Full Floater D44 spindle issues (revisited)

Alright..........

a few of ya have been very informative about issues I've had with a simultaneous Warn FF swap combined with ZJ disk brake conversion for my '44....
thank you...

Now....... recapping: apparently warn doesn't make spindles for our limited run D44 with its four axle shaft bolts ANY MORE with their kits; hence I got a TJ D44 spindle to mount onto my axle housing flange. (axle shafts etc are the same apperently)

This requires one hole to be drilled on the housing and one of two options as I see it...

1) drill out/ oval the mounting holes on the axle
2) weld up(maybe) and drill out the holes on the spindle.

Now, around here I've been to two machine shops and have called two well known driveline shops and have run into liability issues concering what I think is the best course of action; OPTION 2. The shops don't want the welding option to weaken the spindle and liability, sue blah blah blah... all of which I DO understand and respect.. and I think opt. 1 sucks as if I do it and F up, what new tubes need to be pressed into place i guess??!! Plus the whole weakening the metal issues.

Any thoughts? Ive seen posts about how a few on here have done what I describe in opt.1 concerning a ZJ disk brake swap and havent heard of any problems... BUT my thinking is that as we all know FF an axle means more stress on the tubes (yes Im going to truss) and with how it mounts having one good hole, two ovaled out holes and two holes drilled next to two prior existing holes with not a whole hell of alot of material to support 1/4 weight of the jeep DOESN'T seem like option 1 is good; and and NOT welding up the holes in opt 2 is the isn't the best bet... hence my worry...

If I havent lost ya yet, anybody got a sugestion or know where I can get a blank spindle besides paying for a machine shop to fab one up??? What is the least invasive procedure in your oppinion and why?

As always, thanks to those who are a hell of alot smarter about this than I.

This is how I'd do it if someone came into my shop. Make plugs for the holes, press them in and then tig them. Then I'd chuck the spindle up in the lathe and make sure the flange is still true, if not (highly unlikely) I'd true it up while still in the lathe. Then I'd take it over to the mill and put in 4 new holes, rotated 45* from the originals. You're talking a good 4-5 hr job. Hope this helps.

Have you checked with a Currie? They are now making a full float kit utilizing F-450 unit bearings, and they may make an adaptor for the XJ44 backing plate flange bolt pattern.

Other than that, I'd follow one tons advice.

what axle is in your truck is it the XJ 44?

yes its an '89 XJ D44... I'll follow up on the curry suggestion ...thanks guys!

Got the spindle figured out...

need help on whether I can find a ROTOR the same dimentions as the swaped in Grand disk setup rear except in a 5 on 5 1/2 flavor. Anyone know if a CJ front or F150 will work or something else I'm not aware of??? Also if anything is close I'm willing to mill the hub hole etc if anyone comes up with a close fit.... thoughts?

Will do a write up as soon as I'm finished with pics, work, etc.

HEP111 said:

Got the spindle figured out...

need help on whether I can find a ROTOR the same dimentions as the swaped in Grand disk setup rear except in a 5 on 5 1/2 flavor. Anyone know if a CJ front or F150 will work or something else I'm not aware of??? Also if anything is close I'm willing to mill the hub hole etc if anyone comes up with a close fit.... thoughts?

Will do a write up as soon as I'm finished with pics, work, etc.

Click to expand...

Do you want vented or non-vented?

I am in mid go at fangling rear disks on my FF kit for the Scout II D44 I will be running. I am using 2 door Sidekick/Tracker front rotors. They fit OVER the WARN hub easily if you are willing to turn down the WARN hub a touch. There is a lip on the inside of the rotor hat that interferes otherwise (~1/32").

For vented try 4 door Tracker/Sidekick 1.6 liter (i.e. non-Sport) rotors.

Samurai will also work (non-vented) but the lug holes will need to be opened a touch. Not something that makes it an appropriate field serviceable item IMO. I am very "anti" having to machine any parts for field replacement so my build is focused that way.

These will not work with the Grand e-brake. I am using 1998 Maxima calipers with in piston actuators for the e-brake. Other options for the vented style caliper is ~1995 Mustang GT parts. The ebrake is also in piston. Also look at late model (~1998) Pontiac Firebird calipers.

The Max caliper is pricey but "stupid simple" to hook up the ebrake cables to and it is also a substantial peice of metal for "jap scrap". It should dissipate heat nicely. If I was starting over I'd probably take a closer look at the Firebird (GM Metric) calipers and TracKick vented rotors.

