board: someone recommending to another XJ'er to go buy books or go to a library..... A simple answer of: you need to vacuum empty the system (I knew that, just didn't think of it.... so a reminder was been nice) before refilling would have sufficed.

So if you have the knowledge.. share it..... don't send me to a libray. Tell me there was a post that covers it (got no problem to run another search) and maybe offer a hint on a keyword to try.. but library?

xjjk · Apr 13, 2008

get a set of manifold gauges, and an electric vac pump. open both manifold valves. Vac system down for at least 30 mins, 45 according to some of the books I've read (last night actually). Turn pump off, wait 3-5 mins to see if it holds vacuum. (do this after putting the new compressor on and flushing the system (a new compressor will require flush to not void the warranty).
after you vac down, close manifold valves. remove vacuum pump. start motor, ac on high, attach r134 recharge to LOW PRESSURE SIDE and open the manifold on same side. empty can, repeat. gauge should match the specs on the can instructions (40psi low side?). close manifold. remove from vehicle, let it cycle for 10 mins to circulate.
I'm no ac pro and I've only done this twice, so if I miss a step or two don't hold me to it. The high pressure side is dangerous so be careful not to open it up when not evacuating the system. Finding some writeups on autoacforum or similar won't hurt either since I don't 100% trust my advice here.

Kejtar · Apr 13, 2008

bassthumb said:
get a set of manifold gauges, and an electric vac pump. open both manifold valves.

You know where I Can get the vac pump?
do this after putting the new compressor on and flushing the system (a new compressor will require flush to not void the warranty.
[/quote]
Well it's not new new.... it comes from my 98 that I rolled couple years back.. Do I still need to flush it? What do I flush it with?

Saudade · Apr 13, 2008

Kejtar. I'm going through the same thing on my '88 right now.

You can get an air compressor operated (venturi) type vacuum pump from Harbor Freight on GoldenWest and McFadden

If your systems not already discharged, technically, you'd be violating federal law by discharging into the atmosphere. (Hey, I'm just the messenger)

Since my compressor seized, I'll get the system flushed at an ac shop to make sure no junk from the compressor remains and it get's rid of the old oil. I may switch to r-134a at this time. I'm trying to get to the pickapart on Beach later today.

This website has a lot of get info on auto AC, plus parts and a great forum as well.

http://www.ackits.com/

(BTW: I'm in Huntington Beach. )

xjbubba · Apr 13, 2008

Kejtar, I was not trying to be crass--I just know that the correct procedure to open up an A/C system is complex, and obviously you haven't a clue. You are going to create more problems than you are going to correct.
Why do I want to write a book here, to enlighten you. After all, I spent numerous hours researching the subject, and I get the feeling all you want is a quick answere.
Again, refrigeration systems are critical when it comes to major repairs.
The flushing procedure alone, is a lengthy subject.
In addition to what Bassthumb said, you also need to change the filter/dryer any time you open up the system.
Compressor MFGs wont warranty their pumps unless you flush the system, because if your replacing a failed pump there is a high probability that the whole system is contaminated from the pumps demise.
I suggest you have a professional repair your A/C, or you spend the necessary time researching the refrigeration repair and care.

Kejtar · Apr 13, 2008

Saudade said:
Kejtar. I'm going through the same thing on my '88 right now.

You can get an air compressor operated (venturi) type vacuum pump from Harbor Freight on GoldenWest and McFadden

If your systems not already discharged, technically, you'd be violating federal law by discharging into the atmosphere. (Hey, I'm just the messenger)

I believe my system vented when the compressor went kaplooi

http://www.ackits.com/

COol! thanks.

Kejtar · Apr 13, 2008

xjbubba said:
Kejtar, I was not trying to be crass--I just know that the correct procedure to open up an A/C system is complex, and obviously you haven't a clue. You are going to create more problems than you are going to correct.
Why do I want to write a book here, to enlighten you. After all, I spent numerous hours researching the subject, and I get the feeling all you want is a quick answere.

I'm sorry, but you are really not helpful... If this site was about go learn yourself someplace else or go take it to a shop we'd never become what we became.

Again, refrigeration systems are critical when it comes to major repairs.
The flushing procedure alone, is a lengthy subject.

Then enlighten me! I don't need a step by step instructions. General direction is fine and I will have no problem learning as I go along.

In addition to what Bassthumb said, you also need to change the filter/dryer any time you open up the system.

That's good to know.

Compressor MFGs wont warranty their pumps unless you flush the system, because if your replacing a failed pump there is a high probability that the whole system is contaminated from the pumps demise.

I don't have to worry about the warranty cause it's a compressor from the 98 I rolled couple years back.

