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mikeny59
April 2nd, 2005, 08:35
I've been running two red tops for about a year, the first isolator became history, just ordered the cheapest Painless isolator f/AutoGnome.:clap:

The main battery offers absolutely no more room for any accessory, and from what I remember, the b/u battery should not have anything connected to it, at least that's what I've read, especially since it's a red-top. The b/u battery is purely for the somewhat frequent occasions I experience memory loss and leave the headlights on...

I'm still in the process of installing a remote starter/lock/unlock unit, and plan to add an air horn and new reversing lights - all basically intermittent loads.

I direly need to take advantage of the second red top's top and side terminals, :cry: , can these three above-described loads be connected to the second red-top safely?!?

I think so, but then again, any word that ends in tron evokes an anxiety episode...

help.............................................. .................................................. .................

old_man
April 2nd, 2005, 08:43
Side terminals are not capable of the current carrying capacity that the top terminals are. You shouldn't connect a winch to the side terminals, but for most other applications, they can be safely used.

bj-666
April 2nd, 2005, 09:32
i personally hate bateries with a million connections coming off of them i dont' see any reason why you couldn't hook up to your other bat. are you saying they are seperatly isolated. then there definatly shouldn't be any prob with using one or the other. check out west marine for terminal blocks that way you can have one main lead off the batt and tuck all the connections somewhere nice. http://http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10001&langId=-1&catalogId=10001&productId=14866&catalogId=10001&classNum=119&subdeptNum=118&storeNum=9

NCSUcherokee
April 2nd, 2005, 09:38
instead of running more wires to your battery, why not install an accessory fuse block next to it? the install would look alot cleaner and you could probably find one with enough ports for your needs


edit: ^ he beat me to it

mikeny59
April 2nd, 2005, 09:55
The b/u battery is a greatly shorter distance to the connections I need to make, and I have all the necessary parts - hi-amp inline fuse holders, terminals, etc.. to complete the job quick, easier, and w/quality.

There's a West Marine near me, I've purchased alot of stuff from them, but... I'm also saving for a house down payment, and I'm practically scouring the neighborhood for soda cans...

RichP
April 2nd, 2005, 11:03
Don't know if this will be of any interest but the new quadratec catalog has a dual red/yellow/blue top battery setup for TJ's that stacks them sidways. There is some other hardware avail for the kit as well.

Starboard M
April 2nd, 2005, 12:26
So for those of you who run dual batteries, where are they? Do you have to put them in the back of the Jeep? I know in the engine bay of mine, there is room for one, and thats it.

casm
April 2nd, 2005, 12:34
So for those of you who run dual batteries, where are they? Do you have to put them in the back of the Jeep? I know in the engine bay of mine, there is room for one, and thats it.

Some folks are running them in the cargo area, but there are a couple of ways to get a second one under the hood:

The MADXJ method (http://www.madxj.com/MADXJ/technical/technicalfiles/ARbattRelocation/BattRelocation.htm)

Pirate 4x4's way (http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/dual_battery/my_dual_battery_setup.htm)

Hope this helps. FWIW, I plan on eventually going the MADXJ route, but that's a ways down the road.

RichP
April 2nd, 2005, 13:06
The one in quadratec has a whole new tray setup. I've never looked at adapting it to the XJ but the TJ is not all that rich in realestate either. I dont have any need for duals no do I plan on adding the stuff that requires them.

Goatman
April 2nd, 2005, 14:14
The b/u battery is a greatly shorter distance to the connections I need to make, and I have all the necessary parts - hi-amp inline fuse holders, terminals, etc.. to complete the job quick, easier, and w/quality.

There's a West Marine near me, I've purchased alot of stuff from them, but... I'm also saving for a house down payment, and I'm practically scouring the neighborhood for soda cans...

As long as the back up battery is hooked to the charging circuit, which it should be, there's no reason not to draw off of it for accessories. It depends on how you have you're isolator set up.

I use a screw post adapter on my regular post terminals on the battery, and all my cables have loop ends rather than post ends. This allows for more cables to fit on the battery terminals. I also use a blue top, which come either starting or deep cycle, and have a second screw terminal. This setup gives me two posts to hook up all of my stuff......winch, air compressor, amp, welder, etc.

I'm not a dual battery fan. One is always enough, and batteries are heavy. The exception would be if you were by yourself in the middle of nowhere and got a dead battery, but I don't go out by myself, and dead batteris don't happen very often.

roosterado9
April 2nd, 2005, 15:38
somewheres on the net recently I saw a Dual battery in One I mean it was 2 batteries in one casing.[1 of them isolated] Can't find it again

Dingo509
April 2nd, 2005, 17:27
If you look under the hood of a 88-98? chev truck, at the top of the firewall under a plactis panel that says "relay center" or something close, you will find a buss bar that has 5 3/8 studs used for exactly what you want.