I haven't built a caliper bracket or done the final fit up of this stuff yet so take the above recommendations with a pinch of skepticism.

HTH

i have a spare 44 and parts laying around, and ive argued with a bunch of people, so when i have some free time im going to make a FF44 out of front end parts......

Thanks for the info guys.

Root Moose~

Sorry for my ingnorance... I'm trying to visualize where/what lip may interfere with the warn hub... surley a touch of the ol' grinder or there abouts to take off said lip is easier than milling down the outer hub? Or not???? I will try to go to Auto zone/ checker and check it out.
Don't give a hang right now for vented / non .... just want something to work or else its drilling the bolt pattern in the stock GC rotors AND wallowing out the center hole for clearance.... uhhh not the way I'd like to go .....

As always, thanks for the knowledge passed on fellas!

~s

HEP111 said:

Sorry for my ingnorance... I'm trying to visualize where/what lip may interfere with the warn hub... surley a touch of the ol' grinder or there abouts to take off said lip is easier than milling down the outer hub? Or not???? I will try to go to Auto zone/ checker and check it out.

Click to expand...

Here's an image (sorry for the size, in a rush to get off the console...)



If you can get a grinder in there "fill yer boots".

Don't give a hang right now for vented / non .... just want something to work or else its drilling the bolt pattern in the stock GC rotors AND wallowing out the center hole for clearance.... uhhh not the way I'd like to go .....

Click to expand...

With the TJ/XJ FF kit, does WARN expect you to place the rotor UNDER the hub? The Scout kit wants this. From a servicabilty point of view it is retarded. Every time I change the rotor I have to disassemble the hub and knock the studs out? Yeah, right. That's why I've been trying to get this arrangement OVER the hub sorted out.

I wish I could just use ZJ style brakes... but oh well.

Thanks for the pic bro~

Warns kit requires the hub to fit under the rotor so brake work is a snap... I just got the Sidekick rotors and your right.... fits perfectly (well, drilled out the holes for the fatter wheel studs) but I can't use the GC e-brake set up like you said. Spent some time looking at line locks, t-case locks etc on this board and still don't know what to do for the factory look that I like to keep(in moderation as fuction outways looks) w/ ease of parts/servicability a priority. I'll keep ya posted and throw up a tech page when my junks finished enough...
Thanks for the help guys.

I'm not a fan of t-case brakes for use instead of a "normal" hand brake. If you lift one rear wheel (flat tire scenario) and are not locked in the rear (open diff or selectable not engaged) then there is potential for the vehicle to roll away.

Line locks are great but won't pass a vehicle safety in most (all?) jurisdictions. That may or may not matter to you. Also, are they good to set and forget over a multi-day period? Not sure on that one. As good as the valves used I guess. Line-locks are great in addition to a normal ebrake for short duration application where you want all four wheels locked.

If you want I can post some images of what the Nissan calipers look like. Sounds like you are moving away from the ZJ bits anyway...

HEP111, you suggested Suzuki 4dr 1.6L rotors if you wanted vented. I did a quick search (Napaonline & Rockauto) and can only find reference to 2-door models. All have solid front rotors. I looked at '89 & '90. Any more specific info to help search?

1993-1998(?) Suzuki Sidekick 4 door w/ 1.6 liter 16V engine uses vented rotors.

Geo/Chev didn't get the 4 door 16V until ~1995 (IIRC). It's amazing what you forget.

I looked a little deeper--'98 Suzuki JS, 4-dr Sport Utility, 1.6L: 5 on 5.5, 11.3 OD, 1.815 Height, vented, .670 inches thick--I was grinning until I got to the .670 thickness.

Would like to see the Nissan stuff if available.

I would like to keep the e brake but don't see how it will work with what I'm up against with the ZJ calipers.... aside from scrapping them all together and going with another set up... what to do.

The Sport is a completely different beast w/ a 1.8 liter engine. See post #7 above.

You want rotors off a JA, JX or JLX four door w/ 1.6 liter 4 valve engine. Do not use 1992. This 4 door has a 8 valve engine and if I recall correctly non-vented front rotors.

HEP111 said:

Would like to see the Nissan stuff if available.

Click to expand...

1998 Nissan Maxima Calipers







I really need to stress at this point that I have not done a "fit up" of these components to see how they interact and work together. If you get a head of me you are on your own. It should work provided the loaded caliper fits over the rotor. I haven't gotten that far yet hence this disclaimer.