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Hard Start Issue RENIX

sam24th

NAXJA Forum User
Location
charlotte NC
I have a 1990 Renix Laredo 4.0 cherokee that lately has been giving me starting issues. I will sit there cranking it for a good 30 secs or so before it fires up. I know its getting fuel fine and I actually managed to flood the engine once. Battery is good as gold as I jsut replaced it with a brand new one. Prior to relacing the battery it was still hard to start so battery is not an issue. Fuel pressure and fuel pump are fine. Im leaning towards a spark problem. Anyone have ideas as to what I should check first? Im at school right now so I will check the spark plugs once I get home. Just thought Id get some ideas first.
 
My IAC sticks on occasion, seems to be worse when it's cold out. It sticks shut and effectively starves the engine of air. If mine doesn't start right up with no pedal, my immediate action is to depress the gas pedal maybe and inch and try again.
If you keep trying to start with no pedal, it is likely to flood, when the IAC is stuck closed. Just one possibility among many.
No spark may be the CPS, weak spark can have many reasons. Weak spark usually doesn't cause a no start, but will mess with your idle and cause a miss at idle.
 
The IAC might be a possbility ill try cleaning it out when I get home. Also Ive noticed that if I start it up and turn the engine off and leave for a short bit then come back itll start right up usually instantly. If its been sitting for an hour or more itll usually take 20-40 secs granted I dont flood the engine.
 
My IAC sticks on occasion, seems to be worse when it's cold out. It sticks shut and effectively starves the engine of air. If mine doesn't start right up with no pedal, my immediate action is to depress the gas pedal maybe and inch and try again.
If you keep trying to start with no pedal, it is likely to flood, when the IAC is stuck closed. Just one possibility among many.
No spark may be the CPS, weak spark can have many reasons. Weak spark usually doesn't cause a no start, but will mess with your idle and cause a miss at idle.


My buddy is back! :yelclap:You were missed here 8MUD!

Sam24th, check out my recent posts on the CPS, crankshaft position sensor. Get a meter out and back probe it, test the cranking voltage...
 
I checked the sensor and it was about 220 ohms. Also cleaned out the IAC and it still does the same thing. Sparkplugs are still good also.
 
My 89 did this, somebody told me to remove the CPS and clean it. So i said what the hell, i'll try anything once.So i removed and cleaned all the grease and crap off of it and reinstalled..It has been starting right up ever sense..I also cleaned the mounting area..I don't know if it was from the dirt or i just got lucky..this was about a year ago
 
My 89 did this, somebody told me to remove the CPS and clean it. So i said what the hell, i'll try anything once.So i removed and cleaned all the grease and crap off of it and reinstalled..It has been starting right up ever sense..I also cleaned the mounting area..I don't know if it was from the dirt or i just got lucky..this was about a year ago
Funny I did about the same thing, mine was covered in oil sling from the dreaded rear main seal leak. I was getting no spark. Figured I'd clean the area up some before swapping it out, dumped a bit of really hot soapy water on it, scrubbed around a little with a bottle brush and rinsed with really hot water. Decided to try it one more time for the heck of it and it started right up. I really can't see how being oil covered would affect it any, but it seems it does.

I've also had a CPS that ohm tested good and was still bad, no spark is a sign your CPS is toast or there is some sort of resistance in the wiring between the CPS and the ECU.

Just for the heck of it, try key to run, then off, then run, then off then start.

Another quick check might be to go to the "BAL" pin (I think) on the starter relay, the one with the orange and black wire hooked to it and do a voltage check while someone is cranking the motor over. Though it doesn't sound like a fuel problem, if it's flooding.

Might try going to the larger yellow wire on the coil (ignition module) and checking the voltage there while someone is cranking it over.

Check your spark, a good spot is at the coil to cap wire, should be a sharp spark thin and mostly blue with say a !/4 arch. If it is thick and yellow or intermittent you may have weak spark. Weak spark won't usually keep it from starting, but will make it idle badly.

Just a few quick checks that may be helpful.
 
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My buddy is back! :yelclap:You were missed here 8MUD!

Sam24th, check out my recent posts on the CPS, crankshaft position sensor. Get a meter out and back probe it, test the cranking voltage...

Heck what do know I've got a fan club.:looney:
 
Funny I did about the same thing, mine was covered in oil sling from the dreaded rear main seal leak. I was getting no spark. Figured I'd clean the area up some before swapping it out, dumped a bit of really hot soapy water on it, scrubbed around a little with a bottle brush and rinsed with really hot water. Decided to try it one more time for the heck of it and it started right up. I really can't see how being oil covered would affect it any, but it seems it does.

I've also had a CPS that ohm tested good and was still bad, no spark is a sign your CPS is toast or there is some sort of resistance in the wiring between the CPS and the ECU.

Just for the heck of it, try key to run, then off, then run, then off then start.

Another quick check might be to go to the "BAL" pin (I think) on the starter relay, the one with the orange and black wire hooked to it and do a voltage check while someone is cranking the motor over. Though it doesn't sound like a fuel problem, if it's flooding.

Might try going to the larger yellow wire on the coil (ignition module) and checking the voltage there while someone is cranking it over.

Check your spark, a good spot is at the coil to cap wire, should be a sharp spark thin and mostly blue with say a !/4 arch. If it is thick and yellow or intermittent you may have weak spark. Weak spark won't usually keep it from starting, but will make it idle badly.

Just a few quick checks that may be helpful.


You jogged my memory a bit. Now I remember the CPS picking up material that wore off the clutch, causing a weak signal. The material was attracted to the CPS as if it were a magnet.
 
Well I guess it was just all the dirt and oil around and on it. I decided to take it off and clean the snot out of it aswell as all the areas around it. Now it cranks up just fine. Guess it just needed a lil bit of cleaning.
 
Well I guess it was just all the dirt and oil around and on it. I decided to take it off and clean the snot out of it aswell as all the areas around it. Now it cranks up just fine. Guess it just needed a lil bit of cleaning.

Glad to hear you got her running. Like i said it has worked for about a year now. Now go out and have fun
 
You jogged my memory a bit. Now I remember the CPS picking up material that wore off the clutch, causing a weak signal. The material was attracted to the CPS as if it were a magnet.

Hmm, perhaps that is because it has a magnet in it? LOL
 
Hmm, perhaps that is because it has a magnet in it? LOL

That is a possibility, I guess. LOL I remember it was way more common on manual trans vehicles. Whatever wore off the clutch stuck to the CPS, limiting the signal generated by the flywheel passing by.

Still would have been interested in a before and after voltage output reading.

Another reason to test the old Renix CPSs for AC voltage output instead of relying solely on the ohm reading, huh?.
 
The steel pressure plate wears as well as the clutch , tossing iron fines all over. They would collect on the magnetic tip of the CPS. It might have distorted the timing signal by broadening the effective metal tip size / location and weakened the signal peak
 
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