Torches & Tube Benders - ???

1) Torch.
I'd like to find a small torch kit that is suitable for cutting, brazing, & gas welding. The catch? The kit would have to fit in a toolbox drawer or a middlin-sized box (since it wouldn't get used very often) and it would have to run on propane &/or MAPP gas - in the disposable bottles (since I have those about anyhow.) I've tried Googling this thing, and I'm going nuts trying to sort out the information sites from the useful sites - and the few torches I've spotted I'm still not sure about. I'd use this thing for minor fabrications, projects, and (occasionally) melting aluminum and copper/brass for handling (I get a LOT of scrap metal, and casting it into ingots would save me headaches.) With the pattern of use that I'm anticipating, I'd not consider oxy-acetylene to be practical. Peak temperature? I'd like to hit about 4500-5000*F - but would settle for something that's designed to cut thinnish steel (I'd estimate that 1/4" would be about the lot) and that could melt aluminum and copper alloys - both of which, as I recall, melt somewhere just under 2000*F (I'd just like some working room.)

2) Bender
Here's something else - I'd like to find a tubing bender that will handle from, say, 1/8" - 1" tube (OK, maybe down to 1/16",) can handle tight radii, and won't kink copper. I'd just as soon not have to fill it with sand or something like Wood's metal to bend without kinking, and I'd use this farily occastionally as well - so I'd need it to be small enough that I can bolt/clamp it to the workbench, then put it on a shelf when I'm done. I'd like to see it be as big as, or a little smaller than, a .50BMG ammo can (which is itself about the size of a fairly large lunchbox.) I'd mainly be bending copper with this thing.

I've been Googling both of these without encouranging results. I shall continue to do so, but I figure someone here might have run across something that might fit the bill - so I'm asking. Post here or PM if you know of anything that might work for what I'm thinking of - or if you have any questions about my requirements (but I think I've got them stated fairly well. However, none of you have given any indication of being mind readers - and reading my mind would probably push you down the path to insanity...)

5-90

The B tank I use for plumbing will do that with the correct tips supposedly. I've never used it for anything other than sweating joints ot brazing tho.

Sarge

Yeah - I know what you mean. However, there does exist something like the oxyacetylene hand torches for use with propane/MAPP - oxygen - I've seen them, I just can't find one easily.

You'll need a much finer flame for cutting anything than you'd get from the regular "sweat heads," and a much hotter flame (at or above the melting point for steel alloys) for proper fusion when welding. I've got several BoM heads (single gas,) a BoM "hose head" (standard propane/MAPP - air head on a 3-foot hose) for when I need room, and I've got a two-gas (propane/MAPP - oxygen) head for some uses, but I'm not entirely happy with the latter, and I'd like to find something better. I've seen the "micro-torches" that have the mix knobs on the torch handle like an OA rig - and I like that idea, since the knobe will be more convenient. I'd be really stoked if you could get a cutting head that does a pencil flame and has a fuel cutoff lever (like an OA cutting head) that allows one to go right to an oxygen flame without reaching, but that would be too much to ask for.

Still, I'm curious. Tell me more about your torch, if it's not the regular Bernz-O-Matic job, if you would...

5-90

Sarge most likely has an air/fuel torch generically known as a "turbo torch", with the "B" tank being acetylene. If so they are the best thing ever invented for soldering/brazing since the flame properties (neutral) are perfect for that job. We use them for brazing copper tubing using 15% silver solder. They have several tip sizes depending on the btu requirement. They will melt aluminum easily....I have never tried on purpose to melt any copper. Of note if you get one of these rigs...it is very loud in operation...you must run it wide open or you will kill the torch tip.

As for the oxy/acetylene rig...one handy source is Tractor Supply.

Please re-read - it is currently impractical for me to keep acetylene around! I do have propane and MAPP gas cylinders - that's why I wanted to go with those.

Since I also don't need the 6000+*F temperatures developed by the oxyacetylene rig, this can work. I'd expect that for cutting, brazing, mild welding, and melting purposes, a ceiling of 4000*F should serve well...

I am familiar with oxyacetylene and its uses, I just can't justify the expense of keeping the stuff around for occasional use - while I've got propane/MAPP around all the time...

5-90

Talked to one of the old school plumbers and he says there is an adapter that allows you to run the hoses and tips from the B tank (large) or MC tank (small) which are acetylene (sorry didn't read enough) on a MAPP gas tank. The hoses are typically 12 foot long. There is a pencil flame tip for cutting and another for welding. Like I said tho, this is second hand info...I've never used it.

MudDawg, that's the one. Used it once and almost never touch my little MAPP gas torch any more. Oh and the turbo torch will melt/cut copper. Whoops! I almost never run mine wide open as that tends to burn the tip out faster. Some are quieter than others. Mine is very noisey as it's an antique I was given by my Journeyman cause he felt I was worthy of it. Made me feel good.

Sarge