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ALTERNATOR ISSUE...

D

DIGITRUCK

NAXJA Forum User
Location
NY
'88 XJ REMAN 4.0L & AW4 TRANNY, High Output 170Amp Alternator.

Got my OVERDRIVE ALTERNATOR PULLEY and was prepping my XJ for installing it.

Pulled off the Skid Plate. I hate that thing with the bolts being on the inside not the outside as in some vehicles. Would make it alot easier to remove if the bolts were on the outside. Would it be harmful if I drive it without the Skid Plate?

Sprayed the nuts holding in the Alternator in with WD-40 to loosen them up then sized them up with my sockets for tomorrow.

Well, the BOTTOM BOLT that holds the Alternator in the bracket I found that I could turn it by hand (wtf?). So then I attached the ratchet to the socket and tightened it. Turns out it's STRIPPED!!! So, only the rest of the hardware is keeping it from moving! Is it gonna fly off? lol

1. I've been driving it around like this for several years. Does anyone think I'll have a prob or issue with that BOTTOM BOLT being STRIPPED? IF not, I'll just add my new OVERDRIVE PULLEY and reinstall the ALTERNATOR.

2. Should I put some LOCKTITE on the threads?

3. The POS LEAD looks like #8 or #10 Gauge Wire. I'm gonna replace it with #4 Gauge. Someone mentioned it goes into the PDM. I'd like to know how does it terminate there (hardwired or crimp lug?)

Thx.
 
DIGITRUCK said:
'88 XJ REMAN 4.0L & AW4 TRANNY, High Output 170Amp Alternator.

Got my OVERDRIVE ALTERNATOR PULLEY and was prepping my XJ for installing it.

Pulled off the Skid Plate. I hate that thing with the bolts being on the inside not the outside as in some vehicles. Would make it alot easier to remove if the bolts were on the outside. Would it be harmful if I drive it without the Skid Plate?

Sprayed the nuts holding in the Alternator in with WD-40 to loosen them up then sized them up with my sockets for tomorrow.

Well, the BOTTOM BOLT that holds the Alternator in the bracket I found that I could turn it by hand (wtf?). So then I attached the ratchet to the socket and tightened it. Turns out it's STRIPPED!!! So, only the rest of the hardware is keeping it from moving! Is it gonna fly off? lol

1. I've been driving it around like this for several years. Does anyone think I'll have a prob or issue with that BOTTOM BOLT being STRIPPED? IF not, I'll just add my new OVERDRIVE PULLEY and reinstall the ALTERNATOR.

2. Should I put some LOCKTITE on the threads?

3. The POS LEAD looks like #8 or #10 Gauge Wire. I'm gonna replace it with #4 Gauge. Someone mentioned it goes into the PDM. I'd like to know how does it terminate there (hardwired or crimp lug?)

Thx.
Click to expand...

Junk yard bracket? My son muscle brained mine until it striped. I drilled all the way through, flattened the back a little with a grinder and put a long bolt through there. Been on there for three or four years. I was thinking of drilling and re tapping to the next bigger bolt, but decided I may be trimming a bit too much material away, so decided on the bolt all the way through the bracket. I really didn't want to have to drill out the alternator itself.
The power cable goes up to the starter relay. Simple ring connector, soldering the ring connector would probably be wise. And adding a bigger cable between the starter relay (main power lug) and the battery.
Some of the first XJ's had a cable clamp type setup, but I haven't seen many of those since the beginning of the 87 models.
 
You can drive without the skidplate. Most XJ's didn't have one at all. x2 on drilling and putting a bolt all the way through, or it should be an easy find at the salvage yard. I think the bracket is held to the block with just two bolts.
 
RENIX?

The face bracket is held on with three studs/bolts (I think the screw end goes to the timing cover, with studs overtop to hold the bracket down) and do watch out - one of those is a little goofy in that there's a nut on the back end of the thing. Easy to snap it (I snapped mine years ago, but haven't bothered replacing it...)

As long as you've got solid torque on the two screws that physically hold the alternator, you'll probably be fine. If it's stripped, a Heli-Coil or a Keensert is probably your best bet (just be careful installing it. Had to undo a job like that recently on a steering knuckle. But he's all better now...)

Also, being RENIX, you don't have a PDC. The alternator lead runs up to the screwpost on the start relay (you've got four DIN relays - about 1" cubes - aft of the battery about a foot. In front of those four cubes is a goldish metal box with some push-on terminals and a screwpost - that's the start relay. All of those leads coming off of the screwpost are fusible links.)

OEM alternator lead is 6AWG, making the fuse link 10AWG. I typically replace that with an ANL fuse to match the alternator (OEM would want a 100A fuse - go up as you uprate your alternator. I currently run ANL175 fuses for a 160A and 185A re-wind...)

If you want to save yourself some headache, I do offer kits - click the link in my sig for more... And, if you want to install an uprated alternator and find Mean Green to be spendy, you can get them from the guy I usually do as well - for quite a lot less (they're not 200A as a rule - mine are "specials," but he does some solid uprates. I've been using him for years.)
 
