Conflicting advice on RMS replacement....

I've got a '98 XJ that will get a new RMS installed this weekend. In preparation, I've gleened over all the writes up's, but there seems to be some conflicting advice on the use of RTV on the oil pan gasket.

I'll be using a single piece silcone gasket when I put it all back together. Some write up's say to use only a small dab of RT on the 4 corners of the pan. Other write up's, like 5-90's for older XJ's say use RTV all the way around, on both sides of the gasket. So which is it, for the later model XJ's?

I'm also going the route of using a few small zip ties to hold the gasket in place for the reinstall. Seem like a good way to keep the gasket in place from sliding around.

Thanks for any comments....

Ivan

I've done pan gaskets for over 45 years. My favorite way is to use "The Right Stuff". I smear it on the block and gasket(both sides), wait bout 5 minutes, then press the gasket into place. I then coat the pan surface and press the pan in place.

While "technically" there isn't a need for anything with a silicone gasket, it can't hurt and it sure makes installation A LOT easier. Keeps it in place and does give an extra measure of sealant. Biggest thing is not to overtighten.

My rule of thumb is always goo up the removable piece, makes clean up easier the next time its apart.

I followed somebody's advice and used anearobic RTV at the corners, the curved parts on the front and back of the pan, and up to the second bolt holes. No leaks after several months of running.

Here's a purty photo (don't be a hater if I did this wrong):



Also note the cool rubber band trick to keep the gasket in place.



This little tube cost me about 22 bucks, which is why I opted to use it on more than just the corners.




Oh, while you're in there, check the torque on your flywheel bolts. Getting the inspection cover of fis a bummer and you might as well check those during the RMS job.

Get yourself a Mopar gasket. It's got the sticky on the pan side of the gasket, so I didn't have to worry about zip ties or rubber bands or anything.

Ivan said:

I've got a '98 XJ that will get a new RMS installed this weekend. In preparation, I've gleened over all the writes up's, but there seems to be some conflicting advice on the use of RTV on the oil pan gasket.

I'll be using a single piece silcone gasket when I put it all back together. Some write up's say to use only a small dab of RT on the 4 corners of the pan. Other write up's, like 5-90's for older XJ's say use RTV all the way around, on both sides of the gasket. So which is it, for the later model XJ's?

I'm also going the route of using a few small zip ties to hold the gasket in place for the reinstall. Seem like a good way to keep the gasket in place from sliding around.

Thanks for any comments....

Ivan

Click to expand...

Sure you got that advice from me? I don't use anything when using the one-piece moulded rubber gasket, and I've not suggested that anyone else does, either (as far as I can recall.)

I do mention that the use of a few studs might be handy (2-4 should be plenty,) but I see no need to use RTV with the one-piece moulded gasket...)

5-90 said:

Sure you got that advice from me? I don't use anything when using the one-piece moulded rubber gasket, and I've not suggested that anyone else does, either (as far as I can recall.)

I do mention that the use of a few studs might be handy (2-4 should be plenty,) but I see no need to use RTV with the one-piece moulded gasket...)

Click to expand...

LOL...owned by your own thread. I sure got from you . Seems like most threads I researched, led to your post in the FAQ section. And I quote from this link:

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=101118

"Get and clean the oil sump pan. Get your tube of RTV Black (you’ll need it!) and your oil sump gasket. I am told that the newer version of the 4.0 oil sump gasket is of one-piece construction, and would be easier than the original four-piece arrangement to handle and keep in place. It will, however, fit all years of 4.0. Whichever gasket you use, apply a light bead of RTV Black to both sides, as this will help hold the gasket in place and make for a seal that is that important little bit better. Also, install at least four of the Small Block Chevy valve cover studs into the oil sump rails – at least two per side. Position the gasket in place over the studs, then press the oil sump against the gasket, using the studs to locate the sump pan."

That's what created all the confusion for me. I am going to use your stud suggestion too.... :roll:

I feel a strange disturbance in the Force...

What's wrong with the simple rubber band solution for holding the gasket in place? Who wants to deal with studs?

rocknxj said:

What's wrong with the simple rubber band solution for holding the gasket in place? Who wants to deal with studs?

Click to expand...

Nothing is wrong, it is one of the better solutions--cheap, quick, works.

Almost describes my first wife.

rocknxj said:

What's wrong with the simple rubber band solution for holding the gasket in place? Who wants to deal with studs?

Click to expand...

Hm. Anyone can pitch a no-hitter, but no-one bats a thousand...

I find studs easier because I can set everything in place, then hold it all up with one hand (without fear of it moving!) while I start nuts with the other. Four nuts later, I've got both hands free to get the rest of the screws in!

