ABS...winter

Ok so driving to school today was great. EXCEPT THAT ABS SUCKS IN THE WINTER. It freaks out under light braking inducing a slide. Is there a simple way to get rid of it for the winter months? Is it legal? My XJ is a 98 so its not Bendix.

Thanks in advance.

Lance

just a guess but couldn't you just pull the ABS relay out, i dont have ABS and all mine does when i lock the breaks up is slide to the right a little and i just found out it sucks today i was driving the company plow truck and i think my jeep would have stoped better than the truck, and haha you had school

well i was just gonna pull the fuse but i think theres two, and i want confirmation on the legality of it and if it would be kosher.

Well if it is illegal you could just tell them that your fuse burnt out lol and i dont see why it would be illegal cuz they make vehicles without it

I pulled the ABS relay on my bro's zj when he blew a wheel sensor, and it the brakes feel much better for it. I didn't bother pulling the fuses but supposedly if you pull both the abs light won't come on. Joe

darjevon said:

I pulled the ABS relay on my bro's zj when he blew a wheel sensor, and it the brakes feel much better for it. I didn't bother pulling the fuses but supposedly if you pull both the abs light won't come on. Joe

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where is the relay located is it just next to the fuses?

If you are sliding with ABS turned on, they you will slide worse with ABS off. Good luck with your plan.

first off, i don't mean anything personal or offensive by this, so please don't take it the wrong way.

ABS is used to help regulate stoping distance for people that just like to hit the brakes when they need to. if you can't drive with a functioning ABS without triggering it, then chances are you could get into real trouble when not having it. or you seriously adjust your driving habits to not having ABS.

personally i prefer NOT having ABS, so i'm in control and can play if i choose to. so if you are absolutely confident, then yes. you can either pull the relay or the fuses. the relay is under the hood and should be labled in the cover over the power distribution block. the fuses should also be labeled.

as far as legality. if you remove the fuse or relay and get in an accident, the insurance company could cause some major problems if they discover that. because you essentially removed a safety component that was factory installed on the vehicle. at that point they might possibly say that if it was functioning the accident could have been avoided and put the fault on you.

if you get in an accident because your sliding it would be your fault anyway, mine isnt to bad in the snow but it does slide just got to remember to pump your brakes lol

I've been lurking on the boards for a while, and don't like to say much unless I know what I'm talking about. I've been engineering ABS systems for about 7 years now, so here you go:

It's perfectly legal for you to remove the ABS fuse as far as I know. Just make sure that when you do it, only the yellow "ABS" light comes on. I'm pretty sure all XJ's use prop valves for rear braking, but if they don't and I'm wrong, the red brake light will come on and I would put the fuse back in or you'll lock the rears prematurely.

Secondly, if you don't like ABS on snow and ice, try it again with the vehicle in 2WD or Full Time if you have the right t-case. ABS, and especially old ABS systems, hate 4-hi lock. It is incredibly difficult to independently control 4 wheels when the fronts are tied to the rear. Seriously, a nightmare. I digress.

Anyway, outside of 4-hi lock, it is my opinion that having ABS for on-road driving is always better than not having it. But like I said, it's your legal choice. And for the non-XJ world, if you have a newer vehicle, just plain never pull the fuse. The systems have gotten WAY better as of late and can detect what surface you are driving on (snow, ice, asphalt, gravel, sand, offroad). Hope that helps, and I'm off my soap box.

You may have already learned this in school already but,
If you want to stop better in snow, shift into neutral when you hit the brakes.
The brakes are meant to stop the wheels, but also have to stop the drivetrain aswell, which the engine will continue to turn while in gear.

Funny said almost the exact same thing a year ago when winter driving was starting up. Yes you won't be able to hit the gas if needed in a short second to correct slide, but if your quick enuf to shift to neutral, shifting back to drive isn't much harder.
Try it and find out.

MSU XJ said:

I've been lurking on the boards for a while, and don't like to say much unless I know what I'm talking about. I've been engineering ABS systems for about 7 years now, so here you go:

It's perfectly legal for you to remove the ABS fuse as far as I know. Just make sure that when you do it, only the yellow "ABS" light comes on. I'm pretty sure all XJ's use prop valves for rear braking, but if they don't and I'm wrong, the red brake light will come on and I would put the fuse back in or you'll lock the rears prematurely.

