• Welcome to the new NAXJA Forum! If your password does not work, please use "Forgot your password?" link on the log-in page. Please feel free to reach out to [email protected] if we can provide any assistance.

Ball joint castle nut over torque, now what?

Sleeper

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Pittsburgh
Well i did my balljoints on the xj today and did not have TQ wrench, after all is said and done the castle nuts are past where the cotter pins go and now the pins are below the nuts. I should of payed attention but i was in a hurry to get done and back them down but it didnt feel tight so i put em as they were then put the cotter pins below the nut. Now what? Do i have to get new castle nuts and take off the spindle and re-do it? Are the ball joints shot now from being too tight?
021.gif
 
so are you saying that when you tighten the castle nut more, that it just keeps spinning? also, which joints are you referring to? tie rod, track bar?
 
no not spinning, i did the balljoints in my dana 30 tonight, the castle nuts i thightened to tight and they went passed the holes for the cotter pins, i did not have time to do anything so i just put pins in and they are below the castle nut now.
 
You want the castle nuts as tight as you can get them, you do not want the balljoint shaft spinning in the whole. Add washers to space the nut out more for the cotter pin.
 
from what i am reading you should torque at 80 and 75 ft pounds, i think that two of the mi over tq'd to get to where i am. Why would i need washers fi they are the right bj's? I do not see how i did this? i used an impact on the bottoms of which i should not have i see now. I am not sure what to do now..
 
agreed-- there is a torque spec, but I've often had the castle nut beyond the cotter pin hole before I've reached the spec.

run her tight and install the pin-- it's just to keep the nut from spinning off, so you'd probably notice the problem before the nut came off anyway.
 
I think it's a semantic issue of whether you should say the pin is above or below the nut. I think what's meant is that the nut has gone down so far that the cotter pin no longer engages with its notches. It sounds fishy that they should go down that much further unless you tightened them way way too much, or the knuckle was already worn, or unless there was supposed to be a washer. I'd be inclined to say you should pop them loose again if you can, and retorque them and see if things line up properly. If they don't, you may have to consider that the ball joint stud is stretched.

The torque spec for these is about what you'd expect to put on a wheel lug, which means good and snug, but not anywhere near to what you would put on, for example, the axle nut, and nothing that would require a cheater bar. There should be enough give or take in the torque spec so that if your nut doesn't line up with a hole, you can tighten it a little more until it does.

I'd suggest just putting a washer under the nut, but without knowing how much torque was applied to get into your current situation, I'd hesitate to recommend it owing to the possibility that the ball joint stud is weakened. It seems pretty unlikely, and if I were in this situation, I'd probably try retorquing and use a washer if needed, but I can't make that recommendation without some sense of how mightily that stud was overstressed or stretched.

edit to add: while I was writing this I see an impact wrench has entered the discussion. Definitely, pop them and try retorquing, but if they don't fit right on the second try, I'd play it safe and swallow the cost. An impact wrench, if it's working right, will go way way past the recommended torque, and I don't think there's any such thing as a convenient time or place for a ball joint stud to break off.
 
Last edited:
shorty, so you are saying you have come across this problem before? Someone said i prob screwed up the sleeve? I saw no sleeve.....

Somone else said the balljoint is screwed now, i do not know what to think but i am frustrated to beyond beleif....
 
I think it's a semantic issue of whether you should say the pin is above or below the nut. I think what's meant is that the nut has gone down so far that the cotter pin no longer engages with its notches. It sounds fishy that they should go down that much further unless you tightened them way way too much, or the knuckle was already worn, or unless there was supposed to be a washer. I'd be inclined to say you should pop them loose again if you can, and retorque them and see if things line up properly. If they don't, you may have to consider that the ball joint stud is stretched.

The torque spec for these is about what you'd expect to put on a wheel lug, which means good and snug, but not anywhere near to what you would put on, for example, the axle nut, and nothing that would require a cheater bar. There should be enough give or take in the torque spec so that if your nut doesn't line up with a hole, you can tighten it a little more until it does.

