Looking for some help welding in OC area

Wanted to see if anyone in orange county area can help out with welding on TNT stiffeners. I don't expect free work but maybe cheaper than a shop. I will do all the prep work my self if it helps. Let me know please and thank you.

If you want to get the prep work done yourself, you're going to need to drill as many holes as you feel comfortable drilling in the stiffeners themselves. Usually around 1/2-5/8 are where you want to be. Stagger them ever couple inches. This is a pain in the ass... This is why I like HD Offroad stiffeners and Ruff Stuff stiffeners better, pre-drilled holes.

The other kicker is removing all the undercoating and as much galvanization as possible from the "frame". But when you do this, make sure you do it no more than a day or two before you weld them up, or it'll start to rust.

Ya I saw those stiffeners. But I liked the one piece boxed in style of TNT. It seems like it would be stronger. And less welding. Then again I'm not an engineer. Haha. So a bunch of plug holes and what's the best way of clearing the under coating?

Ya I saw those stiffeners. But I liked the one piece boxed in style of TNT. It seems like it would be stronger. And less welding. Then again I'm not an engineer. Haha. So a bunch of plug holes and what's the best way of clearing the under coating?

Huh? Both the HD offroad engineering braces and the Ruff Stuff braces are boxed the same as the TNT stiffeners. They both have holes pre-drilled. The Ruff Stuff stiffeners also go up the frame further. I've got the TNT stiffeners, and found them to be too thick for my liking. I would have preferred the thinner gauge material of the HD stiffeners or the Ruff Stuff stiffeners but they weren't making them when I installed mine. You'll find that welding the 3/16" to the thin sheet metal it a bit tough to get a good weld on without burning through the frame rail. Either way, they work just the same once they're welded on.

Ruff stuff:



HD Offroad:






As for the under coating, a flapper wheel seemed to be what worked best for me. A sand blaster would be your best bet, but I've never tried it. Let us know how it goes!

I used a wire wheel to get the worst of it off, and a flap wheel to do the final pass.
You should also look into picking up some weld-thru primer.

Where are you at in the OC?

I'm in lapalma just west of Buena park

Sorry I was mistaken I was thinking of roc dog stiffeners.

souske said:

I used a wire wheel to get the worst of it off, and a flap wheel to do the final pass.
You should also look into picking up some weld-thru primer.

Where are you at in the OC?

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this is my plan. i tried using a flap wheel from the get go when i did my sliders, and it smeared a lot and loaded the flap wheel with rubber. i think i'll try scraping it first. to get the bulk off.
i didnt notice any issues with burning through when i welded on my sliders (1/4" plate), but i guess it depends on the welder settings and who's doing it.

Vanimal said:

this is my plan. i tried using a flap wheel from the get go when i did my sliders, and it smeared a lot and loaded the flap wheel with rubber. i think i'll try scraping it first. to get the bulk off.
i didnt notice any issues with burning through when i welded on my sliders (1/4" plate), but i guess it depends on the welder settings and who's doing it.

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Or it means you're not getting a good penetrating weld... There's no way you're going to sufficiently melt 1/4" plate to what... 18 gauge sheet metal that the XJ "frame" is. Regardless of whether it's stacked over or not. I'm not saying it didn't stick, but I can tell you it's not doing anything more for you than a 10 gauge or 1/8" thick stiffener is doing.

Wire wheel to get the undercoating off, then a flap wheel or stripper wheel to remove the galvanized coating.

crazyjim said:

Or it means you're not getting a good penetrating weld... There's no way you're going to sufficiently melt 1/4" plate to what... 18 gauge sheet metal that the XJ "frame" is. Regardless of whether it's stacked over or not.

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that is incorrect. you can weld a thick metal to a thin sheet or vise versa, but you need to burn the thicker metal first and melt it into the thinner material. two equal thicknesses are easier in the fact that you can burn both at equal amounts. beginner welders learn this way. a good welder can easily burn sheet to 1/2" or vise versa. you just need to know how.

crazyjim said:

Or it means you're not getting a good penetrating weld... There's no way you're going to sufficiently melt 1/4" plate to what... 18 gauge sheet metal that the XJ "frame" is. Regardless of whether it's stacked over or not. I'm not saying it didn't stick, but I can tell you it's not doing anything more for you than a 10 gauge or 1/8" thick stiffener is doing.

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i crank it up to 90 amps turn my wire feed down just above the point where it starts causing issues with blobing or sticking at the tip, then i put most of the heat to the 1/4 plate then cross over to the sheet metal just long enough to not burn through. looking at the bead, it seems to penetrate the 1/4" decently as the weld is somewhat recessed at the edges much like tig welding without using a lot of filler rod.
the rest of the slider is tig welded.
BTW, i'm talking about rock sliders, not stiffeners. just saying i didnt have a problem welding them so i dont suspect the stiffeners will be an issue.

with that said, i'm definitely not a pro, i'm self taught and my welds are not very pretty, but they usually stick fine. i'm definitely open to any advice i dont have the greatest mig, it's just a cheaper lincoln 90a 110v one with a tank of steelmix gas.

2stix said:

that is incorrect. you can weld a thick metal to a thin sheet or vise versa, but you need to burn the thicker metal first and melt it into the thinner material. two equal thicknesses are easier in the fact that you can burn both at equal amounts. beginner welders learn this way. a good welder can easily burn sheet to 1/2" or vise versa. you just need to know how.

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this is what i always thought. it may not be the strongest but i always figured the sheetmetal around the weld would tear before the weld broke off the 1/4" piece. not that that's any better lol

2stix said:

that is incorrect. you can weld a thick metal to a thin sheet or vise versa, but you need to burn the thicker metal first and melt it into the thinner material. two equal thicknesses are easier in the fact that you can burn both at equal amounts. beginner welders learn this way. a good welder can easily burn sheet to 1/2" or vise versa. you just need to know how.