I'd forgotten I'd suggested RTV - I've not found it necessary, and haven't done it. Probably offered it as a "cheap insurance" idea more than anything else - those moulded gaskets work quite well! You can use it if you like - no particular reason not to - but if you clean the surfaces well, there's no real need to with the moulded rubber gasket. Just make sure you don't overtorque the screws - LocTite #222, RTV, or fingernail polish (any of these will work for what you need here,) and torque the 1/4"-20x1/2" screws to 84 pound-inches/7 pound-feet and the 5/16"-18x3/4" screws to 132 pound-inches/11 pound-feet (YES, use a torque wrench here! Too easy to screw up without it...)

rocknxj said:

What's wrong with the simple rubber band solution for holding the gasket in place? Who wants to deal with studs?

Click to expand...

I'm actually going to use both, except small zip ties instead of rubber bands; extra insurance if you will, so that I accidently don't move the gasket while reassembling everything. The studs will enable me to guide and secure the pan in place, while I get the pan bolts started.

I've got another related question... I'm thinking about replacing the oil pump as long as everything is opened up. I got replacement pump, but it didn't come with a oil pick up/strainer. I thought about using the old one off the old pump. Now in reading my FSM, it recommends I buy a new pick up/strainer as well; so that a perfect seal is maintained between the oil pump strainer. Any probelms using the old pick up/strainer? I'd hate to put this off another week to get a new pick up/strainer; so I'm halfway considering using the existiing oil pump since it still works pretty well and I have good oil pressure.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Did you paint the inside of the oil pan?????

What does a walrus, an oil pump pickup tube, and Tupperware all have in common?

They are all looking for a tight seal.

Use some soft jaws and hold the pickup tube in a vise--don't crush it! Find a suitable size piece of round stock, and tap it into the end of the pickup tube that goes into the oil pump--your objective is to expand the pickup tube enough to create a tight fit into the pump. And I mean a TIGHT fit. If when you go to pound the pickup tube into the oil pump it isn't a PITA, you didn't expand it enough.

Good luck.

Ivan said:

I'm actually going to use both, except small zip ties instead of rubber bands; extra insurance if you will, so that I accidently don't move the gasket while reassembling everything. The studs will enable me to guide and secure the pan in place, while I get the pan bolts started.

I've got another related question... I'm thinking about replacing the oil pump as long as everything is opened up. I got replacement pump, but it didn't come with a oil pick up/strainer. I thought about using the old one off the old pump. Now in reading my FSM, it recommends I buy a new pick up/strainer as well; so that a perfect seal is maintained between the oil pump strainer. Any probelms using the old pick up/strainer? I'd hate to put this off another week to get a new pick up/strainer; so I'm halfway considering using the existiing oil pump since it still works pretty well and I have good oil pressure.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Click to expand...

It's good, cheap insurance to use a new pickup when installing an oil pump, since it usually gets knackered about during removal. I don't know why oil pumps don't include one as a matter of course, unless it's to simplify logistics (one pump can be used for several engine configurations, using several different strainers.)

Easy way to install one?

- Put the pickup tube in the coldest freezer you have (there's a reason our deep-freeze is out in the garage...) Leave it there for at least two hours.
- Thirty minutes before you're set to take the pickup out of the freezer, turn your oven on to about 300*F. While it's getting hot, remove the cover plate and gasket from your new oil pump (since you'll need to anyhow.) You may remove the gear rotors or not - up to you.
- Put the pump in the oven for at least twenty minutes.
- Go find a good pair of gloves that will let you handle something hot.
- Go get the pickup from the freezer.
- Get the pump out of the oven.
- Press the two together. The large temperature difference should make it easier to do.
- Let the pump sit for at least an hour before you do anything else with it, so it gets back to room temperature.

Before you put the cover plate back on, pack the rotor cavities with grease to "prime" the pump (this will allow it to develop suction when you first run it.) Actually prime the pump by running it through the distributor mounting hole - you can use a flat-blade screwdriver or use a dedicated oil pump priming rod that has a drive tang (1/2" wide) and either no collar or a removable collar. Plug a mechanical oil pressure gage into the hole for the gage sensor, then run the pump (with a drill motor) until it develops pressure - then not less than two full minutes afterwards. (Naturally, this is after you've bolted the sump on and filled it with oil again.) Once you have consistent pressure, you can reinstall the distributor and finish the job.

If you don't prang the old pickup too badly removing it, and you get it nice and clean, you can reuse it - it just needs to pass inspection (no cracks or pinholes, no leftover crud, sealing surface still perfect, &c. If the pickup tube is imperfect, it can end up picking up air - which means the oil pump loses prime and you have problems.)