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Sealing a Water Pump

Tony_SS

Tony_SS

NAXJA Supporting Vendor
Location
Washington MO
Installing a new pump.... how and what would you use to seal it?
Same with the thermo housing?

I have Fel-Pro gaskets for both.... should I use any in addition? If so, on both sides of the gasket?
 
Silicone tends to act as a lubricant and makes the gasket split or move around, I suggest not using it at all. I use some 3m 8090 spray adhesive and glue to gasket to the new water pump, then install the pump once the glue has set for about 5 minutes. No sealer on the back side of the gasket. Same with the thermostat.
 
I am a big fan of Permatex #1 or #2 when it comes to water pump or T-Stat housing replacement; #1 is hardening, #2 is non-hardening.

I know some folks use RTV, but unless I'm doing something without a gasket at all, I tend to avoid it like the plauge, especially around water.

Fel-Pro is a brand, they make lots of gaskets from paper to rubber. If rubber, I wouldn't use anything.
Make sure the surfaces are flat. mostly all of the of T-Stat or Water pump housing leaks I have had were because the housings were not true.
 
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WB9YZU said:
I am a big fan of Permatex #1 or #2 when it comes to water pump or T-Stat housing replacement; #1 is hardening, #2 is non-hardening.

I know some folks use RTV, but unless I'm doing something without a gasket at all, I tend to avoid it like the plauge, especially around water.

Fel-Pro is a brand, they make lots of gaskets from paper to rubber. If rubber, I wouldn't use anything.
Make sure the surfaces are flat. mostly all of the of T-Stat or Water pump housing leaks I have had were because the housings were not true.
Click to expand...

Ditto on non-hardening #2, and I only put a little on the thermostat to hold it in place, then cover the gasket on the side that mates to the thermostat housing and the water pump face--I don't like scraping compounds off the engine the next time.
 
Just did this 6 months ago. First off, I used the OEM thermostat and waterpump with their included gaskets. I cleaned the surfaces up with scotchbright and installed both using the supplied gaskets dry. No leaks or issues. In my 40 years of wrenching, I haven't used sealant on gaskets. I only use RTV when I fit metal to metal. Many have used gasket adhesive or RTV with success so both methods work. IMHO, if you don't need to use RTV, you eliminate the possibility of some ending up in places it shouldn't be.
 
#2 both surfaces water pump and thermastate, So for, so good. Wrangler and cherokee, no leakage. Fel pro or victor did not matter. Nice clean mateing service a must.
 
I have used Indian Head and I have used Gasgacinch (http://www.amazon.com/Gasgacinch-4OZ-GASKACINCH-440-A/dp/B002OPPFPY) which works very well with paper and cork gaskets.

For the application of a silicon sealant, I apply it with my finger using only enough so you can see it on the part. Keep in mind that when you tighten the hardware and the sealant oozes out of the joint it is also oozing into what ever it is you are sealing. The internal "hanging" sealant will,eventually, let go and then it will wander around the insides of your engine.

Not a good thing that. The factory did not use sealant as it is not actually needed. Silicon is intended to be a gasket replacement which is why it is called a "gasket maker".

The only time I actually use an aid is if the assembly is such that help is needed holding the gasket in place whilst fitting the parts. Or, in the case of T-Stats, I eliminate the gasket.

As a side note, when I bought the '98 I run around in now, it had over heating issues. After chemical cleaning the sludge out of the system (had never seen black coolant before), I eventually had to replace the radiator. Just for fun, I removed the tank from the intake side of the radiator and found it to be clogged with silicon scraps by about half. Excessive usage by previous "mechanics" ruined the radiator.

So, be careful with the stuff.

BTW, in a pinch, you can use rubber cement as a gasket sealing compound. Old School Solution that.
 
another vote for both indianhead and gasgacinch, they work great. I try to avoid using silicone unless the surfaces can not be completely cleaned or made perfectly smooth.
 
O-Gauge Steamer said:
Hey Grimm!

Showing your age there bud. Have to be "mature in years" to remember both Indian Head and Gasgacinch.

just sayin...
Click to expand...

not as old as I seem but learned my trade from my father and grandfather :D My grandpa ran a repair shop in queens for 40 years and my dad used to build engines with Keith Black. I learned the right way to do things works a lot better than the easy way a long time ago :cheers:
 
The other night I tried using a gasket from napa with the sticky adhesive built in on one side. I stuck that side to the tstat housing and used some indian head on the other side. Then I bolted it up alternating both screws up to spec which I used some permatex thread sealant on. I filled with coolant 3 days later because I did a champion 2 core radiator, b&m trans cooler, water pump, fan clutch and cleaning. The tstat housing leaked from the bottom like crazy.

