cv/u-joint strength

bj-666 · May 25, 2005

why hasn't anyone come out with a cv joint for the xj. What are the pros and cons of both u-joint and cv joints. i know the basics that a cv joint is designed to keep every part spinning at the same speed as where a u-joint is always accelerating/slowing . which type is stronger. o yea i'm speaking about the front axle shafts.

DDCxj · May 25, 2005

There is no point in having a cv joint in the front axle where it is a solid axle. All of the cars/trucks you see cv joints on have independent suspension and therefore need to run axles with cv joints. The axles in your jeep dont moves seperate from eachother, its just a straigh line across at all times. The only time the joint moves is for steering.

Dean

bj-666 · May 25, 2005

but what about the strength issues of cv vs u-joint.

DDCxj · May 25, 2005

I'm not really sure on this but I don't think there is much of a difference. At the shop I work at, we probably replace just as many cv axles as we do u-joints. But, in an application that uses a cv joint, it does twice as much work as a u-joint does. If you could put a cv joint in a solid axle truck it might be stronger because its only doing half as much work as its made to do, but thats just in theory.

Dean

XJ_ranger · May 25, 2005

teh new WJ's have cv's instead of u-joints...

and they arent 1/2 as strong... honda's run CV's, f-250's run D60's with u-joints... what do we want? honda strength or 3/4 ton truck strength?

Citat3962 · May 25, 2005

A CV is used when you need to bend on two planes vertical and horizontal.. Suspension compression and steering..

I would think the angles encountered in either plane will cause different wear on different parts of the bearings inside the CV. So you would likely have similar service life for a CV in a solid axle as it would in an IFS setup..

Strength concerns aside I'd much rather go through replacing a broken U Joint $$ and simplicity wise than I would replace a CV. The CV would be bought shaft and all ($$$) You can replace a bad Ujoint (Before it breaks) and use your original shafts.

FWD cars only have CV's because they have to to turn and compress the suspension and deliver power all at the same time and smoothly and silently..

U joints only turn on one plane and have a solid axle housing to muffle any noises.

CV's are also quite a bit bigger than U Joints so it could be an issue of fitting the CV inside the axle housing.

CRASH · May 25, 2005

There is so much mis-information in this thread I'm thinking of deleting it to save NAXJA

's reputation.

All who have posted thus far, please go do some research and return with good information and apologies.

CRASH

poomba · May 25, 2005

CRASH said:
There is so much mis-information in this thread I'm thinking of deleting it to save 's reputation.

All who have posted thus far, please go do some research and return with good information and apologies.

CRASH

You called 'em on it, throw the true info up there for 'em. Tease

CRASH · May 25, 2005

poomba said:
You called 'em on it, throw the true info up there for 'em. Tease

This is like college.

I'm the professor.

I tell you that you are an idiot.

It's your job to figure out why.

CRASH

Dirk Pitt · May 25, 2005

DDCxj said:
There is no point in having a cv joint in the front axle where it is a solid axle. All of the cars/trucks you see cv joints on have independent suspension and therefore need to run axles with cv joints. The axles in your jeep dont moves seperate from eachother, its just a straigh line across at all times. The only time the joint moves is for steering.

Dean

Well, for one thing, your axles most certainly move separate from each other. That's what your open/unlocked differential allows them to do.

As already stated, some solid axle vehicles run CV joints.

Citat3962 said:
have a solid axle housing to muffle any noises

How can an axle housing conceal any noise from a u-joint when the u-joint is not inside the axle housing but rather open in the inner knuckle?

poomba · May 25, 2005

CRASH said:
This is like college.

I'm the professor.

I tell you that you are an idiot.

It's your job to figure out why.

CRASH

I'd cry cop-out, but yer right. Applying for student aid, send me a check

Right now, I'll staring at my ujoint strap/bolts (ushaped) that are bent into a purty pretzel, and thinking..if these were stronger, I coulda made it up that..and then again, I might have a driveshaft that looks like a candy cane. If something's gonna give, I'd rather it be 5 bucks in parts rather than getting the shaft...cough. I did figure they's be stronger than the regular straps though. Spending my birthday under the jeep figuring out what really went wrong, cuz it wasn't much of an obstacle, and I wasn't hopping the jeep. I'll be under the jeep studying for my web wheelers degree, if ya need me..zzzzzzzz

DDCxj · May 26, 2005

Dirk Pitt said:
Well, for one thing, your axles most certainly move separate from each other. That's what your open/unlocked differential allows them to do.

