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Rattle can questions

TheManch

NAXJA Forum User
Location
mckinleyville ca
Soon enough i will be spray painting my mj and i had a few questions. First off i will be using rustoleum flat black (probably). My factory paint is getting worse and there are a few spots of rust, i plan on totally removing all the rust spots down to bare steel, bondo only if necessary, priming and then painting. For all the good paint i plan on simply roughing it upa nd spraying away. now that you've got a background here come the questions, being that i live in New England will a clearcoat be neccessary? i will be pretty meticulous about washing the salt off but i still dont know. For those who have resparyed what od you guys do about the gutter area, i don't think you can pull the crimped on trim stuff off so do you just rough it up and spray the whole area? For the mj guys, it looks like i can just pop out the rear window rubber seal to get a better spray job, will that stuff just pop back in. I want it to come out decent, however i understand that i am infact SPRAY painting my truck so i know it wont be perfect so if you guys and girls find any flaws with my plans let me know, all suggestions are appreciated. BrettM i really dig your truck and figured you could answer a few questions.


Mike
 
I did my TJ entirely flat khaki on the sheetmetal and OD on all the exterior plastic and softop. It has held up pretty well, not coming off other than areas where it has scraped against rocks or trees hard, such as the rocker areas, and flares. I stripped all trim off the sheetmetal, which is a bit easier on the TJ, but it netted a good result. And its easy to touch up the places that I damage. I wet sanded the entire body by hand w/ 600, then cleaned multiple times with soap and water, and dried, then sprayed.
 
A few things I've noticed, from working "paint prep" at a couple body shops...

1) Anywhere you need to use a filler, try to use a metal filler. If you're going to go with black, it's going to soak up heat - and that can make Bondo fall off. I prefer a filler called "Metal2Metal" - sometimes called "AllMetal" - it's a two-part putty like Bondo, but it's a metal putty instead of a plastic. Save plastic for filling plastic. Remember that most body fillers tend to shrink as they cure, and require extended curing times. You should also be able to build-up the fill area with thinner layers, which will give a better finish.

2) Preparation is key. Use Rust-Mort for rust spots (should be able to find it the same place you find AllMetal,) and do your prep sanding with about 180 grit paper - using a Dual-Action (DA) orbital sander, if you can get one - that reduces toolmarks.

3) After sanding, go over the entire vehicle, and any small imperfections should be filled with "glazing putty" - which is thin enough to work for this. Regular body filler of pretty much any variety won't do the job - it doesn't get into the cracks. Filled spots should be checked especially well.

4) After you finish sanding - and right before you paint - wipe ALL surfaces down with a solvent - denatured alcohol, acetone, or methyl-ethyl-ketone are all readily available and will work well. As you are doing this, DO NOT TOUCH ANY SURFACE with your bare hands or with any dirty glove - or you'll have to wipe the area down again. You're doing this to get rid of any residual surface oils, sanding dust, or finger oils. Use lots of paper towels for this, and you can burn them in a coffee can afterwards to get rid of the solvent.

5) Remember, the area where you're going to paint should be free of dust and drafts - a clean garage is best. Wash down the floor if you can, sweep it and blow it clean if you can't. You can't get this too clean - most "pro" spray booths I've seen have large-bore hoses and high pressure to spray down THE ENTIRE BOOTH - and all electrics are sealed against water intrusion.

6) If you're going to work in your garage, have the door open about a third of the way, something open at the other end, and have a fan blowing under your truck. This will help to keep fumes away from you (paint is heavier than air, and you've created a draft that will help get them out,) and you'll probably want a mask anyhow. If you start to feel at all lightheaded or "goofy" - GET OUT. RIGHT THEN AND THERE. Once you are outside, check your fingernails - the tissue under them should be pink. If it's white - or doesn't turn pink right away after you squeeze them for a second, STAY OUTSIDE for at least an hour - you're oxygen-starved and need to breathe clear air. Take a break after every major panel for about 5-10 minutes - most "spray-bomb" paints are formulated to work with that.

Why did I not tell you to open the door all the way? One stiff breeze, and you just tripled your work. By keeping the door mostly closed, you keep out breezes, By putting that strong fan blowing across the floor, you have created ventilation - but it won't interfere with your work. Monitor yourself closely - hypoxia is no joke!

Most clearcoats are either gloss or semi-gloss - if you don't use one, preparation will become CRITICAL. If you're going to clearcoat, use a gloss or semi-gloss paint to match - otherwise, it looks silly. I'd suggest two primer coats, two colour coats, and two clearcoats (it's formulated to protect paint;) or three primer coats and four colour coats. I'd not expect a rattle-can to give me good one-pass coverage - the volume delivery isn't like what you'd get with an HVLP air sprayer. Pay particular attention to the rocker panels and other lower surfaces - that's where the "salt cancer" will usually start.

5-90
 
Awesome thanks for all the help guys. That Tj is nice looking, damn now i have another color to consider. Thanks for the detailed info 5-90, the reasone i asked about the clear coat is that i would like to keep the matte black finish or whatever color i use, so whould it be best with a flat color or semi flat color and semi flat clear coat, if i went the clear coat route? It's just than whenever i see gloss rattlecan jobs that have that wavy look to them which i don't care for. Thanks again guys and keep the ideas coming!!!


Mike
 
TheManch said:
For those who have resparyed what od you guys do about the gutter area, i don't think you can pull the crimped on trim stuff off so do you just rough it up and spray the whole area?
that trim peice slides off from the front or back. i saw a thread in the jeepspeed forum a while back where they recommended bending the gutter up. it seems in a rollover that it would bend it down over the door and prevent it from being opened.:gag: hope this helps.
 