Click to expand...

I didn't say you couldn't weld thick to thin... Please don't mis-quote me. What I said was, that welding 1/4" plate to sheet metal is no better than welding 1/8" plate to sheet metal. You're still at the mercy of the weld when it flexes, and that's where it'll break first. Nowhere did I say it couldn't be done. Please see the following post for an example...

Vanimal said:

i crank it up to 90 amps turn my wire feed down just above the point where it starts causing issues with blobing or sticking at the tip, then i put most of the heat to the 1/4 plate then cross over to the sheet metal just long enough to not burn through. looking at the bead, it seems to penetrate the 1/4" decently as the weld is somewhat recessed at the edges much like tig welding without using a lot of filler rod.
the rest of the slider is tig welded.
BTW, i'm talking about rock sliders, not stiffeners. just saying i didnt have a problem welding them so i dont suspect the stiffeners will be an issue.

with that said, i'm definitely not a pro, i'm self taught and my welds are not very pretty, but they usually stick fine. i'm definitely open to any advice i dont have the greatest mig, it's just a cheaper lincoln 90a 110v one with a tank of steelmix gas.

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Well done, weld looks great, but proves my point. Look at the 1/8" of lip you have left on that material. While you achieved what you were attempting, by connecting the 1/4 plate to the sheet metal, you have done so rather in-efficiently. You would have been better off stacking two thinner plates on top of each other like so:






But then I guess what to guys who run 100 mph through the desert know about keeping something together? :dunno:

thanks, and i know what you're taking about and dont doubt your experience, but the purpose of using the 1/4" plate was so i had something sturdy to weld the somewhat small surface area of the perpendicular tube that tees into it. basically just to spread the load over xxxxxxx amount of surface area on the frame instead of xx amount on the frame. if i welded a 1.5x1.5" square tube in the center of a .125x3x6" plate then welded the perimeter of that 1/8" plate to the frame, the square tube would flex the center of that plate a bit and wouldnt be as rigid. i suppose i could rosette weld a few spots around it to help some, but that would have been more work
but that's all really irrelivant now since i'm installing frame stiffeners pretty soon here. they're the t&t ones, and i wish i got the other ones mentioned, but that's a product of me not doing my homework. I can make quick work of the holes on the mill though.

and nice welds!


and just to be extra clear, the 1/4" plate is only for the rock rails. the frame stiffeners are 3/16".

souske said:

You should also look into picking up some weld-thru primer.

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Do you actually use this crap? If so, what kinda welder are you using?

In the past ive taken home free steel leftovers from a jobsite, then thrown it away because it had this crap on it.... From my understanding, its weld thru when using a high amp ARC welding setup (as in thick structural steel). On normal thickness, MIG welding, i wouldnt wish this stuff on my worst enemy, it spits and throws weld balls like crazy, and still burns off 1/2" from the weld, leaving a nice streak of rust paralel to the welds down the road.

Vanimal said:

thanks, and i know what you're taking about and dont doubt your experience, but the purpose of using the 1/4" plate was so i had something sturdy to weld the somewhat small surface area of the perpendicular tube that tees into it. basically just to spread the load over xxxxxxx amount of surface area on the frame instead of xx amount on the frame. if i welded a 1.5x1.5" square tube in the center of a .125x3x6" plate then welded the perimeter of that 1/8" plate to the frame, the square tube would flex the center of that plate a bit and wouldnt be as rigid. i suppose i could rosette weld a few spots around it to help some, but that would have been more work
but that's all really irrelivant now since i'm installing frame stiffeners pretty soon here. they're the t&t ones, and i wish i got the other ones mentioned, but that's a product of me not doing my homework. I can make quick work of the holes on the mill though.

and nice welds!


and just to be extra clear, the 1/4" plate is only for the rock rails. the frame stiffeners are 3/16".

Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong, your method is 100 times better than welding a tube straight to the sheet metal frame, my arguement was with the original stiffeners, 3/16" vs. a 10 ga., you've got no advantage to running a 3/16" steel. People on this forum got wrapped up for a long time with how "thin" the HD offroad stiffeners were compared to the TNT stiffeners, they don't understand they're really not gaining anything other than weight. As for your 1/4" for 1/8" argument on the rock rails, I would probably disagree with that. Rock rails don't see that much lateral movement at the frame. Figure you're welding in 3 different places, and also attaching it to the pinch seam. If you really wanted 1/4", you'd have been better off stacking plate like pictured.

As for doubting my experience, I didn't mean to come off as an elitist prick, I'm going by the experience of others. I'd LOVE to get to 100+ in the whoops, but sadly that'll never happen in my Jeep. Also, not my welds, pulled from other desert builds.



To add to that, when I installed my stiffeners, I noticed an improvement in "creaks" and what not in the Jeep for about 2 weeks. After that they all came back. This is with street driving btw. I attribute this to the fact that the stiffeners are only as strong as the weld on the sheet metal. I noticed a HUGE improvement when I added the Currie / T&J style tube stiffeners on top of that, along with the TNT 1/8" front frame plates. It's nice when you can actually feel the suspension working rather than the body flexing.

XCM: yes, this stuff has worked well for me : SEM copperweld. It doesn't mess with the weld hardly at all, and helps to dissipate heat when welding on thin stuff. No problems on the engine driven lincoln arc rig at my old job, or on my cheap HF 110 flux core at home. Picked it up at a local autobody supply shop, guess they use it for panel replacement.