As already stated, some solid axle vehicles run CV joints.QUOTE]

Thats not what I was trying to say. What I meant was that a truck with a solid axle does not articulate at all like a truck with indepent suspension with cv axles. I know that a solid axles have multiple shafts that make up the axle as a whole. As said before, solid axles on move need the joint to move on one plane but independent needs the joint on two planes.

What solid axles have been mentioned that have cv joints? Not trying to start an argument but I didnt see it anywhere in this thread and I have never seen one.

Comparing the two is like comparing apples and oranges, they are completely different applications.

CRASH: please enlighten us. I have searched the internet and come up with nothing. Got a link or something we can learn from?

Dean

RCP Phx · May 26, 2005

DDCxj said:
Dirk Pitt said:

Well, for one thing, your axles most certainly move separate from each other. That's what your open/unlocked differential allows them to do.

As already stated, some solid axle vehicles run CV joints.QUOTE]

Thats not what I was trying to say. What I meant was that a truck with a solid axle does not articulate at all like a truck with indepent suspension with cv axles. I know that a solid axles have multiple shafts that make up the axle as a whole. As said before, solid axles on move need the joint to move on one plane but independent needs the joint on two planes.

What solid axles have been mentioned that have cv joints? Not trying to start an argument but I didnt see it anywhere in this thread and I have never seen one.

Comparing the two is like comparing apples and oranges, they are completely different applications.

CRASH: please enlighten us. I have searched the internet and come up with nothing. Got a link or something we can learn from?

Dean

Click to expand...

ZJ's and WJ's Both used CV's on the D30!
Sorry,forgot to include the obvious "XJ"

PeterBuilt · May 26, 2005

Everyone who is reading these posts are now dumber because of it. I award you no points and have god have mercy on your soul.

:wave: :wave:

Pete

DDCxj · May 26, 2005

I stand corrected. I knew the new WJ's had them but I never noticed on the old ones and the ZJ's.

Dean

RCP Phx · May 26, 2005

DDCxj said:
Dirk Pitt said:

What solid axles have been mentioned that have cv joints? Not trying to start an argument but I didnt see it anywhere in this thread and I have never seen one.CRASH: please enlighten us. I have searched the internet and come up with nothing. Got a link or something we can learn from?

Dean

Click to expand...

I knew the new WJ's had them

Click to expand...

Hmmm???

DDCxj · May 26, 2005

What are you trying to get at?

The new WJs have independent suspension, not solid axles.

I have seen plenty of cv joints, just never hit me that I have seen them in any solid axles, which obviously they do,but I still dont understand why they would be in a solid axle set up.

I never said I was a professional or that I know everything about anything and I'll be happy to admit when I'm wrong....well, maybe not happy, but I certainly will admit it as I did.

So why doesn't someone that knows everything there is to know post something so that this thread doesn't continue to be so useless. Why would Grand Cherokees have CV joints in the front D30 as opossed to u-joints? I assume there is a reason but I'm not seeing it.

Dean

kewlkatdady · May 26, 2005

If it means anything....the new Grand Cherokees with IFS are called WK's

not WJ's anymore

DDCxj · May 26, 2005

That would mean something. It would mean that Im confusing myself and probably many others.

"Yeah, I'm retarded"-Tommy Boy

So, ZJs have CVs up front and obviously WK's do too. And I guess WJs also have them......so what I am going to do right now is stop thinking cause my head is starting to hurt and I will just accept that for some reason unseen to me, CV joints are used in solid axles. But if someone could shed some lights as to why, it would make this process a whole lot less painless.

Dean

kubtastic · May 26, 2005

DDCxj said:
Why would Grand Cherokees have CV joints in the front D30 as opossed to u-joints? I assume there is a reason but I'm not seeing it.
Dean

-Longevity, fewer seals. You might replace just as many CV's, but those are on IFS. You've never seen a solid axle with CV's... go figure.

Citat3962 said:
A CV is used when you need to bend on two planes vertical and horizontal.. Suspension compression and steering..

-Correct answer but you fail geometry. When two lines intersect they define a single plane.

IFS uses CV's because they constantly see non-zero operating angle: the differential is tucked up against the belly of the vehicle. Suspension movement also affects the angle. Meanwhile, on a solid axle, only turning creates an angle, and usually the higher the angle the slower you're moving.

cv/u-joint strength

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