I suggest you have a professional repair your A/C, or you spend the necessary time researching the refrigeration repair and care.

Ummm... 'k..... Let me put it this way: I have spent time writng things up for folks when I saw a thread I could give an answer to. Heck, this is what NAXJA

is all about. If I knew an answer was someplace on the forums already I'd tell the poster to search and gave him keywords to look for (often which forum I saw the answer to the question, maybe who posted the answer and what phrases to look for.

Heck... if I took the approach you suggest (go seek a professional) I'd never learn to weld, setup gears and so on..... This place is an information/educational exchange. We learn from each other.

Anyways, this part of the discussion probably should be better held either in non-tech or members forum as it clutters my AC compressor replacement thread.......

xjbubba · Apr 13, 2008

Kejtar said:
That's good to know.

I don't have to worry about the warranty cause it's a compressor from the 98 I rolled couple years back.--"

Yes you do have to worry about contamination. That's my point in my advise to you. You don't have an appreciation for the detail work necessary for this repair. You may get lucky, but the again you may just destroy your replacement compressor. My advise to you is just as valid as regurgitating the fine points I've learned from my research/reading/experience.

"Heck... if I took the approach you suggest (go seek a professional) I'd never learn to weld, setup gears and so on..... This place is an information/educational exchange. We learn from each other."

I can guarantee you that most of my posts give detail info on the subject at hand. It's just some subjects require more info to correctly achieve the requestor's purpose.

I never ask for help unless I've spent a reasonable amount of time researching the subject of interest, but can't get satisfactory results in trying to apply that knowledge.

For instance, if you came on here and stated you removed all the auxiliary components from your A/C system, and flushed each according to "XYZ", replaced the TR valve/Orifice tube, replaced the filter/drier, vacuumed down the system for 30-40 Minutes minimum, let set for an hour to test for leaks, replaced lost oil, and recharged, only to have cool air instead of cold, then asked why? I'd be among the first to give you some specific ideas to determine your problem. Why? Because you would have demonstrated an interest in furthering your knowledge, as opposed to having someone "fix it" for you.
An old saying that I subscribe to is: You give a man a fish, you feed him for a day; You teach a man to fish, you feed him for life.

"Anyways, this part of the discussion probably should be better held either in non-tech or members forum as it clutters my AC compressor replacement thread.......

"

So far, your replacement thread is of non-use, with regard to being able to properly replace a compressor. A useful thread would be one that included the example I gave above, which assumes you have the basic subject knowledge upon which to build.

It's my opinion that this Forum is about "learning". Not sure how advising some one to "study" the subject before attempting a particular repair is not being helpful.

You follow Bassthumb's advise without picking up a manual to understand why and how you complete each step, you'll be back on here crying the blues.

xjjk · Apr 14, 2008

fwiw bassthumb's advise included checking out other forums. I've successfully recharged and retrofitted 2 systems using online help, and the compressors that you buy also come with instructions for the do it yourself-er. I guess they don't feel threatened by someone learning how to do someone else's job.
Seems the last time I ran across this attitude was when my furnace went out and I came to a website for help. coincidence? :wave1:

GreenXJ2K · Apr 14, 2008

If its not done right, you're just wasting your money, because you'll be lookinf for a new one or used, either way they're not cheap. The proper guages, vacuum pump, nitrogen tank (for flushing the system), and some R134a, new filter dryer (that big black cylindrical thing by the firewall), a seized compressor wouldn't necessarily mean the system is vented, so you'd need an extra tank to send the old refridgerant into, and a solid understanding of refridgeration would help. All in all its less of a headache if its done by a certified tech, even if you have to dish the cash out now. In the long run you'd be better off.

zluster · Apr 14, 2008

replace the compressor, keep the lines clean when you disconnect them.

Buy or borrow a manifold gauge set, and vacuum pump. Pump the system down and make sure it holds vacumn, get about 2-3 cans of r134a, when you fill the system hold the can upside down so liquid flows in and not gas.

Stop when the low side gets to about 35psi.

dont worry about venting, its r134a which isn't nearly as harmful as r12, and it's Kalifornia, so you get to stick it to the state and their BS over regulation of everything.

Ecomike · Apr 14, 2008

Kejtar said:
So my ac compressor seized and cooked (kind of spectacual too as there was smoke coming out). Anyways, I have a spare so the big question is can I empty it (if anything is left inside) put new one on and refill myself or should I get an aC shop do it for me?

Can you be more specific as to "smoke". Did it blow a refrigerant hose? Did it just smoke the belt? How do you know the compressor is siezed, and that it is not just the external clutch/bearing assy that siezed.

