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CBD shuts down Truckhaven

karstic

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Milwaukee
Yes turn califonia into a homo haven!

Though thosebig horned sheep are cool and all, if they are dying its their own damned fault.

Those treehugging bastards believe in the teachings of darwin they should know this is natiral selection at its best.


And because everyone hates geroge bush and iraq some greenparty supporting brokeback mountain motherfuger is going to get voted into office and its only going to get worse.


The kangaroo rat is a threatened species. At jv I was working on my crap and eating a little debbie fruit pie. A lil kangaroo rat ran up and started munching on it so I snatched it up.

I forsee jv getting shut down because of that little rodents.
 
I was at Truckhaven this weekend for this event and at this time everything as far as use will probly remain the same except no organized events will be run at this time,CORVA is trying to get TDS to move to Ocitillo.
 
4xSanta said:
I was at Truckhaven this weekend for this event and at this time everything as far as use will probly remain the same except no organized events will be run at this time,CORVA is trying to get TDS to move to Ocitillo.
WTF?
It appears as though CORVA had not gotten thier permit for this weekends event? Thats what I am reading into it. TDS already has thier permit.
I'm interested in finding out more about this one.
Rick
 
That is not correct,CORVA had there permit but at the last minute the tree huggers said they had a problem because of the impact to the sheep so CORVA gave back the permit to avoid a lawsuit.(This was the first permit CORVA had ever got for an event like this,in fact they had the guys from District 37 help them get it because they have lots of experince at this) next time you are going down S22 Rick stop at the microwave tower and out behind the fence you can see the first closed sign posted this week.
 
this is very disturbing. I understand their concern that the people of the salton sea area and the indians also, are usinng that land to its best and most conservitive means. I mean check out how like 75% of the population of the salton sea has left, allowing the great stench and beauty of that area to remain for year more...

in any case this year they can even bring tanks out to protect this area from TDS people, and they better be those f'in abrams and be fast, cause i will be there no matter what law agancy and or orginization says I cant. And be in those crevases. Now if they move it or give me able notice then I will abide by what ever they impose.
 
Where exactly is this at? I ran a wash trail from Ocotillo to the Salton Sea last weekend and had a great time, was looking forward to doing that trip again someday.
 
Read alot more, sure enough thats where I was. I just signed up for CORVA, debating whether I can afford to join CA4WDC this month as well.
 
We need to know a bit more about this one. The transfer of land has been in the works for some time now. There has been concern about 'adding' land to Truckhaven that had not been previously used. There are now areas that have been 'added' that need some research done on. This is good and it shouldn't cause any closures of existing trails. But we all know that is not how CBD works. They want the entire area closed until an EIR is completed.
CORVA probably should have stuck to thier guns and run the event at Truckhaven while making sure that only existing trails were used (like they have always done.) The lawsuit would have (could have?) exposed flaws and maybe helped clear things up. As far as I am concerned that is what we support CORVA for. They are our legal branch. It is thier responcibility to work with legistlators and other law makers to help us win fights like this one.
Lets how how the TDS unfolds.....

Rick
 
Good point, Rick.

The one thing I see that went wrong with this is that the CEQA process wasn't followed with the acquisition of the new lands. If there are areas that need to be protected and are undisturbed, so be it, protect those areas, but at the same time existing trails and routes MUST NOT be closed down.
 
Problem guys, there are no per se "existing trails", just an open area everyone plays in.

The problem I see is even if TDS has a permit the CBD will undoubtadly file another injuction to stop the run at the last minute by filing in some far away place in CA (last one filed in Sacramento) where the judge hasn't seen the area, doesn't know the area or that an organized event has been held there for 44 years (this is the 45th year for the event).

I wish that local monetary impact was part of the equation because there are several businesses that have depended on events like TDS Safari for a long time.
 
MJR said:
I wish that local monetary impact was part of the equation because there are several businesses that have depended on events like TDS Safari for a long time.


WE need to inform the old folk home over there and see what they have to say about this and get them to call in to all those that they know from the last 75-85 yrs.

They depend on us every year! We give them a HUGE sence of accomplishment and worth serving so many people. To those that have been going for the past yrs and yrs and go there every year for thier sun breakfest, see that the same faces every year are nothing but smiles and happiness when that sun rolls around. They dont get that anyother time of the year that I know of.

