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double clutch question

9

995speed

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Ridgefield
99 XJ 4.0 AX-15

Hey, so the pervious owner on my jeep had the tranny rebuild somewhere down in SC about 50,000 miles ago, they put a GL-4 fluid in without him knowing (i found this out when changing the fluid and smelt a sulfur smell when draining the fluid I put in a Synthetic 10W-30) but as a result my syncros have somewhat been worn down a little bit so i get the ocassional grind but i noticed that if i double clutch when u shifting from 2nd to 3rd i wont get a grind at all, i also get a grind when shifting into 5th on the highway after coasting in Neutral however i noticed that if i spike my Revs just a tiny bit she'll shift back into 5th as smooth as butter. the double clutching isnt a problem for me in fact its pretty much become second nature and i do it without realizing it on other manual transmission vehicles. so will double clutching work until i can afford to do a partial rebuild of my tranny? how long can i keep up with the double clutching to avoid a grind?
 
indefinitely.

the trans doesn't need syncros to function, just to shift smoothly.
 
As long as you keep doing it right
big trucks dont even have syncros in them

Mine had stinky gear oil in it when I got it, swapping it for some redline mtl, or mt90 got it shifting smooth again.

@ $40-50 gallon this may or may not be worth a shot to you
 
souske said:
As long as you keep doing it right
big trucks dont even have syncros in them

Mine had stinky gear oil in it when I got it, swapping it for some redline mtl, or mt90 got it shifting smooth again.

@ $40-50 gallon this may or may not be worth a shot to you
Click to expand...

wowwww is it really that expensive????
 
$14.49/qt at Summit Racing. I've been running MT90 in my AX15 for 10 years, and I won't run anything else.
 
I have changed mine once since then, due.to fears of contamination. Wrong, stuff looked the same as the day it went in.
Its pretty cheap when you consider an auto needing 3 qts every 5 oil changes
 
ChiXJeff said:
$14.49/qt at Summit Racing. I've been running MT90 in my AX15 for 10 years, and I won't run anything else.
Click to expand...

I will second that.

it made my 2nd to 3rd shift work again without a 2 second pause.

I haven't touched my trans in 5 years of hard wheeling.

advanced auto can order it for you if you want to get it locally.
 
thanks for all the info guys.... really appreciate it. i spent hours on fourm sites when before i changed my trans fluid reading of which kinds it can take and which kinds it cant i actually was able to detremine that penzoil syncromesh works fine for these transmissions because on the back it is clearly written as "Yellow metal friendly" but again its more expensive option. i am just shocked by the fact that the folks who rebuild the transmission for my jeeps previous owner used a GL-4 or 5 Gear oil when it has brass syncros.... everyone knows sulfur is deadly to brass so why would they even consider using it? i actually did not know that the AX-15 had had brass syncros until i went onto the forum sites and saw that it does i guess its a good thing i did some research before following what my manual said.... but the 10W-30 seems to be working fine for me at the moment im going to to a few more treatments of the 10W-30 just to clean out what's left of that disgusting gear oil that was originally in there then ill switch over to the MTL-90 or syncromesh
 
One other thing to consider. Synthetic works a lot better at low temps than dino juice. With MT90 in my AX15 down around zero F, even from a cold start in the morning, it doesn't feel like it's filled with peanut butter.
 
87manche said:
indefinitely.

the trans doesn't need syncros to function, just to shift smoothly.
Click to expand...

Mine had GL-4 for just a few weeks (500 miles maybe) after the major rebuild, and suddenly refused to shift at all. Figured out the issue, drained the GL-4, and put in MT-90 and never looked back, that was 5-6 years ago and a good 70,000 miles back.

The fluid was filled with brass in just weeks of using the Gl-4 by mistake. The brass synchros were brand new.
 
995speed said:
thanks for all the info guys.... really appreciate it. i spent hours on fourm sites when before i changed my trans fluid reading of which kinds it can take and which kinds it cant i actually was able to detremine that penzoil syncromesh works fine for these transmissions because on the back it is clearly written as "Yellow metal friendly" but again its more expensive option. i am just shocked by the fact that the folks who rebuild the transmission for my jeeps previous owner used a GL-4 or 5 Gear oil when it has brass syncros.... everyone knows sulfur is deadly to brass so why would they even consider using it? i actually did not know that the AX-15 had had brass syncros until i went onto the forum sites and saw that it does i guess its a good thing i did some research before following what my manual said.... but the 10W-30 seems to be working fine for me at the moment im going to to a few more treatments of the 10W-30 just to clean out what's left of that disgusting gear oil that was originally in there then ill switch over to the MTL-90 or syncromesh
Click to expand...



It confuses me why you would put lighter oil in a gearbox, than is recommended, unless you were operating in severe cold weather.

