Flywheel bolts missing?

So I've always heard this rattle sound at drivethroughs since I got the jeep. Figured it was just the exhaust since it only happened at idle and not all the time. Well its gotten worse lately and really bad (loud) clank at startup. Today I got under my 95 cherokee automatic 4.0L (all stock) and took the inspection cover loose to see if any bolts would fly out at me. Cant find any sitting in the bell housing with the tranny still mounted, but I think a few are missing??? Check my pictures and tell me if I'm wrong...When I turn the crank by hand, if I do it jerky (hard), I can hear that clank sound and pinpoint it to the flexplate area...






Thanks for the help guys! Kinda need to know an answer within a couple hours as I have class at 6 and have to leave here at 4:30. Thanks a lot!

EDIT: I just realized that on an auto the flywheel is called a flexplate.

Well, through further searching I found that there are only 4 bolts holding the TC to the flexplate. ALL of mine were loose to some degree. I tightened them all, and the noise has gone away at startup for the most part. It is now just a faint tick almost like a lifter that is unoiled for a brief second. I used a good screwdriver to wedge btwn the flexplate teeth and the bell housing to keep it still while I got those bolts almost as tight as I could.

faint tick almost like a lifter that is unoiled for a brief second
===========================
Hope you check for cracks in the flywheel. That faint tick could be crack in the wheel opening and closing or it could be a lifter.
I would have replaced the bolts. A lose bolt tends to wear the threads as it slops around. Making it easer to strip or come lose again. A little lock tight will not hurt a thing too.

DEFINITELY use LocTite on those screws!

That small "gang" of three holes was for balancing - there's nothing missing there but material.

Concur that you should check for flexplate cracks - they typically end up happening up near the hub of the flexplate, rather than at the edge, so get your biga** screwdriver back out for checking. Also, get a good, bright flashlight (SureFires are great for this.)

What you end up doing is looking up along the backside of the flexplate, put the screwdriver between the flexplate and the engine block, and GENTLY pry the flexplate away from the block while watching up near the hub. If you have a crack, you'll see it. Check in about six places.

If you need a new flexplate, you'll also want new screws. You can get them OEM, or get them from ARP (I've posted the part number up here before, but I don't have my catalogue handy. The kit I used was actually for a Pontiac, but it had the right number (6) of the right size (1/2"-20 x .590") screws.)

DO NOT use hardware store screws! Not only are they going to be the wrong length and the wrong head height, but "place bolts" are typically used here, which also have a special head design that you won't find at the local Ace. No sense buying trouble, we get enough for free...

I did pry on the flexplate to check for cracks. It barely moved when pried on, all the way around and I didnt see any cracks. The sound isnt a lifter or anything engine related. It really sounds like the exhaust is vibrating on something, but not constant. I would have replaced the bolts, but I had to drive the jeep within a couple of hours. Next day I get some free time and I hear that rattling again, I'll pinpoint it. Hopefully its not from the same area. I watched the rotation of the flexplate while the engine was running and it didnt have any wobble or anything.

Another quick check - check the two nuts at the collector flange. They sometimes come loose and cause varied trouble (you think you have an exhaust leak, you think you have a spark knock, you think you have a tappet knock, you think...)

Should be a 9/16" socket to tighten those up.

I tried to get those loose to drop the exhaust a little to remove the inspection cover and couldnt even budge those nuts. So, I'm sure it isnt those. lol. it's a 13mm isnt it? So far everything on the jeep has been metric when I work on it...

95RedCherokee said:

I tried to get those loose to drop the exhaust a little to remove the inspection cover and couldnt even budge those nuts. So, I'm sure it isnt those. lol. it's a 13mm isnt it? So far everything on the jeep has been metric when I work on it...

Click to expand...

So far, most reports from the field have those being 3/8"-16 studs, which will take a 9/16" socket (or, in a pinch, a 14m/m can also work - but USE A SIX-POINT if you have to cross over between metric and inch sizes!)

yea, definitely 6 point. I only use my 12 point sockets on special things that require them. Had to buy a special socket for my ARP head studs. Talk about a hard socket to find!

95RedCherokee said:

I did pry on the flexplate to check for cracks. It barely moved when pried on, all the way around and I didnt see any cracks. The sound isnt a lifter or anything engine related. It really sounds like the exhaust is vibrating on something, but not constant. I would have replaced the bolts, but I had to drive the jeep within a couple of hours. Next day I get some free time and I hear that rattling again, I'll pinpoint it. Hopefully its not from the same area. I watched the rotation of the flexplate while the engine was running and it didnt have any wobble or anything.

Click to expand...

I get this same sound at idle and will be checking my flex plate today. I will post my results.

I also get the "other exhaust sound" rattle that your talking about on my 95. Mine is coming from inside the Cat, but only after its up to normal temps. Like something is loose inside of it. It passed emisions with flying colors so I'm not going to worry about it for now. When I get around to replacing the exhaust I will throw a new cat on.

Ok found them all loose. Gave them a tightning and everything sounds good. No cracks. Still have the exhaust rattle but I can live with that.

On another note.... man this thing is tempermental. Yesterday when I put the jeep away in the garage everything was running great. I went and removed the cover plate and tightened the flex plate this afternoon. Of course I had to rotate the engine so I used a braker bar on the crank balancer. After startup I had a high idle, and a CEL. Had to remove the + terminal cable from the battery to reset the computer. All I did was turn the crank 2 rev's and this is what happens.

A note for all no matter what you are doing to your Jeep disconnect the battery so you don't give it a reason to loose its mind.

haha. I turned mine at least 5 times total just lookin at it. Did you rotate it clockwise?

BTW: How do you check codes in a Jeep? In a obd-1 honda, there is a jumper plug you can jump that will make the CEL blink for the code...

95RedCherokee said:

haha. I turned mine at least 5 times total just lookin at it. Did you rotate it clockwise?

BTW: How do you check codes in a Jeep? In a obd-1 honda, there is a jumper plug you can jump that will make the CEL blink for the code...

Click to expand...

Turn it either way - just mark where you started (a bit of paint or chalk will serve.) There are four screws through the flexplate to the torque converter.

Depends on what year? 1990 and earlier don't "store" or "throw" codes (except for the 2.8L V6, which is GM OBD-I,) 1991-1995 use the "key trick," and 1996-up sometimes work with a "key trick," but an OBD-II reader is easiest.

I turned it clockwise as you face the engine from the front, or if you will turned it so i was tightning the bolt of the balancer. It reset itself after I disconnected the battery for about 5 min.