I must have done something wrong, not sure what. So I pulled it off, used a new paper gasket and cleanly smeared a little red rtv on both sides of the gasket, reinstalled snug, then let set for 15min and torqued to spec. It doesn't seem to be leaking now.

I smeared an even coating, just enough to where I could still lightly see a bit of the gasket peaking through. After it was done I had hardly any rtv sticking out so I think I'm safe on the inside (hopefully).

I did the water pump with indian head only and it seems ok.
What did I do wrong the first time with the tstat housing?
Is my current rtv version safe (I don't want to kill the new radiator)?
I also feel like there should be 3 screws in the tstat housing, not 2. oh well, I didn't design the part =)

I should also add that both surfaces even after a good cleaning, I used scotch bright, brake cleaner, and a wire brush, were really pitted and didn't seem true.
 
Qban said:
The other night I tried using a gasket from napa with the sticky adhesive built in on one side. I stuck that side to the tstat housing and used some indian head on the other side. Then I bolted it up alternating both screws up to spec which I used some permatex thread sealant on. I filled with coolant 3 days later because I did a champion 2 core radiator, b&m trans cooler, water pump, fan clutch and cleaning. The tstat housing leaked from the bottom like crazy.

I must have done something wrong, not sure what. So I pulled it off, used a new paper gasket and cleanly smeared a little red rtv on both sides of the gasket, reinstalled snug, then let set for 15min and torqued to spec. It doesn't seem to be leaking now.

I smeared an even coating, just enough to where I could still lightly see a bit of the gasket peaking through. After it was done I had hardly any rtv sticking out so I think I'm safe on the inside (hopefully).

I did the water pump with indian head only and it seems ok.
What did I do wrong the first time with the tstat housing?
Is my current rtv version safe (I don't want to kill the new radiator)?
I also feel like there should be 3 screws in the tstat housing, not 2. oh well, I didn't design the part =)

I should also add that both surfaces even after a good cleaning, I used scotch bright, brake cleaner, and a wire brush, were really pitted and didn't seem true.
Click to expand...
it's VERY easy to have the thermostat slip out of its hole just enough to make the bottom of the housing not seal properly. in more extreme cases it's bad enough to shatter the housing when you tighten it down.
 
GrimmJeeper said:
it's VERY easy to have the thermostat slip out of its hole just enough to make the bottom of the housing not seal properly. in more extreme cases it's bad enough to shatter the housing when you tighten it down.
Click to expand...

Sad to say but this has happened to me way too many times. Good info...
 
Bryan C. said:
Sad to say but this has happened to me way too many times. Good info...
Click to expand...

That was probably what happened to me, too bad I won't know now. I'll just hope that I don't leak out of the water pump now. I pretty much changed out every stock cooling part with exception to the radiator and added a b&m cooler in front just like jeeperjason wrote up =)
 
WOW, lots of good advice in this thread. Then Grim drops the Keith Black on it!!!!

My lowly experience will be short.

Follow the directions if you use the RTV. It clearly says to hand tighten once applied then torque in maybe 30-60 min off the top of my head. Never had any problems here with following these instructions. I avoid scraping near open engine orifices that the debris cant be readily removed from. So i only use it on the engine side of the gasket to make sure there is a good seal against the block / pump / etc. ....


Also, Permatex and others make RTV specially for contact with Glycol AKA ANtifreeze. This should be used on waterpumps, much better at setting in the presence of Glycol products. Silicone products dont dry but cure, sometimes a full cure can take 48 hours. So when you smear it on, torque it up and pour that green juice in it has some time to degrade your red / blue / black RTV before it can cure.

Just saying use the right stuff for the job......
 
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I have a a K.B piston to show and tell.

This came out of a Toyota 22RE making 14.0:1 compression. Lost a fuel injector and burned a hole through the top right at the spark plug... Bummer.

The worst part was driving it 70 miles home like that. Removed the fuel injector electrical connector and bought a case of cheap oil. Stopped every 10-12 miles to pour more oil in. I was 23 year old with no $$$ for a Tow.







 
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