GL4 is the (as I understand) proper fluid for the AX-15, The error is GL5 is not, even thought that is what some owners manuals recommend.

The smell is a gear oil thing.



Ecomike said:
Mine had GL-4 for just a few weeks (500 miles maybe) after the major rebuild, and suddenly refused to shift at all. Figured out the issue, drained the GL-4, and put in MT-90 and never looked back, that was 5-6 years ago and a good 70,000 miles back.

The fluid was filled with brass in just weeks of using the Gl-4 by mistake. The brass synchros were brand new.
Click to expand...

MT-90.. Is Gl4
http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=46&pcid=7



I'm running AMSOIL in mine
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/mtg.aspx
 
muduck18 said:
It confuses me why you would put lighter oil in a gearbox, than is recommended, unless you were operating in severe cold weather.

GL4 is the (as I understand) proper fluid for the AX-15, The error is GL5 is not, even thought that is what some owners manuals recommend.

The smell is a gear oil thing.
MT-90.. Is Gl4
http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=46&pcid=7

I'm running AMSOIL in mine
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/mtg.aspx
Click to expand...

IIRC the GL-4 listing is an OEM manual typo error? Others might be able to confirm this. It has been 5+ years since I think I read that here. The GL-4 I had used had reactive sulfur in it, so I guess all GL-4s are not created equal, and the MT-90 is also GL-3! My memory is a bit fuzzy on this now, so it might have been GL-4, GL-5 dual spec I had used. Been too long, not sure anymore. The MT-90 claims to meet GL1, GL-3 and GL-4 specs. Mine is not an AX-15, but is a very similar Nissan 5 speed manual (on my 85 Nissan SD22 diesel transplant to my 85 Jeep).
 
Last edited:
from doing hours of research i have concluded that GL-4 and 5 will nto work because both contain sulfur. sulfur and brass syncros do not mix. and i ran the 10-30 it is extremely close in viscosity to GL 75-90
 
My 95 went about 150 thousand miles on Valvoline synthetic, still running when retired at 262K miles, and my 99 about a hundred thousand on Dino oil meant for synchros until a clutch malfunction ate the reverse at something around 250K. So I put the 95 box in, and ran it on motor oil for another year or so. All these worked fine. As long as there's no sulfur in it, it's a pretty forgiving box.
 
995speed said:
from doing hours of research i have concluded that GL-4 and 5 will nto work because both contain sulfur. sulfur and brass syncros do not mix. and i ran the 10-30 it is extremely close in viscosity to GL 75-90
Click to expand...

I think you're right. I was running on my terrible memory. However if its "yellow safe" like the amsoil/MT-90 its fine.


Ecomike said:
IIRC the GL-4 listing is an OEM manual typo error? Others might be able to confirm this. It has been 5+ years since I think I read that here. The GL-4 I had used had reactive sulfur in it, so I guess all GL-4s are not created equal, and the MT-90 is also GL-3! My memory is a bit fuzzy on this now, so it might have been GL-4, GL-5 dual spec I had used. Been too long, not sure anymore. The MT-90 claims to meet GL1, GL-3 and GL-4 specs. Mine is not an AX-15, but is a very similar Nissan 5 speed manual (on my 85 Nissan SD22 diesel transplant to my 85 Jeep).
Click to expand...


yes and no, the GL5 is what is printed in the manual, and GL3 is what was in the FSM now that I actually got off my lazy bum and looked it up.
the 5 and 4 were wrong.

I think this fella summed it up quite nicely.
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=11998578
Jerry Bransford said:
First, the AX-15 does not require GL-5. If you read that in an early TJ owner's manual or factory service manual, you need to know that information was printed in error and Jeep later corrected that mistake in later versions of the manuals by specifying a GL-3 75W-90.

The AX-15 (and AX-5) requires either a GL-3 or GL-4 (or a GL-5 specifically ok with "yellow metals") 75W-90 when using a gear lube. That error was around a couple years before it was caught and corrected. Corrected manuals specify GL-3 with GL-4 being an improved version of GL-3. GL-5 is not an updated or improved version of GL-4, GL-5 is a completely different type of gear lube that is primarily for use in axles.

Second, it was several years ago when the transmission's manufacturer (Aisin) added synthetic 10W-30 engine oil to its list of acceptable and recommended lubricants. So Mobil-1 10W-30 actually meets the transmission manufacturer's requirements and is shown as a recommended alternative to a GL-3 or GL-4 75W-90.

Why the seemingly wide difference in the two viscosities (75W-90 vs. 10W-30)? Because engine oils and gear lubes are not measured the same way, those two lubricants are actually very similar in their actual viscosity.
Click to expand...
 
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