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Interesting (lack of) Clutch problem

twoJeepers

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Washington
Hello, I am not sure where to start, but here goes. I am new here as I just bought my jeep a month or so ago. The car is a 1990 6cyl manual cherokee. My problem is as follows.
The clutch does not disengage. It felt low but ok when I bought it, but over the last two days the position it disconnected at dropped to the floor and now it won't really shift. The fluid in the master cylender is a little above the Min. line, and though the fluid looks a little nasty, it seems to have plenty. The clutch is not worn as far as I can tell. It has never smelled bad and does not slip. When I looked at it after I relized that it was a problem, the boot that covers the hole to the inside of the clutch housing was loose, and I think that there is a LOT of play in the line there. Could the piston be disconnected inside the housing? My haynes and chilton all have great info for the cars that have the slave on the outside of the bell housing, but none for the ones on the inside.

Has this happened to anyone?
How do I get to the inside to look?
What is reccomended?
 
How does one "put it back" if it has come out of place? I am pretty sure that the master is ok. I am more curious about what is involved in accessing and repairing things at the slave end. Thanks for the reply though! =)
 
twoJeepers said:
How does one "put it back" if it has come out of place? I am pretty sure that the master is ok. I am more curious about what is involved in accessing and repairing things at the slave end. Thanks for the reply though! =)
It can't come out of place. It's round with a hole through it and it's around the transmission input shaft. Make sure you transmission bolts or bellhousing bolts are not loose.
Watch the engine or trany and have someone work the clutch, if you see anything move your bolts are loose.
 
When I looked at it after I relized that it was a problem, the boot that covers the hole to the inside of the clutch housing was loose, and I think that there is a LOT of play in the line there.

That's normal. Try changing the fluid and bleed the system from the nipple on the slave. Best tool to use is a 1/4" flare nut wrench to avoid stripping the nut.
 
It's a hydraulic clutch, the fluid is low, and it doesn't work. How can you possibly be "pretty sure that the master is ok." It might be, but it very well might not.

I have lost my clutch three times, twice on the 88 XJ and once on an 88 MJ. The MJ had the slave cylinder burst. That was instantaneous, and a no-brainer.

The first time the XJ lost the clutch, it happened halfway from Connecticut to a trail ride in Maine. It let go at a toll station on the Massachusetts Turnpike. The rubber center section of the hose between the master and slave got tired and was allowing fluid to bleed out. It finally bled enough that there wasn't enough to push the clutch.

Something didn't fit up quite right when I replaced the hose, and there is now a very infinitessimal weep. If I check the fluid once a month or so I'm fine. I let it go beyond a month once, and barely made it home.

As suggested -- refill, bleed, observe. If the fluid level in the master goes down -- find the leak.
 
OK, so after some much needed chastisement from some more senior car people (thank you), I went and pulled back the boot around the pushrod for the master cylender and it was full of fluid. I guess that means that I have a leak up at the top.
If the master cylender is leaking (probably fast considereing how quickly it stopped working) would it be any use to flush and bleed the system or should I dive in and rebuild/ replace the master cylinder? I guess one of those should take care of the problem, but I am still confused about the play in the hydraulic lines that go into the clutch housing. If you have any advice that would be great, thanks!
 
Get a kit and redo it or try power flushing with new Castrol LM brake fluid (I use a bicycle pump held tight against the lid with a helper underneath)
 
If you buy from the Jeep dealer( as opposed to Advance Auto, Auto Zone,etc...) The whole thing comes together, the master, slave and line already assembled, full of fluid and bled. Just put it in and ride! Granted it is more $$$(about $180) but it is just plug and play! If you were to itemize the separate parts it would only be a little cheaper, so to me, having a "Jeep" brand part with no assembling, filling or bleeding, it is worth the extra coin.
 
hotrod22 said:
If you buy from the Jeep dealer( as opposed to Advance Auto, Auto Zone,etc...) The whole thing comes together, the master, slave and line already assembled, full of fluid and bled. Just put it in and ride! Granted it is more $$$(about $180) but it is just plug and play! If you were to itemize the separate parts it would only be a little cheaper, so to me, having a "Jeep" brand part with no assembling, filling or bleeding, it is worth the extra coin.
Not for his year it doesn't. Three separate parts: Master cylinder, slave cylinder, hose/line between the two.
 
but I am still confused about the play in the hydraulic lines that go into the clutch housing.

Again, this is normal. I just replaced both clutch master and internal slave on '90 XJ. The internal slave/throwout bearing assembly sits on the transmission input shaft and is located with one small set screw. The play is the cylinder/bearing rotating on the input shaft a few degrees.
Don't bother rebuilding the clutch master: You can get a new unit for <$75. Then bleed the system, but you might be replacing the internal slave cylinder soon anyway. Often a new clutch master cylinder will cause a weakened slave cylinder to fail (mine did). You'll know if the system won't hold fluid and it puddles up in the bellhousing. Good luck.
 
just wanted too add one thing here, I just had an issue with my '89 5spds clutch and thought you might like to hear this before you spend the same amount of money I did for nothing. my release-point, as yours kept getting lower and lower so I did the logical thing and replaced the clutch, all of it, put the jeep back together and still had nothing. went to replace the master, the only thing I hadn't touched at this point and found a small problem with the clutch pedal.. if you look at yours the arm from the pedal goes up to a cross-tube and another drops down for the stud that attaches to the masters pushrod, check where the pushrod side attaches to the cross tube, mine had cracked and was actually flexing enough to affect the clutch and did actually fail as I was checking it out. hopefully this is you problem as all it takes is taking the cross bolt out and a few seconds with a welder vs. a couple of c-notes in parts.

good luck
doug
 
Thanks all! I have the old master basically all the way off now. Accesability is reasonable and nothing else seems out of order. I did come up with a couple more questions. The new master said in the package that it needed to be pre bled, but the manuals don't say anything about that. Basically all that needs to be done is the fluid pumped gently though for the beginning of the bleeding process right? Other than that I think that I am set. Thanks again! T
 
My 86 comanche with a Girling master cylinder would regularly break the inner spring which pushed the piston back. I found a comparable size spring at Canadian tire after replacing two master cyl. from the dealer. It never failed again in many miles. Easy to take apart
 
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