TheManch said:
Awesome thanks for all the help guys. That Tj is nice looking, damn now i have another color to consider. Thanks for the detailed info 5-90, the reasone i asked about the clear coat is that i would like to keep the matte black finish or whatever color i use, so whould it be best with a flat color or semi flat color and semi flat clear coat, if i went the clear coat route? It's just than whenever i see gloss rattlecan jobs that have that wavy look to them which i don't care for. Thanks again guys and keep the ideas coming!!!


Mike

one thing i have noticed with flat paint is that the dirt sticks to it.. you cant just hose it off.. With that said I would put some sort of clear coat on it, just to seal it so that it can be hosed off.. they have satin clear coat.. give it a suede look.. kinda like the Rat Rods..
 
Ludakris said:
one thing i have noticed with flat paint is that the dirt sticks to it.. you cant just hose it off.. With that said I would put some sort of clear coat on it, just to seal it so that it can be hosed off.. they have satin clear coat.. give it a suede look.. kinda like the Rat Rods..


Yes, the dirt sticks to it. So does oil, grease, or whatever else rubs against it. But its low maintenance. Pressure wash it to get the heavy stuff off, and touch it up every couple years. Not a problem. Its called patina and adds character.
 
I used Krylon Gloss Enamel when I rattle canned my trucks, and they all turned out pretty well.
I live in Ohio and we get plenty of snow/salt here also, and the paint has held up great. I also take my truck downa lot of narrow trails nad have just a little bit of 'pinstriping' to show for it; no more than a lot of stock paint jobs get on the same trails.

It took me around 15 cans to get the lighter yellow color over top of the dark blue that was on it originally, but there is nowhere on the jeep that you can see the paint coming though still. I did very minimal prep work on the original paint other than making sure it was clean.

I painted the entire jeep, by only masking off the plastic pieces like turn signals with tape and spraying everything multiple times. Do a lot of light coats and the paint shouldn't run much. The window chrome paint has started to peel in places now that it's been around a year, so you may want to rough it up first to get the paint to stick better. You can spray the window seals and window glass and just scrape off the window glass with a razor blade - the paint sticks to the seals real good.
 
one thing i have noticed with flat paint is that the dirt sticks to it

True. Rustoleum has a semi flat (semi gloss?) and so does Krylon. I've had better luck getting all of the paint out of Krylon can and it leaves a nice finish. (yeah, I know about turning the can over to clean the tip). Dirt won't stick to the semi flat as much/at all and looks good. Prep work is key but don't stress. Any mistakes made can be fixed on the cheap.

Don't short change spray bomb paint jobs. I did a set of vw alloys that a lot of people thought were powder coated.


Good wheelin' to ya
(in color or black and white)
Cherokid
 
JnJ said:
Whats the secert to avoiding the "stripping" I see on a lot of rattle can spray jobs?
I think you're refering to the lines you see with some rattle can jobs. The trick is to get one pass (line) to flow into the next. The first few passes you just want thin coats. The last is the one you want the paint to "flow". Lay the last coat on heavier and you'll see the paint hit the surface as small dots then run or "flow" together and smooth out. That's the effect you're looking for. It's kind of a fine line between having the paint flow and getting runs or drips. :rattle: See if your local library has any books on auto painting they may be able to explain it better. The hard part is a rattle can has a smaller spray pattern, more passes required, more chances for "strips". Also, If you do the semi flat/semi gloss black you can still wax it and get the 'strips' out later. Again, practice with a couple of cans from different manufacturers and see which you like best. I was going to recommend practicing on cardboard but just have at it on your jeep. Any mistakes can be sanded down and redone at a later date. Mostly, HAVE FUN WITH IT! :party:

Good 'suede' Wheelin to ya,
Cherokid
 
Well, I got the jeep done this weekend. Got some USMC green at AJP and used about 2/3 - 3/4 galon on it, thinned 2:1 and with 4 good coats. It looks awesome and i am super happy with it. only thing i didnt do was hardner cuz i couldnt find any place that had any. oh well. I will be posting complete pics of it on my site, www.wetpaintfilms.com, but for now you can drool over these. its mostly back together, but i still need to figure out what im doing for flares now..painted, not painted, build some out of tube..who knows.
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dsc_0192.jpg
 
perhaps a hijack, but somewhat on topic --

I am painting my TJ flares to match the body as the stock flares did (99) using chryco spray touchup (supposedly for a perfect color match)... The color is fine, but flat. How do I get the same "gloss" finish that the metal has? I presume I need to use a clearcoat of some sort? Rubbing compound?

TIA
 
JnJ said:
Whats the secert to avoiding the "stripping" I see on a lot of rattle can spray jobs?


I just cleaned (repainted) Caltrans and what I noticed is air temp had a lot to do with it.

This time I got some stripping. It was 82 A/Ced air. The last time no stripping but it was like 50 degs out and the paint seemed to FLOW much better. Way longer to dry also.

hinkley
 
I was using Rustoleum auto paint cause it has a wide spray nozzle....results were ok at best.....just chalked it up to using a rattle can.....well today I used Krylon Premium Auto paint....a true acrylic enamel.....also wide spray nozzle.....WAY better paint. If I had taken my time do a better job it wolud have come out great....I figured it was gonna suck anyway so I just blew it on rel quick. Try a can and take your time and remember a paint job is only as good as the prep. work that went in to it.
 
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