The Great Locker Debate

Hey All,

So I'm starting to research lockers for my XJ. I have read many threads on the "never ending which is better: front or rear" debate and am no closer to making a decision. So...I turn to you. My XJ is a 4.0, NP231, AW4 trans. It has 3.55 gears (and I dont plan to regear in the future...I did that with my YJ and it was a HUGE mistake).

Anyway, the jeep isn't a DD (I have a work vehicle, my wife has her own car). So, the XJ is my play toy but could be (and would be) used as a backup vehicle if I needed to go somewhere and the wifey is gone in "her" car or she may drive it if we get a bout of snow/ice in the area for more ground clearance. The jeep has a 3" lift with 31" mud terrain tires on it right now.

I've been going over the various lockers available to me (I have a dana 30HP front, Chrysler 8.25 with an unknown spline count due to it being harvested from another XJ from the PO). I'm debating between selectable locker (OX) or an auto (Aussie). Then, I have to decide: front, rear, or both. Now I know what you're thinking: that's a stark contrast between locker types and the second question is a no brainer. But, it goes a little deeper than that, which I plan to lay out below.

Front

Auto (~$250): I had a spartan locker in the front of my YJ (D30HP). It was beefy and worked really well. I never experienced any bad "side effects", but turning the wheel was a bit more "difficult" (for a lack of a better description) when in 4wd (as expected) and the steering wheel liked to "fight" me. I had also heard about "steering wheel spin" happening and breaking wrist...though I never experienced something that terrible. What was great about it was the cost vs. quality factor. The negative (from what Ive read) is that the constant "on" in 4wd of the locker wears splines,etc. out quicker. As our vehicles age, that means replacing axle shafts could get more difficult since the JY is being picked clean. If I were to go this route again, I would get an Aussie (the only reason I got Spartan was because they were in stock and I was tired of waiting for an Aussie to come back around). In the end, why I am considering this option is because I had a good experience with the Spartan and the price point is, obviously, excellent.

Selectable (~$850+): I have never used one, but have read they are good. OX (I am not interested in ARB) knows this and charges accordingly. What I like about this idea is that I can use 4wd without having to worry about the "constant on" and wearing of parts when I'm hunting or whatever. Also, if my wife is driving, she doesn't have to remember that the front wheels are locked (and neither do I!). The negatives to this is cost factor (of course) and having to route cables that could potentially get stripped out (though I know OX has a device to get out with...for yet another price). It seems like a nickel and dime grab with them to hide the "real" cost of their locker as they charge for the locker, cable, AND actuator device separately. It adds up quick.

Rear

Auto (~$300): I have read many threads that talk about auto lockers in the rear of the vehicle is very acceptable since the wheels dont track like the front. Also, auto lockers will unlock as long as you aren't applying torque to the wheels as you negotiate a curve. Once again, the price seems good but the "con" is that if the wearing of parts is true, then it would seem that these would go out on a regular basis due to in constantly being "on" regardless of 2wd/4wd status. I could also see you being "pushed" into a spin if you apply torque at the wrong time while going down the road.

Selectable (~$1,000): The only plus I seem to see in this setup is that I can turn it on when I want and not when I don't. The price is very hard to swallow.

So, if you've read this far, I commend you! So any suggestions that could be made in what combination of locker setup would be helpful. For those that are wondering, I trail ride at local 4wd parks (at least I did with my YJ, havent taken the XJ out on a true run yet). I would say that the trails are fairly light, but I do encounter 5 to 6 rated trails (http://www.cruisemoab.com/trail-rating-system.asp) at those parks on a semi-regular basis.

My initial leaning is to go with Auto lockers for a multitude of reasons. If I were to go selectable, I would have to wait (and save) for a very long time to make that possible (as that is a $2,000 price tag, plus install cost, which a bit of a bitter pill for what I paid for the XJ to start with). So, back to more reading and awaiting replies with some direction for me to go now!

Go auto, cheap and reliable. You learn how to drive with them and I taught my fiance to drive my jeep with them so thats not a problem.

They work and are cheap and can be installed in less then 2 hours with no special tools.

Aslo, I have never heard of "breaking wrists".. must be from web wheelers... And theres tons of dana 30 shafts out there as well as aftermarket if your worried about wearing out splins or whatever...

whitexj98 said:

Go auto, cheap and reliable. You learn how to drive with them and I taught my fiance to drive my jeep with them so thats not a problem.

They work and are cheap and can be installed in less then 2 hours with no special tools.

Aslo, I have never heard of "breaking wrists".. must be from web wheelers... And theres tons of dana 30 shafts out there as well as aftermarket if your worried about wearing out splins or whatever...

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Thanks White. Do you have a rear auto locker by chance? If so, how does it behave?