5-90 said:
RENIX?

The face bracket is held on with three studs/bolts (I think the screw end goes to the timing cover, with studs overtop to hold the bracket down) and do watch out - one of those is a little goofy in that there's a nut on the back end of the thing. Easy to snap it (I snapped mine years ago, but haven't bothered replacing it...)

As long as you've got solid torque on the two screws that physically hold the alternator, you'll probably be fine. If it's stripped, a Heli-Coil or a Keensert is probably your best bet (just be careful installing it. Had to undo a job like that recently on a steering knuckle. But he's all better now...)

Also, being RENIX, you don't have a PDC. The alternator lead runs up to the screwpost on the start relay (you've got four DIN relays - about 1" cubes - aft of the battery about a foot. In front of those four cubes is a goldish metal box with some push-on terminals and a screwpost - that's the start relay. All of those leads coming off of the screwpost are fusible links.)

OEM alternator lead is 6AWG, making the fuse link 10AWG. I typically replace that with an ANL fuse to match the alternator (OEM would want a 100A fuse - go up as you uprate your alternator. I currently run ANL175 fuses for a 160A and 185A re-wind...)

If you want to save yourself some headache, I do offer kits - click the link in my sig for more... And, if you want to install an uprated alternator and find Mean Green to be spendy, you can get them from the guy I usually do as well - for quite a lot less (they're not 200A as a rule - mine are "specials," but he does some solid uprates. I've been using him for years.)
Click to expand...

***Yes, she's RENIX. I like your SITE and looks like good quality prod not junk that most mfgs offer. Keep 'em coming!

Additional Q's below:

1. I'm going to run new 4guage pos and neg to battery, alternator, the RENIX "PDC", and add new ground to chassis (supplementing the "silly braid" LOL - 5-90 you crack me up!). Am I missing any leads to be run?

2. Does the Alternator bracket also hold the A/C Compressor or can I remove it w/o taking any other parts off? In the event I can find a junk yard replacement and/or drill thru and use a long bolt and nut.

3. If I drive without the SKID PLATE might there be any vulnerable parts exposed to damage?

4. Speaking of SKID PLATE a few of my bolts are STRIPPED. I drilled thru the two that were accessible and added nut and bolt but there are two bolts that don't have access to the other side. Will a "HELICOIL" or other help?

Thx.
 
Worked on her today...

Spent around two hours trying to remove the top bolt holding the Alternator in the bracket. The bottom bolt as mentioned previously was stripped so I just plucked it out.

The other three nuts attached to the bracket are completely rounded off. I couldn't remove the top bolt (see 1st paragraph) and used alot of PB Blaster on it. Luckily, this is the only bolt NOT rounded off! Gave up and tomorrow's another day.

Well, luckily I had ordered an alternator bracket awhile back but never sized it up until now... yep, it's the same as the stripped one. It came with all the bolts and nuts except for the two bolts that attach to the engine block.

Provided that I can get the one remaining bolt holding the Alternator off, what are the odds of me snapping or shearing the two bolts that attach to the engine block (then reuse them to attach the new used bracket)?

Someone mentioned using heat from like a torch but I only have a propane torch and the nozzle is too short to reach so I can only use PB Blaster etc. to loosen them up.

I'm also doing this on the garage floor on my back. With the Skidplate removed I can squeeze under her and attempt this.

btw - I answered my Q2 from above when I looked at the bracket. The JEEP MECHS that swapped my engine and tranny merely made it work they probably figured I wouldn't be removing the Alternator anytime soon. LOL

Suggestions, Tips, Tricks Greatly Appreciated! Thx.
 
My son muscle brained mine until it striped. Quote

Good comment 8Mud, I've never heard it called that before.
 
DIGITRUCK said:
***Yes, she's RENIX. I like your SITE and looks like good quality prod not junk that most mfgs offer. Keep 'em coming!

Additional Q's below:

1. I'm going to run new 4guage pos and neg to battery, alternator, the RENIX "PDC", and add new ground to chassis (supplementing the "silly braid" LOL - 5-90 you crack me up!). Am I missing any leads to be run?

2. Does the Alternator bracket also hold the A/C Compressor or can I remove it w/o taking any other parts off? In the event I can find a junk yard replacement and/or drill thru and use a long bolt and nut.

3. If I drive without the SKID PLATE might there be any vulnerable parts exposed to damage?

4. Speaking of SKID PLATE a few of my bolts are STRIPPED. I drilled thru the two that were accessible and added nut and bolt but there are two bolts that don't have access to the other side. Will a "HELICOIL" or other help?

Thx.
Click to expand...

That is a "silly" connection - mains connectors should always be sealed against contaminant intrusion.

You may be referring to a "splash guard" rather than a "skid plate" - is it rubber or some other fibrous flexible material? If so, I've removed mine years ago without incident.

