3 row radiator

i'm getting the jeep ready for the florida summer and am wondering where i can find the best deal on a good 3-row radiator. last summer she almost overheated a couple of times and i'm wanting to beef up the cooling system. already put a new 195 degree thermostat in her and have a new water pump sitting on the floor next to me ready to go in.

i found a few 3-rows on ebay for about 135 bucks, but i don't know if i'd trust them.

92 4.0L

The 3-row radiators do have more rows than the 2-row versions but the rows are narrower and the passages are smaller, making them more likely to clog up.
I suggest you go for a Modine 2-row unit. I haven't heard of anyone who hasn't been happy with it.

I got an all-metal three-row radiator from www.radiators.com for about $150 and have been very happy with it (it has been through one FL summer and no overheating problems at all). It was delivered within three days and took two hours to remove the old one and install the new one. Not diffiicult. If you go to their website you will be led to an on-line chat with A.I.to get info on your application. When you do finally talk to a human, tell them you figured out that you were talking to a computer...they gave me a discount when I mentioned that.

I recenly put a 3 row in (radiator barn) and have been satisifed. It still gets to 210 in traffic BUT it cools down much faster than it did before. BUT I do have a LARGE tranny cooler that sits in front of the radiator so I may move it to the factory airbox location with a fan to see if it helps any.

The 2 row modine may indeed be better...but since I just dropped the money I can say I'm satisified with it. On road/offroad no over heating at all.

Theres more to consider than just the number of rows. If the radiators were identical in everyway with the same dimensions for each tube, excep one had 2 and the other 3, then yea, the 3 row would be better.

Aluminum usually cools better than Copper (thats controversial) it also doesn't mean an aluminum radiator is always better than a copper radiator.

The quality of the material and construction can make a radiator perform better.

Like Mentioned, 2 rows that the tubes are 3/4" deep may cool better than 3 rows that the tubes are 1/3" deep. If you have equal total surface area for the tubes, "I WOULD THINK" the one with more tubes would cool better, provided everything else was the same.

I just got a replacement radiator, 1 row for my '95 2.5L XJ. The OEM was 1 row, so I figured I'd be OK. The aluinum radiator I got, was 1 row, but the row had tubes that are 1" deep, while the OEM's single row tubes were barely 1/3" deep, so I think its safe to say this replacement radiator will cool better than the original single row.

I got mine at www.completeradiators.com for $108, remember that was for a 2.5L which is smaller than a 6 cyl. I would guess that you'd get a good radiator like I did for a good price for the 6 cyl as well.

I'm sure there are cheapo 3 row radiators out there that don't cool as well as quality 2 row radiators.

The problem with the 4.0 engine cooling is that it doesnt leave too much thickness available for the various radiators. I have had a 3 row and a 2 row and i can diffentely say the 2 row coolled much more effictively. Think about it in a small confined area would u rather pump liquid thu 2 large tubes or 3 small tubes. With three smaller tubes you run into a few problems. The first being that they are more prone to clogging being smaller and that it takes more air to reach the tubes.

Go with a good quality 2 row radiator thats all metal.

pete

A question:

If the water flow through 3 pieces of pipe that are 2" in diameter is 18.85 gal per minute what is the water flow through 2 pieces of pipe 3" in diameter?

BillyBob said:

A question:

If the water flow through 3 pieces of pipe that are 2" in diameter is 18.85 gal per minute what is the water flow through 2 pieces of pipe 3" in diameter?

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28.27 gallons per minute

But if your 6" deep radiator (minus space between the tubes) was 12" wide, then your core with 2" pipes could have 18 tubes, while the core with 3" pipes could only have 8 tubes. The total flow for the core with 2" tubes would be 113.10 GPM, and the core with 3" tubes would be 113.10 GPM.

BUT, how much fluid you flow doesn't do all your cooling for you, how much heat is transfered from the fluid to the air passing thru the radiator is what achieves your cooling.

The quality of materials and construction will effect the heat transfer as well as flow and surface area for heat transfer.

There is so much more to the actual cooling ability of the radiator than just how many rows are in the core.

EDIT: In the above example, the core with 2" pipes, if it was 6" tall, would have a surface area on the tubes of 678.58 sq.in. while the core with 3" pipes would have a surface area on the tubes of 452.39 sq.in. Which do you think will be more effective at cooling?

BTW, don't take this example to mean that a 3 row radiator will always have more cooling surface area than a 2 row, its very possible to make a 2 row radiator with more cooling surface area than a 3 row.

The quality of materials and construction will effect the heat transfer as well as flow and surface area for heat transfer.

There is so much more to the actual cooling ability of the radiator than just how many rows are in the core.