Don't know where you've been reading, but some of what you read is BS. Lockers won't wear out your parts faster, won't wear out splines, etc. The steering wheel thing has to do with 4wd more than lockers, you drive in rough terrain and you should keep a grip on the wheel, it's a non-issue when selecting a locker.

Every locker works. There isn't really a debate on which locker is best, only which locker fits what you want and your budget. Not sure why you would choose between an Ausie or an Ox. What about a Detroit or Grizzly (is there a Grizzly yet for the 8.25)? Not sure why you wouldn't consider an ARB, I'd rather have one than an Ox. Cables on the Ox stretch and go out of adjustment, and if you put the air solenoid on it then it sticks out and could be subject to damage. Unfortunately, selectable lockers come with a certain amount of reliability issues that aren't there with automatic lockers, so you have to know that you want selectable.

If you're not going to regear, and will stick with 31" tires, I'd slap some lunchbox lockers in it and be done with it.


Richard G

Can't find the naxja posting but I could find it on craigslist. Since your not regearing and it's not your daily driver perfect and not to much coin.
http://denver.craigslist.org/pts/3467796695.html

Another thing with selectable is the components to run them... as stated, the ox has a chance of a cable snapping or stretching. An arb you have a chance of pinching or cutting an air line, or like my dads friend got the hard way. They were half way into a trail down in moab and the compressor gave out. Leaving them 100% open.

I welded my junk (rear), no popping, no decelerating around corners... drives like normal but chirps and turns heads in parking lots

Not that you asked about ARB But I LOVE MINE and i did pneumatic switches (no solenoid to fail) and set up the air system and switches myself so i know how it works where it runs and how to fix if any issues .

With proper routing i haven't had any issues with the air lines. just in case i carry a repair kit for the air lines . and i used 1/4 o.d. Air brake line (much tougher that the arb air lines) and push to connect fitting so if it did get caught on something it would pull out of the fitting instead of ripping the air line.. the air line would reattach easily with no tools if it did come off ( hasn't yet)

Also have a schrader valve on the air tank to fill with any old tire filler in case the air pump goes out.

They are expensive but i love being able to switch them off and on when i need to , or just want to wheel for a while without the lockers..
I definitely wouldn't want my front locked all the time , although I could deal with the rear being locked all the time or auto locking.

They are expensive and i would have likely never saved up for them had i not gotten a decent deal on used axles with them already installed.
I would've otherwise likely done a cheaper selectable in the front and a cheaper auto locker in the rear.

I have ARBs front & rear for over 5+ years now with no issues, I like being able to lock the Front/rear as needed or Not.

One thing I have not seen mentioned, If you drive in Snow/Ice automatic lockers tend to lock when driving causing all sorts of weird (Sometimes dangerous) handling issues.
Years back I had a Locked Ford Bronco (Detroit in the rear & Lock-right in the front) that got very scary to drive on road during snow/ice conditions, if there was any slippage the lockers would lock & the truck would drift to one side or the other, Sometimes the front & rear would go in different directions; I guess if you are using your Jeep for off road driving it does not matter much, but on road I was always worried about it drifting into a parked car!

Through out the years I've run several different lockers and I've helped install others in friends rigs. The first thing I'd tell you is run away from the OX idea. In my experience they are the biggest pain in the ass to deal with of all of them. Hard to adjust, hard in a Cherokee to find a place for the lever, always needing adjustment to keep operating right. Over all just a pain in the butt.

If this isn't a daily driver like you said I'd go with a cheap lunch box style for the rear if you aren't regearing and a selectable for the front. My choice would either be the ARB or an Eaton Elocker. I have ARBs front and rear in mine, my wife's old jeep has an elocker in the front of hers. Both worked flawlessly.

I wouldn't run a non-selectable locker in the front. That's just my choice. It does make them harder to steer in 4wd and does put more strain on axle shafts and ujoints.

I'm curious about your aversion to regearing though. IMO it's never a mistake as long as you stick with the right gearing for the tire size you run. Obviously running 4.88s with stock tires would be stupid but if you are running 31s going to 4.10s wouldn't be a mistake.

We use the Jeep as a DD about 95% and 5% trailing on on green and blue trails with 32" tires and 4.5" lift, auto and 3.55's. Because most of the driving is street we are going to put a Detroit TruTrac in the rear for everyday good manners, OK maybe not the best for the 5% offroad time and put a Spartan in the front for offroading/4WD times. On the street in the snow and ice, 2WD will be fine, 4WD might be a slight experience.

Jhumphrey said:

Thanks White. Do you have a rear auto locker by chance? If so, how does it behave?