Secondly, if you don't like ABS on snow and ice, try it again with the vehicle in 2WD or Full Time if you have the right t-case. ABS, and especially old ABS systems, hate 4-hi lock. It is incredibly difficult to independently control 4 wheels when the fronts are tied to the rear. Seriously, a nightmare. I digress.

Anyway, outside of 4-hi lock, it is my opinion that having ABS for on-road driving is always better than not having it. But like I said, it's your legal choice. And for the non-XJ world, if you have a newer vehicle, just plain never pull the fuse. The systems have gotten WAY better as of late and can detect what surface you are driving on (snow, ice, asphalt, gravel, sand, offroad). Hope that helps, and I'm off my soap box.

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I was in 4-hi because i have the NP242. And I think my ABS sensors OVERreact inducing a slide; they should not be going off coming out of a parking lot at 5 mph should they?

scorpio_vette said:

first off, i don't mean anything personal or offensive by this, so please don't take it the wrong way.

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Don't worry :smootch:

scorpio_vette said:

ABS is used to help regulate stoping distance for people that just like to hit the brakes when they need to. if you can't drive with a functioning ABS without triggering it, then chances are you could get into real trouble when not having it. or you seriously adjust your driving habits to not having ABS.

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I think my ABS speed sensors are a little shot. I haven't ever locked up a car before, most likely because they all had ABS, but I don't slam on the pedal when i brake so i don't think it would be an issue. If it is an issue wouldn't locking up the brakes help you stop because the snow will pile up in front of the tires anyway.

scorpio_vette said:

personally i prefer NOT having ABS, so i'm in control and can play if i choose to. so if you are absolutely confident, then yes. you can either pull the relay or the fuses. the relay is under the hood and should be labled in the cover over the power distribution block. the fuses should also be labeled.

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Thanks.

scorpio_vette said:

as far as legality. if you remove the fuse or relay and get in an accident, the insurance company could cause some major problems if they discover that. because you essentially removed a safety component that was factory installed on the vehicle. at that point they might possibly say that if it was functioning the accident could have been avoided and put the fault on you

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Thats what I feared. But I'm only going to pull it when it snows alot. Also couldn't i just throw in a shot relay, which would take all blame off of me?

A couple responses:

Stopping in neutral won't help in anything but a manual as long as there is enough brake torque to lock the wheels.

Locked wheels in snow and gravel is always shorter than an ABS stop. Generally, the spec is that the ABS distance on snow and gravel must be no greater than 120% of the locked stop.

Locked wheels on ice is always LONGER than an ABS stop. The spec is usually ABS distance < 80% of locked wheel on ice.

You are correct that you probably don't want ABS activating at 5mph, especially in 4Hi Lock. Newer vehicles take t-case position into account when considering whether or not to activate ABS.

As with any engineering project, ABS is a giant compromise. We try to get you the best stopping distance we can get while maintaining control of the vehicle. The system on the XJ is not so good by todays standards. I mean, try to use your computer from 1998 to surf the web

ABS sucks, because ABS = D35

I've found ABS to be very frustrating on ice. It works well in just about any other situation, but the old ghetto ABS systems I've had previously just don't know what to do on ice. I'd disable it if it were mine.

P.S. - MSU XJ - my computer was built in '96. AMD 800 MHz with 128 MB RAM running Ubuntu. Works just great .

I haven't read specifically about XJs and ABS, but my understanding is that most modern ABS systems to a self test at around 6-8 m.p.h. after the vehicle is first put into gear. The 5 m.p.h. pulsing may have been that test.

I just checked, and at least for a 2000, the self test occurs at 12 m.p.h.
EDIT:I just saw you have a '98. The self test (which is officially called a "dynamic check") is at 18 m.p.h. on that year. So, I guess that rules out my hypothesis.

well i was playing with in a parking lot and if you slam it down really hard and stiff as far as you can push it, it stop pretty well. I need new front brakes anyway too. I'm not used to having to push it that far so it didn't even occur to me that it wasn't to the floor. But thanks for the info guys. I'll play with it in 2wd as well to see if that helps too.