When you pull the old compressor you need to see if it threw any metal trash into the lines as they will clog up the expansion valve...and will fry the next compressor. Also check the condition of the old hoses, especially the high pressure hose for any signs that its time to replace them. If it threw metal into the system I would replace the expansion valve and the filter/dryer with the compressor. I always replace the hoses unless they are already new, especially if it is time to replace the compressor, chances are the hoses died internally and threw trash into the compressor that fried it (if it is truely fried).

You can blow out the old oil and trash with a good mineral spirits solvent using a siphon (for the solvent) air blow gun assy. Remove the expansion valve and the compressor and filter drier and then flush the evaporator and the condenser with the air blown solvent, then just air. Use dry air!!!! You will need to research how much compressor oil to add, and that will depend on whether or not you drain the used compressor of what ever oil it still has. In your case I would drain the compressor, unless it has been sealed all this time as the newer 134a oils are hygroscopic, they suck up water, which you do not want in your system. You must replace the filter dryer if the compressor was internally damaged, or if the refrigerant escaped already.

Try and find a friend that has a real vacuum pump to evacuate the system. They do a much better job than the venturi units do. Harbur Freight frequently puts the R-134a gauge sets on sale for $34.95, hellofadeal! I paid about $150 for my first R-12 gauge set 30 years ago.

This is the forum I use for AC questions:

http://autoacforum.com

Kejtar · Apr 14, 2008

Thanks to all that offered ideas and suggestions

I got cold air now again

Buddy stopped by with his gear and helped me make the swap go smoooth.
Here's the skinny: old compressor seized. Seems the seals up by the shaft melted from heat (heck my belt melted and broke after I parked it on the side of the freeway) and just the gas leaked out (oil was still in the compressor). Oil looked clean. Did the work... and it held pressure. Refilled it and it seems to be holding still :clap:

Thanks Kyung!!!

corbinafly · Apr 14, 2008

Kejtar said:
Thanks to all that offered ideas and suggestions I got cold air now again
Buddy stopped by with his gear and helped me make the swap go smoooth.
Here's the skinny: old compressor seized. Seems the seals up by the shaft melted from heat (heck my belt melted and broke after I parked it on the side of the freeway) and just the gas leaked out (oil was still in the compressor). Oil looked clean. Did the work... and it held pressure. Refilled it and it seems to be holding still :clap:

Thanks Kyung!!!

Anytime!:cheers:

And for those of you who make this sound very difficult must do this for a living and are afraid of losing business or something cause it's really easy. You just have to know what you're doing like I do. I've been doing a/c work for most of my adult life. Not full time but I started when I was a kid helping my dad at jobs.

Blaine B. · Apr 14, 2008

R134 is environmentally friendly. That's why they got rid of the unfriendly R12!

Or at least that's what I told myself as I held the shrader valve down on the low presside side of the A/C.

Ecomike · Apr 14, 2008

zluster said:
get about 2-3 cans of r134a, when you fill the system hold the can upside down so liquid flows in and not gas.

This can only be done with the first can, before you run the compressor. You use the vacuum to suck in oil and refrigerant. However, it is an almost sure fire way to damage the compressor if you let anything but gas get into the low pressure side while the compressor is running.

Venting R-134a is a felony the last time I checked. We do not condone nor advise commiting felonies at NAXJA

the last time I checked.

The proper fill amount and pressures can be a bit tricky. Lets discuss that later, he has a lot to do before then, but it should use a little over 3, 12 oz cans for a complete fill.

If you still have refrigerant in your system (just check the tire, reed (?) valve on the low side), go to a shop that can recover, remove and store the refrigerant.

Ecomike · Apr 14, 2008

:banghead:Both R-12 and R-134a damage the earths ozone layer in the upper atmosphere. That ozone layer is the only thing that protects us from overdozing (litteraly getting fried and having huge epedemic numbers of malignant melanoma skin cancer cases world wide

) on the deadly UV rays in sunlight.

One 12 oz can of R-12 when released to the atmosphere has the ozone damage potential of about 10 cans of R-134a. For this reason, R-134a is only a temporary substitute for R-12, and will itself be phased out and sort of outlawed in about 10 years, IIRC, at which point they should have something ready as a better, or final substitute that is less damaging than R-134a, or does zero damage to the ozone layer.

That said, I have always found the timing of these product changes curious :eyes: since the new stuff seems to arrive in the market under new patents shortly after the old patents expire, and just about the same time they "discover" how and why the old stuff is so bad for us.

Many AC shops will gladly pull the old refrigerant out of your system for you for free (they keep the refrigerant and re-sell it), or for about the cost of new R-134a, they will save it for you and recharge your system once you have completed the repairs.

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