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So very true....that's part of why you see very little difference in cooling between the 2 row & 3 row radiators. Surface area to dissipate the heat is almost as important as the water flow characteristics. Years ago, you had a choice as to how many fins per inch you could have on your radiator, but that practice seems to have been abandoned.

jeepsrock said:

With three smaller tubes you run into a few problems. The first being that they are more prone to clogging being smaller and that it takes more air to reach the tubes.

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If you use distilled water to mix with your anti-freeze and change your coolant at proper intervals, there will be none to almost no deposits or clogging.

The point is valid, if your worried about clogging up, the smaller tubes are more likely.

More smaller tubes can get you more surface area than less larger tubes, and thus increase the surface area for cooling.

Again, a cheapo 3 row radiator can still have less tubes per row than a good qaulity 2 row radiator and thus less the total surface area is greater on the 2 row.

I picked up a CSF 3-row from DPG a year or so ago. To be honest, the craftsmanship of the 2-row modine that I took out *appeared* to be much better. Of course craftsmanship won't do you jack when the plastic on the end tanks is falling apart.

I did also pick up a Hesco waterpump and thermostat housing, so I don't know how valid the comparison is, but I can probably count the number of times my electric cooling fan has come on in the past year on both hands.

Well, I have to chime in here. I was running a GDI 3-core in my stock 91 4.0 MJ, and it cooled okay. Aux fan kicked on occasionally in hot summer traffic here in AL w. the A/C running, but it never went over 210. Then I put in a new Hesco 4.6 stroker, and it ran hot - aux fan on most all the time, but still around the 210 mark. Since I wanted to protect my investment, and after doing much research, I purchased and installed a new 1-core aluminum 1-3/8" tube rad from here: http://www.alumrad.com/dblpass.html

The average operating temp dropped about 10 degrees immediately, and the aux fan never kicked on the rest of the summer. Now that the stroker is broken in, I am wondering if the aux fan works at all since I haven't heard it. So I'm definitely an aluminum 1-core man, and convinced. These rads are not cheap, about $200 delivered, but it was worth it for my peace of mind. Been running two years now - zero cooling problems.

That aluminum rad. is bad ass, I am going to purchase a new rad. here in the next couple days and after seeing that it is going to be hard not to buy it.

Now I just have to decide whether its worth another 80 bucks. Is there a substantial weight dif.? Compared to the GDI. Enough to substantiate $80?

I am also a big fan of Zerex Racing Super Coolant. I have not had to use it in the XJ since gettin the new radiator, but I have been using it for years in my '56 MGA (a car that is infamous for overheating in warm climates). It works. Lowers my MG's operating temp from 220 to 190. Same type of stuff as Water Wetter (which is available at Advance Auto Parts and probably a lot of other retail parts stores) only the Zerex product doesn't smell badly like the Water Wetter product does. I get the Zerex Super Coolant from www.cooltechnica.com, a website that sells stuff for cooling computers.

Rick Anderson said:

Aluminum usually cools better than Copper (thats controversial) it also doesn't mean an aluminum radiator is always better than a copper radiator.

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Rick, I'm sorry but that's not controversial. It's just plain wrong.

This same topic came up here a couple or three years ago. I researched it pretty thoroughly. The bottom line is that copper is a better conductor of both heat and electricity than aluminum. Aluminum radiators are preferred by racers for the weight saving. If an aluminum radiator actually cools better than a copper radiator of the same size and tube design, I'd like to see it documented.

I don't know which cools better, aluminum or copper, but I don't think that's the issue with the 1-core. The flow is better with the 1-core, both water and air, especially when combined with a hi-flow water pump. Less restrictions, and less prone to clogging. If I had a choice between a copper or aluminum 1-core radiator however, I'd go with the copper, since the weight difference is negligible on an XJ/MJ radiator due to the size. Might last longer too.

Eagle said:

Rick, I'm sorry but that's not controversial. It's just plain wrong.

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I'll take your word for it. If the experience shows that the copper transfers more heat than aluminum for auto radiators, I'm willing to take your word on that, I haven't exactly been keeping up with the issue.

You see the same debate with HeatSinks for computers.

I believe the actual comparison of heat transfer between the two materials;
*Copper conducts heat toward itself a little better
*Aluminum conducts heat away from itself a little better
*Aluminum radiats heat much better than copper though (most of the heat xfer in a radiator is conduction and convection, with radiation being a small part of convection)

After reading this thread I am still not sure what to buy for my 97XJ.

I can go with a $200.00 plastic tank, 2 row modine from Napa.

A 2 or 3 row CSF all metal from radiatorbarn.com for $138 or $178

Or an 1 3/8 tube Aluminum core from http://www.alumrad.com for just under $200.


I think I would prefer to go with the modine but I have found from my searches on this forum that they are no longer as good as they used to be.
So I have been leaning towards the 2 row CSF from radiatorbarn.com.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I would prefer made in the U.S.A.