And yes the other businesses have got to enjoy (even if they are new to ordering for this weekend and take a hour to get an order out) this weekend. I bet that if the Right person ran a market there with a full resturant, that between truckhaven and TDS those two events yield as much revenue as 2 or 3 months typically. Now wheres that enviormental impact assessed or factored in?
 
MJR said:
The problem I see is even if TDS has a permit the CBD will undoubtadly file another injuction to stop the run at the last minute by filing in some far away place in CA (last one filed in Sacramento) where the judge hasn't seen the area, doesn't know the area or that an organized event has been held there for 44 years (this is the 45th year for the event).
One would hope now that CBD has shown its game plan, that TDS and/or Cal4WDA will be stationed in the courthouses ready with an opposition to any motion filed by any greenies at the last minute.
 
karstic said:
If you are not a member of CORVA ......its time to sign up.

It seems they are as much of a problem as the CBD. I don’t know about the jeeper/off-road, OHV thing, but this seems kinda wacky to me.

Per the corva posting;

http://www.corva.org/Latest_Issues/2006/Truckhaven2.html

Off road funds bought the land with OHV Trust funds which seems to be funded by a green sticker that OHVs need to buy.

Per this corva posting;

http://www.corva.org/events/truckhaven12.html

“….attorney has advised us that it is in our best interest to cancel”


Shouldn’t corva lawyer(s) file for mis-use of public trust funds?

What happens if they find something important and close the area forever, is the land to trade? OR is this a new way the anti-OHV people are funding their cause with OHV owners money?

Sorry if this is a stupid posting/question, maybe some of you can explain it. Am I missing something?

Thanks.
 
Franklin said:
It seems they are as much of a problem as the CBD. I don’t know about the jeeper/off-road, OHV thing, but this seems kinda wacky to me.

Per the corva posting;

http://www.corva.org/Latest_Issues/2006/Truckhaven2.html

Off road funds bought the land with OHV Trust funds which seems to be funded by a green sticker that OHVs need to buy.

Per this corva posting;

http://www.corva.org/events/truckhaven12.html

“….attorney has advised us that it is in our best interest to cancel”


Shouldn’t corva lawyer(s) file for mis-use of public trust funds?

What happens if they find something important and close the area forever, is the land to trade? OR is this a new way the anti-OHV people are funding their cause with OHV owners money?

Sorry if this is a stupid posting/question, maybe some of you can explain it. Am I missing something?

Thanks.

I would like to first say that either this really is your first post, and welcome, or your kinda leary (as I would be) of any reprocussions of this very sensitive subject, due to your very good and accurate questions, and made a new profile to remain anonamous..

I would like to say that I believe that with the right team or representation, I would think this issue is not as of a hard fight as its looking like it is going to be.
 
Franklin said:
It seems they are as much of a problem as the CBD.

...

Sorry if this is a stupid posting/question, maybe some of you can explain it. Am I missing something?

Thanks.

I agree. You may be missing the gritty details, but in my opinion, your on the right track.

I've talked to Ed at length. He was/is a regular at our local club meetings. I'm sorry folks, but the basis CORVA operates on is out to lunch. They have an operational mantra that simply won't fly in the court of public scrutiny.

I have never, nor will I ever, give money or assistance of any kind to CORVA. Ed and the leadership have great intentions, no doubt, but fall flat on execution, and simply will never be able to defend the "I used to be able to just ride where ever I wanted" thing.

This TH thing is not the first time CORVA has been on the bleeding edge of involvement in dubious endeavour.

"Ed's road" at Santigo Canyon comes to mind. If you've been a supporter of CORVA in the past 10 years, isn't it nice to know that a ton of effort, money, and resources better used elsewhere went to build a road you'll never use?


RobertK said:
...

in any case this year they can even bring tanks out to protect this area from TDS people, and they better be those f'in abrams and be fast, cause i will be there no matter what law agancy and or orginization says I cant.

...

TDS, ahhh, I'm gonna be real popular after this.

If it were not for the fact that it keeps people with thinking like the quote above away from other areas that would be more damaged by their presence, I would have shut TDS down years ago if it were in my power. It had it's day, but now it's more of a public relations nightmare than anything else. TDS, the poster child for the best undefendable image off roading can present.