I am using one to distribute the power in my XJ. I have 2 Odyssey batteries in the right rear under some custom toolboxes. i've run a 2/0 cable from the batteries to this block im describing, then run the Starter, fuseblock, winch, msd box, and jumper cable plugs of these terminals. The only thing i have off each battery is 1 pos cable and 1 ground cable. I have some old pics somewhere if someone wants to see what im talking about.

Dingo

RichP
April 2nd, 2005, 18:27
Keep in mind that on dual battery types with a post and a screw in side mount you do not put high current draw accys on the screw terminal. On the duals like the optimas the screw in terminals have fairly light cable. Even optima warns not to put a winch or other high draw accy on there.

theslacker
April 2nd, 2005, 18:39
Do you realize that Red top Optimas are not deep cycle? The only reason you should be running dual starting batteries is if you need the extra crank power eg. Diesel engines. The great thing about the Blue DC Optimas is that they have 1000ca and 140min @ 25amp reserve time. They also have threaded studs on top that you can put eye loops on with a simple wing nut(3/8 coarse thread). If you want dual batts in your Jeep running through an isolator switch, use the Red top for starting then switch to a Deep Cycle for your winch nand high amp accessories. The easier and cheaper option is to use one Blue DC. It will handle the starting and accessory draw. I'm a Battery salesman so I get this question alot at work.

renegade_z71
April 2nd, 2005, 19:13
i was under the opinion that out of the three offereings from optima that the yellow top was ideal for winching and over all use as far as fourwheeling goes. is this not true?

Goatman
April 2nd, 2005, 20:28
Yes, that's true. My experience is that the Yellow Top deep cycle out lasts the Red Top starting battery, because the deep cycle can take so much more abuse without damage to the battery. After a couple of deep discharges (dead battery) the Red Top will have a considerable drop in longevity, and probably performance. The Yellow Top has plenty of starting power and is more durable with the type of use and abuse we give them with winches, air compressors, lights, amps, and mistakes, because it's designed to be discharged under use.

I prefer the deep cycle Blue Top because of the extra terminal. The Blue Top is a marine application, with the only difference being the second terminal. They come both starting and deep cycle......exactly the same as a Red or Yellow Top, just with an additional terminal.

I discourage people from dual battery setups, unless they travel alone a lot. It's just not needed. If it makes you much more comfortable, no problem, but many people set out to do it because it's a popular upgrade to a 4x4 vehicle. This is largely a misconception stemming from the thought that you're better off with dual batteries if you have a winch. Same is true for needing a high output alternator. There's nothing wrong with having a high output alternator if you want one, but the alternators that come stock on most late model vehicles will get the job done. You can do a considerable amount of winching with a stock alternator and one high capacity battery that is in good condition. I tend to look at these upgrades as luxuries, something to do after the other important modifications are already done to the rig.

You know what they say about opinions......there's mine, FWIW. :)

Iminocca
April 2nd, 2005, 22:55
I agree that dual batteries are a luxury, but I'm still going to install them some day. They're kinda low on the priority list though, but when I get around to it I'm going to use this isolator setup http://www.hellroaring.com/4wheel.htm There's some good info on the site, it's worth checking out.

mikeny59
April 3rd, 2005, 08:16
I was totally aware of the purpose of the red top, the second red top was simply to compensate for my tendency to leave interior lights on and things like that on. I never planned to add a winch or any other high draw load, so I passed on the deep cycle Optimas.

Though everything I've attached to the main red top (including a small bus bar from West Marine) is properly fused, heat-shrunk, covered with plastic loom both taped and tie-wrapped, there' absolutely no room for anything else, and rightly so.

The only devices I'd attach to the second red top is the remote start/door lock/unlock unit, a pair of medium wattage reversing lights, and a small Hella air horn compressor - all intermittent loads, at least that's what I'd describe them as. And not likely to be used simultaneously. With just a big k&n cone there, the space is just begging to be utilized.

I've already upgraded ALL cables a couple of years ago to two-gauge, even added a couple of extra ground straps to the block and chassis. Crimped/soldered/heat-shrank (is that a word?) all terminals, even Scotchkoted terminals like the ground straps and the alternator output lug (bad idea?!?).

Does anyone consider the loads I described as small enough to use the b+ side post terminal? I'm not ocd about this, but I can use a two or four gauge battery terminal for all three devices (basically four 12 gauge wires) for a very clean install.

ASAP I'll snap a couple of photos and put them on Webshots (if I can't figure out how to paste them directly here).

I really appreciate the detailed opinions you guys' have resonded with, thanks...