water pumps?

i have heard that running a high flow water pump helps the engine run cooler. one in particular i have heard about is the "flow kooler" pump from quadratec. will this really make a difference or will i just waste my money? my xj has the renix 4.0 in it.

search for pics, the flowkooler is a gimmick, its basically got a disc rivetted to the origbinal oem impeller.... so much for high tech right? theres even talk of it coming undone , it was johnnyc if i remember correctly.

theres also a hesco that has a all-new impeller, for a little more money.

ok thanks for that info but my main question was will a high flow pump improve cooling?

in my case it did improve cooling. i swapped in a hesco pump and larger thermo housing on my '01 and now it stays closer to the 210 mark and below. previously it would hit 220 easily around town and crawling - aux fan would run alot. now during cooler months it rarely gets above 200-205. this is based off of reading the dash guage, no idea of the actual temp...just saying it made a diff in the temp remaining more stable.

It will probably not help at all other than if your stock pump was failing.

Pumping coolant faster may not help at all. Especially if you are still running a stock volume radiator, have a clogged up system, or any one of a million other reasons. I don't realy believe in any of the thermo/wp/housing upgrades in a stock or even mildly built rig.

For your consideration:

I am running a 4.7L stroker, with a stock water pump, 195deg thermo, stock housing, normal hoses, with heater core intact. The only upgrade is a Heatbuster radiator from Advance, which was a great improvement. I ditched the AC condensor when I got rid of the AC components. I am not running a Mechanical or electric fan, mainly because I have not had the time to install a setup. While driving in the 95deg heat the other day as I was giving her a little excercise, I never broke 200deg. Without the fans it would creep up while stopped. Granted, this is not my DD, but I still drive her for at least an hour once a week to keep everything running.

Clif Notes: Skip the high dollar thermo/housing/and WP. Go with Quality stock parts there and invest in a nice radiator.

I would recommend a CSF 3 core all brass rad. DPG offroad has em for $180 last time I checked.

I have ALWAYS had good luck with Cardone select NEW pumps. Friggen $25 at RockAuto: http://cardone.com/English/club/members/customer/ecat_brands/imageinfo.asp?PARTNUM=55-33116

I have one in my TJ, and have another ready to go in my Wagoneer. Also replace your fan clutch.

often a new pump, clutch, t state and a good flush are all it takes. Coolant also goes bad, sometimes in as little as 2 years!

bails85 said:

ok thanks for that info but my main question was will a high flow pump improve cooling?

Click to expand...

With the FlowKooler, only at or just above idle....


The FlowKooler is designed to run a higher flow rate at idle and low RPM's. At speed, not so much.

I've had mine for about a year and a half and it works as advertised. At idle it takes longer to trigger the E-fan and the fan comes on less often than it did with the stock pump.

If you are having issues with cooling, you might want to investigate what is causing those issues rather than just start throwing Hi-Perf parts at it.


And no, a 180* thermostat won't automatically lower your engine's running temperature.....

my cooling system works ok but i like it to run about 180 on my cars. i was just curios to know if the hi flow pumps work?

why do you want it to run 180? The system was designed for 200-210.

because 210 is straight up. i like my cars to run a little before half. i do understand that its not going to happen in my xj. i am just one of those people who stare at the temp guage praying that it doesnt pop its top.

You are going to have a very hard time getting an XJ to run at 180*. They like to run warmer and don't have the cooling capacity to run cool.

My thoughts are that more flow is not going to help anything. There will be less time for the fluid to absorb the heat from the block and expend the heat in the radiator.

I replaced my pump with a GMB pump from advance and it is working great so far. The new pump and thermostat (180 degree not that it matters) and electric fans and my jeep runs at 190 on the street and 200ish on the trail.

bails85 said:

because 210 is straight up. i like my cars to run a little before half. i do understand that its not going to happen in my xj. i am just one of those people who stare at the temp guage praying that it doesnt pop its top.

Click to expand...

Let me clarify: You want to have your motor run at a temp that is NOT optimum for its combustion cycle, based only on the idea that you don't like it when the needle points up. You get no gain or benefit from it running that cool. You are going against the designers work and engineering, only for aesthetics. Or maybe for some vague idea that cooler is better, or that the upper half of a gauge is bad.

Did I get that right?

The difference between a stock pump and a high flow pump is the impellor. It is not just a disk attached... The stock pump impellor has what can only be described as "paddles" that churn the coolant into the block. All of the high flow pumps, including the one from Mopar, have a spiral cut from the shaft out to the ends of the disk. This causes the coolant to fling off of the impellor with substantially less cavitation. All pumps cavitate. Like the propellor on a boat (or Sub...). The act of forcing the coolant to move quickly creates bubbles (cavitation) this reduced the effectiveness of the pump.

Ever see a Jet-Ski? That is a water jet. A pump. Notice the white in the propulsion stream? Cavitation caused inside of the fully submersed pump.

Is a high flow pump a good idea? I think so, but then I have replaced all that with a 115 Liter per Minute Electric Pump. It cavitates as well, just not as much at any mechanical made. Here is a video that goes a long way to explain water pump performance. Yes, this is the manufacturer I use and no, I am not a selling dealer... It should be noted that I use a Ford Fan, not a Davies-Craig unit. Decision based on cost. $16 out of the JY.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrfux_-6RVw

Hope this helps. If I did not run all electric, I would definately run a high flow. In the video, Richard (fine Chap by the way) notes that they found some mechanical pumps to drop off flow at higher RPMs. This is the case, insofar as I am aware, in all of the high flow pumps as the high rate is not needed at the upper end. The drag on the engine is still there though...

It should also be noted that Bernie at Hesco was the first to design this pump and that the Mopar unit is his design.

BTW, my Heep operates between 194F and 201F all day, every day.

180F T-Stat and the Electrics. I have the controller set to 90C (194F) so it ultimately controls the temps. I use a T-Stat to decease the time needed to warm up the rig.

Rule of thumb says that a coolant system should operate 12F to 15F degrees over T-Stat rating. If it is running hotter than that, you have a problem. So 195F T-Stat, 207F to 210F.

Subscribing.........

bails85 said:

because 210 is straight up. i like my cars to run a little before half. i do understand that its not going to happen in my xj. i am just one of those people who stare at the temp guage praying that it doesnt pop its top.

Click to expand...

the water pump does not affect the temperature your motor runs. It is the thermostats job to keep heat IN the motor. If you replace the pump with a hi performance one and still use the 195* thermostat it will still run at 200*.

as to your worry about the gauge, don't worry about it. It's supposed to run at 210, anything less and you'll get bad things that happen in the crankcase. Not to mention that the ECU needs to see at least 150 before it goes closed loop. (measured at the block temp sensor)

I've had my temp gauge waaayy past the 260 mark. Horizontal with the needle pointing at the screw to the right. Twice. My motor is still fine. Don't worry about it.

So, in short, don't monkey with the cooling system unless you're having overheat problems. It's working how AMC designed it and your 4.0 is really happy at 210-215.

open your gauge cluster up. Turn the needle for the temp gauge about 10-15 degrees counterclockwise on the shaft.

This will solve your "problem".

Wow, kastein has actually posted so much that his post count recycled. Nice.

Good advice too