I went to a Thanksgiving run with my local club in TH when I first lifted my Jeep. I think Ardis and I were there for all of 5 minutes before we turned around and left. We went over to Hills of the Moon wash in Anza to camp. The situation bordered on extremely dangerous.

I went off road for the first time in Anza, I go there at least once a year, I have done TH many times, and I think it's a great asset. But it's way overused by a great many in a very irresponsible way.

The real bummer about the CBD / CORVA and the enevitable effect on TDS is that all the jackoffs are gonna have to go somewhere else, possibly the places I like to go right now, and drag CORVA with them.

--ron
 
Captain Ron said:
I
If it were not for the fact that it keeps people with thinking like the quote above .

Come on Ron if your going to quote, get it all...
"Now if they move it or give me able notice then I will abide by what ever they impose"

Now to clarify. IF I rent the 350-450$ motor home for TDS weekend and I Do the stuff needed to go out to TDS, to my jeep, and I pack and the day before there are notices that happen to pop up THAT day or the Day before, which would be typically the Day that I am leaving to go to TDS/Truckhaven. Then yes I stand by my Partial quote you posted. Other wise if in the next few days, it is posted that its being moved or canceled, then I will Not spend, what close to 700-800$ in funds to go to TDS and there-for would not go. Big difference.

As for the meat heads that go out to TDS. YES its a mad house. But ANY event you get Over 1500 Registered (who knows how many total) rigs and Over 15,000 people. And you mix in the 2,3 and small 4 wheelers with full sized rigs and you mix in typical Camp fire activities. Well you get TDS type outcomes.

Is it wrong or bad to have this, I have to say no. Can they better regulate it, Hell yes. You hear of this person or that person getting this ticket or that ticket, and of course none of them were doing anything wrong, but the ahole cop just decided to be a jerk, year right. But thats what they need to follow.

I am sorry you dont like TDS Ron, I love it. The largest mix of rigs and the best night activite I ever seen yr to yr. The vast amount of land to just explore and enjoy. Mixed with the ever so popular benders that everyone loves here, and thier crevas activites on sat and sun night/mornings.

I always wondered why you hear about give to this org or that org cause it takes all yrou money you can give to keep our land open. Well I know what a full top gun attorney/firm charges, and what they are capible of. And I just dont get it.. For one surprise canyon? I never followed it but daym how many years is it going to take for a legal team to tell them yes it can be done (opening it) or no it cant be and you are truly wasting your time, efforts and MONEY. A Great or even good attorney can see that within a month or research on most cases, and even on a Huge case it is known within a yr. How many years have they been "fighting" over Surprise canyon?

Ok enough babble out of me.. Just frustration and disappointment is driving me now...
 
Last edited:
Well Ron it looks like you might get your wish

Tierra Del Sol Desert Safari

The Latest on Truckhaven

“A new controversy has reared its ulgy head. We have a meeting with the OHMVD on Wed Jan. 24,2007. Check back to find out if we have to move the Safari. At this time we do not know. Our trail does not go into the Big Horn Sheep area but there are other issues that we need to check on and work out the details.”
 
Okay, maybe someone closer to the situation should chime in here.
Oh wait, that should be me.
Here is the deal. The land was puchased using ORV funds. No inventory of the property was completed prior to the purchase. After the purchase it is required to inventory all parcells for habitat and history (the two R's.)
The question is; Should all the land be closed prior to inventory?
Or should the land be immediately deeded to the ORV park?
There are valid points to both arguements.
But there IS a middle ground.
This is what hopfully will happen;
All areas that have known historical significance (indian ruins etc.) will be closed until inventory is completed. Areas of significant advantage to the Big Horn sheep will be closed until inventory completion. Believe it or not, this is what most of us should be wanting. None of us want to ruin historical sites, non of us should believe that the Big Horns already have enough land to roam in. And it should be noted that the vast majority of what we all call Truckhaven will remain open. Much of the land purchased by the ORV funds are west of our driving areas.
One big problem with this though. It wouldn't take much to convince a judge that all the land be closed until an inventory is completed. And how long could that take? Years? Maybe. I plan on talking with the State Park Superintendant soon. We are friends and he knows my feelings about the subject. The Anza Borrego Foundation is directed also by a friend of mine, although she could only play a minor role in influencing her constituents, it is my hope that I could possibly be included in the process to determine the direction all parties take.
Wish me luck!;)
Rick
 
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