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I have a lockright in the front and a no- slip in the rear. It just takes a little bit to get used to but its no big deal. I have had the no slip for 7~ years and it still looks new all I have done is replace 2 broken springs I found when gearing to 4:56s.

I have Spartans front and rear. The front is fine but I wish I had gone selectable in the rear.

The road to my house is very steep and has lots of tight turns, since its a hill I cant let off so the locker is pretty much always locked . This can get somewhat scary when its wet or icy out since the rear wants to drift in the turns.

Otherwise it drives ok.

Garr raised a good point and one that i experience quite often, on a snowy icy hiway in 4wd the front auto locker will lock up and pull you to one side, its quite frightening and 65 MPH and i wont let my wife drive me jeep in poor conditions although she has a JK on 35s.

The 2wd manners of an auto locker in the front are good, just like an open diff, not recommended on road in 4wd in good conditions for obvious reasons. Around town in the snow and ice its fine in 2wd till you lock up a wheel on ice, the auto locker will ratchet and bang till you let off the brakes, not ideal when stopping. 4wd in the snow is awesome, much like it is off road. Ive had mine for 2 years now, no issues with the locker it self, just some of the side effects on road, and can some times tend to plow off road, i do have a Auburn E Cited locker for my D44 build, if i could do it over again and had the money i would have gotten a air or e locker for the front, but at the time i wasnt planning on re gearing, which you might have to do in the front if your run a selectable locker due to carrier breaks.

I run a factory rebuilt LSD in the rear, it works great, dosnt slow me down off road and has great on road manners as you would expect. The plan for my 8.8 build will be to run a Detroit or a Spool unless i score a 8.8 with a LSD, i would run that for a while and see how it fairs.

If regearing isnt in your future then go grab some auto lockers, there easy to install or remove and easy to sell if you dont like em, if your up to it buy a e locker for the front as it will have the lowest running costs(no cables or air tanks just wire and a relay)and offer the best on road manners but understand that if you regear you wont be able to use the carrier due to the ratio break, and run a lunch box in the rear. You could also run a selectable in the rear as it would be reusable if you regear and run a auto in the front, which will have better 2wd manners and the same off road. Lots to consider with lockers and your driving conditions and style both on and off road will be a factory in your selection and price!

I have been locked in the rear(lock wright) for about 8 years and the front(Aussie) for 5. It's caused me to go through more front axle joints but I have been good at catching them before they let go all the way, have only had one break on the spot. I run 35s now so I just went with a set of yukons.

I love it, wouldn't go back and if I ever get off my rear and get a 2-low I wouldn't ever think of a selectable. Snow, ice, no big deal if you have a remote sense of how to handle a vehicle. In fact it adds some fun if you ask me, wide open in a big parking lot you can do some fun stuff in the snow.

On road I just flip it in and out of 4wd no big deal. I find being locked in the front is better on the ice than when I had a tru trac even.

BlueCuda said:

On road I just flip it in and out of 4wd no big deal. I find being locked in the front is better on the ice than when I had a tru trac even.

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Same here. I guess i should add tire selection might play a small road in my poor on road manners on the ice. MTs on icy hiways isnt fun in 2wd. Oh well 2-3 more years and ill have a proper daily/tow rig. Good luck with your locker selection, its one of the few mods and transforms your rig off road.

I have a lockright up front and just installed an 8.8 with a tru trac in it. I'm guessing it will be quite nice. As for icy weather I keep it in 2wd unless absolutely necessary. The front locker is the best thing I've done. As for regearing, its worth every penny!

For a street driven rig, it's hard to beat having a selectable in the rear.

I have a pair of autolockers never had a problems wheeling or on the street with them. Yes I would rather have selectable lockers but hard to justify spending more that what the whole pile of junk is worth to install them....

I like threads like these - there's absolutely no right answer! But if you're looking for opinions/stories, heck I'm game!

Had a TrueTrac in my 8.25 and was not a fan. IMO that locker wears out fast; after 2 seasons it was basically wide open. My father-in-law had the exact same thing happen in his D30.

I had a LockRite in my D30 and liked it plenty. It worked when I needed it, the only downside is how loud it was around town.

When I upgraded axles I went to ARBs and WOW what a difference. Perfect manners on and off road and very strong. Plus it's fun to see what you can climb before you have to engage them. I'd be hard pressed to go back to auto-lockers.

BUT if I didn't have the budget, I'd toss in some lunchboxes and be done with it - lunchboxes beat wide-open hands down!

ExTankerGuy said:

For a street driven rig, it's hard to beat having a selectable in the rear.

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Agreed. My rear detroit is annoying and also scary at times. Tight turns in the snow are more of a required power slide. Something the wife doesn't exactly enjoy.

I'm positive I'll eventually swap it for an E locker or ARB.