The alternator bracket and aircon bracket are not connected, and can be removed independently.

A full listing of standard and optional RENIX mains leads is on my site - if you cover them all, you're good.
 
5-90 said:
That is a "silly" connection - mains connectors should always be sealed against contaminant intrusion.

You may be referring to a "splash guard" rather than a "skid plate" - is it rubber or some other fibrous flexible material? If so, I've removed mine years ago without incident.

The alternator bracket and aircon bracket are not connected, and can be removed independently.

A full listing of standard and optional RENIX mains leads is on my site - if you cover them all, you're good.
Click to expand...

5-90 - Nope, the splash guard was trashed around the time of the engine swap by the Jeep Mech. So, would driving around without the METAL SKID PLATE covering the bottom of the engine be harmful to my XJ?

Update: I managed to get the top bolt off that was holding the alternator in. Must've been the PB Blaster working its way in overnight. Doing the same strategy on the remaining two bolts holding the alternator bracket to the block.

Question, the new, Alternator Overdrive Pulley is 1-11/16" diameter and the stock was 2-1/4". Do you think I'll need a shorter serpentine belt?

Thx.
 
I don't have a belly pan, and I've not had any trouble. Still, once I get the thing built up, I'd like to have a belly pan - but first things first.

Anyhow, the bottom of my engine bay is wide open, and it doesn't cause me any trouble.

As for the pully/belt length, I'm fairly sure you're going to need a belt about an inch to an inch and a half shorter. Do this - put your PS pump about halfway along its adjustment or so, then grab a string (you'll want eight to ten feet.) Run the string in the same routing as the belt, mark where it overlaps, then measure. To be sure, make sure you run the string in the SAME groove on grooved pullies - I'd use the one farthest forward, since it's easiest to reach and check. The string should be near the front of the smooth (idler & water pump) pullies as well - if you use the rearmost groove, then it would go toward the back.

This will probably give you an error of a quarter- to a half-inch, which is acceptable (and why you ran the PS pump to mid-adjustment.) Go to the local and specify a belt with the length you'd got by six ribs. Simplify things by just rounding it to the nearest half-inch before you walk in - some manufacturers go by quarters, but pretty much all of them go by halves. Take a belt within, say, an inch either way (closer is better, but there's a reason I had to you go the middle of the adjustment travel...)
 
5-90,

Great Tip using the String. You Guys are the BEST!

Have a question about the SKID PLATE...

Regarding my SKID PLATE; a few of the threads on the chasis are STRIPPED. I drilled thru the two that were accessible and added nut and bolt but there are two bolts that don't have access to the other side. Will a "HELICOIL" or other help?

How do you use a "HELICOIL"? I've never used one before.

btw - I can imagine the SKID PLATE coming off on the FREEWAY. Might cause a disaster!

Thx.
 
DIGITRUCK said:
5-90,

Great Tip using the String. You Guys are the BEST!

Have a question about the SKID PLATE...

Regarding my SKID PLATE; a few of the threads on the chasis are STRIPPED. I drilled thru the two that were accessible and added nut and bolt but there are two bolts that don't have access to the other side. Will a "HELICOIL" or other help?

How do you use a "HELICOIL"? I've never used one before.

btw - I can imagine the SKID PLATE coming off on the FREEWAY. Might cause a disaster!

Thx.
Click to expand...

Heli-Coil kit will come with instructions, the proper size drill, and the STI (Screw Thread Insert) tap that you'll need. However, a Heli-Coil is going to be useful more for thick sections - plate material, billets, castings, and the like.

You're probably attaching your belly pan to the "frame rails," which are heavy sheet steel. A Heli-Coil or a Keen-Sert is going to be useless there, since you don't have enough material thickness for either to use.

Use an extruded "U-nut" - you should be able to find them at a well-stocked hardware store. They're made from spring steel, will slip over the edge of the sheet, and allow for more thread engagement than you'd get using the sheet itself. And, they don't tend to move about, and the nut (internally threaded part) does a good job of being accessible without having to reach the other side. They won't take too much torque (finger-tight to about 20 pound-feet, I think,) so plan the job accordingly. You can always drill more holes and add more nuts if you think you need to - just don't get silly about it.

You should be able to find "extruded U-nuts" in the hardware or industrial section - if you get a blank look, try asking for "clip nuts." Here's a pic, if you want to print it and take it with you:

palunutmt.jpg
 
5-90 - Thanks for the U-Nut Tip!

Hooray, after several hours of frustration I finally was able to remove the Alt Bracket from the Block and Timing Cover.

Question, So as to not have seized nuts and bolts in the future, I'm going to coat them with an Anti-Seize Compound.

***Do you think the Anti-Seize Compound will interfere with ELECTRICALLY GROUNDING the Alternator to the Block? Also, doesn't the Alternator Ground itself using that Black Plug on the side of the casing?

btw - I'll probably also Ground the Alternator using a separate Ground Lead but I want to see if it'll will do the above first.

Thx.
 
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