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cant get any good welds for frame stiffeners

W

wishihad1

NAXJA Forum User
Location
charlottesville, VA
hey everybody

well tonight I finally got to the point of welding my frame stiffeners up. what I thought would be a 1 night project turned into a 4 day project.

trying to make the ruffstuff frame stiffeners work with the RK 3 link brackets was a real PITA, and the cross member holes weren't in the right place either.

well i started welding and was getting burn through holes with the welder set to do 3/16ths. so i tried turning down the voltage a notch and turning up the wire speed a notch. well same result.

any suggestions, i stopped after getting my first couple burn throughs to try to correct the problem
 
What size wire? You could step down to .023 but you will use more wire. I welded on my Detours slider/stiffeners with my Hobart 125 set on the highest setting, wire feed at 45 and .030 wire. Got great penetration but i might have a weaker machine than you do.
 
I welded 3/16 angle to my subframe from the stock lca mount to the front leaf spring hanger. THEN I put the RK 3link brackets over the plating... Only thing I had to do different with the RK brackets was cut the like aluminum spacers in half and cut some of the pinch seam off the inside of the subframe... I did all that with a Hobart 135 turned wide ass open. Didn't burn thru once.
 
spend more time on the stiffener and just "wash" the puddle over to the frame. try to run as hot as you can with out burning through. try welding short sections at a time also to keep the heat down.
 
frames galvanized too. Have fun with that. i had 5 different people weld on my jeep(including my friend who is certified and welds seat frames at mastercraft) and noone could get a nice clean weld
 
ok.

Im thinking that theres no way i can keep my current settings. Im running a hobart 187. I used the setting on the machine as a starting point, but it was too high, and as soon as i focused ANY of the arc onto the frame i would get a hole.
 
turn heat and wirespeed down
 
XJRunner said:
frames galvanized too. Have fun with that. i had 5 different people weld on my jeep(including my friend who is certified and welds seat frames at mastercraft) and noone could get a nice clean weld
Click to expand...


Hmm I never seam to have a problem. I ust use a flapper to clean it up and then like stated before focus more on the part you are welding and less on the thin"frame" rail.
 
88xj 4.0 31" said:
turn heat and wirespeed down
Click to expand...

X2

I would use the 1/8" setting or the 12ga setting.

When welding thicker metal to a thinner base I will run a "c" pattern with a longer leg on the thicker metal. Try pushing on the thicker metal and then come back and do about half that distance pushed on the thinner metal.

In other words... Push on the thicker metal then come back to where you started then loop back to the other leg of the c and push half the distance that you did on the thicker stuff.
 
i used to have problems because of one of 3 or 4 things.
1- welding at bad angles. i wasnt a yoga student back then.
2- frame prep, i thought it was zinc plating? either way, it's gotta come off, and in the pinch seam it cant come off completely... if you can weld good on the frame rail, congrats. mine arent pretty, but i beleive theyre strong. make someone else prep for you. and keep sending them back to prep more.
3- wind. i gotta weld down at the street for stuff like this, ive got a couple peices of plywood for blocking the wind, but it'll still go under the vehicle.
4- inexperience. this isnt an ideal welding enviroment! after 2 or 3 sets of frame plates, im getting better (still not tig pretty, but i have my stretches of nirvana)
 
slcpunk74 said:
Hmm I never seam to have a problem. I just use a flapper to clean it up and then like stated before focus more on the part you are welding and less on the thin"frame" rail.
Click to expand...
You probably inadvertently sand all the zinc off while you're cleaning the frame. That, by the way is something else to look at. If you're getting a yellow/white residue around the finished, cooling weld, you've got zinc contamination in the weld ares.

Mig welders love clean, clean metal, and HATE everything else.
 
i've never had an issue welding anything to my jeep... maybe it has to do with prep. and like others have said the trick is the concentrate your heat on the thicker stuff, anyone can weld 2 pieces of metal together and make em stick. tbburg, mig welders hate to have a bad ground too. at least mine does! arc welders just need to be touching the same piece and it's happy. and as for the wind, its better to use flux-core vs the stuff that needs the stargold gas.
 
xcm said:
lol fluxcore.
Click to expand...
Hey laughing-boy, I made my sliders with a cheap-a** flux-core machine and they turned out great,...

(Except for the "being made out of metal that was too thin" thing. That part wasn't so great,... :roll: )
 
xcm, you use fluxcore wire in situations where wind is more of an issue, and you use inert gas in places like shops where conditions like wind/rain are controlled. inert gas is alot cleaner but it works just the same as fluxcore in the sense that it sticks 2 metals together...
 
:doh: Prep, Prep and Prep again. I am no expert by any means but if you prep correctly, things turn out better. As for burn through, it is very thin compared to the stiffeners obviously. My uncle and cousin who are good welders had problems welding the unibody on my beater Jeep because its so thin.
 
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Get the metal as clean as possible, use a lower setting on the machine, weld only about an inch at a time, concentrate the heat on the thicker piece of metal and let the puddle just sort of touch the thin metal enough to barely melt it. Use plug welds on the flat sections of the stiffeners. Flux core wire will help alot if you have to weld outside. I hope that is a good summary of what people are saying above.
 
3/16 is definitely too high heat, those frame rails are like 10ga at the thickest, probably more like 12. Any rusting you have lowers the thickness even more - and you may not realize your jeep is rusted because the frame rails go from the inside out, much like the rockers, though you won't have much of an issue with that probably in VA.
 
Never really had any problems. Ive stick welded and MIGed on a few MJs and XJs. Prep Is really key like said. Also note the direction of your puddle. Push your puddle up to the frame side, dont pull it. Build a bigger puddle on the 3/16 then push. Dont try to weld up hill either... Thats for experienced guys (like a few years everday straight). Also everything Ive ever welded on was plated with a thinner material first. also stay away from square corners, round them off. ( Squared creates stress points) The main thickness Is really only 14 GA. (amazing they even stay together) thats my two pennies
 
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