I'd suggest just putting a washer under the nut, but without knowing how much torque was applied to get into your current situation, I'd hesitate to recommend it owing to the possibility that the ball joint stud is weakened. It seems pretty unlikely, and if I were in this situation, I'd probably try retorquing and use a washer if needed, but I can't make that recommendation without some sense of how mightily that stud was overstressed or stretched.
Well i can grab a TQ wrenc form work tomorrow and see, but should i take the knuckle off again or just take the castle nuts off and put new ones on and torque? If it is sitted to wherever it is now that( and if) it is over tightened then putting new nuts on would just do the same thing right? Thanks guys for all you help
 
I think it's a semantic issue of whether you should say the pin is above or below the nut. I think what's meant is that the nut has gone down so far that the cotter pin no longer engages with its notches. It sounds fishy that they should go down that much further unless you tightened them way way too much, or the knuckle was already worn, or unless there was supposed to be a washer. I'd be inclined to say you should pop them loose again if you can, and retorque them and see if things line up properly. If they don't, you may have to consider that the ball joint stud is stretched.

The torque spec for these is about what you'd expect to put on a wheel lug, which means good and snug, but not anywhere near to what you would put on, for example, the axle nut, and nothing that would require a cheater bar. There should be enough give or take in the torque spec so that if your nut doesn't line up with a hole, you can tighten it a little more until it does.

I'd suggest just putting a washer under the nut, but without knowing how much torque was applied to get into your current situation, I'd hesitate to recommend it owing to the possibility that the ball joint stud is weakened. It seems pretty unlikely, and if I were in this situation, I'd probably try retorquing and use a washer if needed, but I can't make that recommendation without some sense of how mightily that stud was overstressed or stretched.

edit to add: while I was writing this I see an impact wrench has entered the discussion. Definitely, pop them and try retorquing, but if they don't fit right on the second try, I'd play it safe and swallow the cost. An impact wrench, if it's working right, will go way way past the recommended torque, and I don't think there's any such thing as a convenient time or place for a ball joint stud to break off.
well heres the thing, when i did impact the lowers i do it till it is snug then i check to see where the hole is and turn by hand till i get to the next crown opening for the hole, so i just didn't run them on with the, impact till they were tight.
 
shorty, so you are saying you have come across this problem before? Someone said i prob screwed up the sleeve? I saw no sleeve.....

Somone else said the balljoint is screwed now, i do not know what to think but i am frustrated to beyond beleif....

I have had this happen to me on more than one occasion (always on high mileage, possibly worn tapered holes) and have not had any negative effects with just pinning it to prevent the nut from backing completely off.

I can say that the use of an impact gun was never in the equation though and, as Matthew Currie stated, I might be concerned with stretching the stud beyond it's practical limit if you really ran it down.
 
never use an impact on these joints unless your trying to get the old one off. My guess is that the tapered hole on the knuckle has been bored out a lil which is causing the stud to go through the hole more than it should. A washer that fits snug over the base of the stud should help keep it where it is supposed to be. Loosen it up and redo it.
 
Simple cause: aftermarketitis. A lot of non-dealer parts come with nuts with no built-in washer at the bottom, different pin hole heights and so on. None of this really affects the durability of the part, but it does mean the cotter pin no longer engages the castle nut neatly like it did with the stock parts.

By the way, on something where the castle nut and hole do actually line up, NEVER just back the nut off if you overtorque it so the pin can go in. You'll need to loosen the nut, knock the tapers loose and then retorque.
 
If you didn't run them that tight with the impact, I'd be less worried about stretching, and suspect that the holes are enlarged or the studs a bit off spec, or the nuts themselves too shallow. I'd still pop the studs themselves loose and retorque for good measure, but then if the problem persists and you're sure that the ball joints themselves are doing their job, I'd just put in a washer.
 
i think if it over tightened to the point of the castle nut being below the cotter pin hole assuming no wear in the hole and a proper fitting bj it would have snapped the stud off then cuz theres no way it would stretch an 1/8-3/16 of an inch theres simply not enough metal to stretch there without just snapping. its probly not an exact size bj or a worn hole thats the issue here and id just throw a couple washers below the nut so that the castle nut can lock on the cotter pin
 
Back
Top