New Story - '85 Original diesel Jeep restoration!

OK Guys. This is my story of my last roughly 1 month of off and on work on my old project XJ.

A few months back I was working on this old Toyota pickup when my buddy shoots me a text message asking me if I want a diesel Jeep Cherokee. I've been working on cars most of my life and only heard of the diesel Jeeps - most of the stories I heard of them were horror stories. But lots of research and a few contacts overseas suggest that maybe the problems with these jeeps are overrated and mostly due to neglectful maintnance practices.

So in 1986 a nice gentlman custom orders his Cherokee with the Renault J8S turbodiesel 4wd with the Aisin werner AX5 transmission. He is a professional diesel mechanic for Empire cat and meticulously maintains his baby. Then roughly around the new millenium he is driving to Montanna from northern Arizona when the turbocharger goes south (lost its feed line). A shop in Montana puts a new turbo on (same 8PSI Garret T2). He drives home later that week and parks in his driveway. The Screeching of tires and scraping of metal awakens him the next morning. A speeding Chevy Silverado smashed his beloved Jeep in the B pillar. He is preoccupied with other proejcts so he decides to salvage the differentials, transfer case, and running gear from the vehicle. The rest of the hulk is hauled off to my buddy's dad's ranch where it sits in the elements for well over 5 years until I got this text message.

The odometer (original) shows 71,600 and some change on it. What a darned shame.

In Late september I started work on the project. Took me months to find the "ideal" swap candidate - a 1985 Jeep Cherokee V6 (siezed) with good running gear under it - including the essential NP207 transfer case. I continued to perform the swap not knowing of the old Renault turbodiesel would even start (but knowing that I promised to clear the old wrecked Jeep out of this guys yard). My buddy and I did the swap and got her bolted together in time for it to snow. Fearing that the old engine would be ruined if it sat outside with its hoses and air cleaner removed, I opted to put it in a storage facility.

2 nights ago, around 8PM arizona time the old engine coughed to life for the first time in a long time. The door was still closed in my 10x15 storage unit and man did I get a good dusting of soot. Yesterday I got her running good off of a diesel bottle. Today I hooked up the running gear to take her for a little spin (literally). Man this little engine runs good. I don't know if the reputation for trouble is deserved or not for the little Renault but this one sure seems to run good. I did almost nothing to this engine but fresh fluids and I primed the injector pump with an eletric boost pump for a few minutes before attempting to start.

There isn't much dry land that won't give the little Jeep lots of wheelspin - I don't yet have the 4wd shift linkage hooked up so I was just driving in 2wd with bald tires on a snow covered parking lot. However one little strip of clear asphalt revealed to me that the little diesel lags a lot in the low revs. Wind her up on the turbo boost and things start happening (still not what you call fast but definitely not a completely slouch). Sure it's nothing like my '92 4.0 but I am optimistic that it will be very acceptable as a commuter.

Tomorrow I hope to get the alternator and power steering hooked up - maybe start fixing up a few other wiring glitches. Monday she will get some new Kuhmo sneakers and hopefully I will have it registered and insured and driving before the end of next week.


I will be posting video footage. I don't have any pictures of the swap in progress but I can say that the nuts and bolts are extremely simple, and the wiring is not a whole lot worse really. Even the big things like moving the battery from the passenger side to the driver's side are pretty simple really - the holes to bolt down the battery tray are already there. The holes for the oil cooler, filter unit, air filter bracket, frame horns and intercooler are all basically already there. The only things that need to be drilled for are the fuel filter unit, glow timer (near starter relay) and glow relay. All the mounts are bolt and go.


So there is still much incidental work to deal with but all the big stuff is done. If anybody needs help working on one of these I can't claim to be an expert but I may be able to offer some insight into this rare beast.

Pricing information:

1986 Jeep cherokee diesel minus axles and Tcase --------- Free
1985 Jeep Cherokee V6 donor (rough but complete) ------- $200
Parts cost ----------------------------------------------- $500
Tires ---------------------------------------------------- $350
Storage -------------------------------------------------$100
Transportation ------------------------------------------- $200 (had to move it twice)

Now this is the stuff to make it driveable. Many more smaller repairs will quickly snowball into the thousand plus range. Look like 1350 for the project so far. More like 1550 if you count some of the jobsite tools (lights, small generator, etc). I figure 2500 for a really solid mechanical Jeep with rough interior and paint but working otherwise kind of deal.

sick.

Post pics or BAN him...

I'm a big diesel guy. I wish i could get one of those. It would be one cool rig for sure.

Great story man. And what you have invested is cheap compared to what i have in mine. And mine is waaaaayyyyy lesss cool

OK Guys. Getting the power steering hoses made for it today (or maybe at least temporarily rednecked together) so I can start it again without it spewing fluid. Hopefully I will get a little video clip of it to show. Remember though that it is still in a *highly rough* condition right now. Haven't yet taken out the wiring that goes to the 1985 emissions crap so under the hood is still pretty sloppy...

Cool. I have a 1994 2.1 Diesel XJ i'm restoring. Got a bunch of rust in the back, some electrical issues and is pretty much non-maintained but it was cheap and those TDI's will get great mileage compared to the 4.0. I also looked at the 2.5 diesels but decided against them due to poor engine quality.

wtf? what jeep dealership put a diesel in a 1994 cherokee

Jelous I say................... Jelous!!! :bawl:

tonexj said:

wtf? what jeep dealership put a diesel in a 1994 cherokee

Click to expand...

European ones... In my case : the norwegian Jeep agent.

Norwegian said:

Cool. I have a 1994 2.1 Diesel XJ i'm restoring. Got a bunch of rust in the back, some electrical issues and is pretty much non-maintained but it was cheap and those TDI's will get great mileage compared to the 4.0. I also looked at the 2.5 diesels but decided against them due to poor engine quality.

Click to expand...

This is not to be too nit - picky but to refer to the Renault J8S as a TDI is not really correct as it implies (I think) that this is a direct injection diesel. In fact I believe the Renault uses a pre-combustion chamber design that is a lot more crude (and less efficient).

Maybe I'm wrong about this but this is more to clarify some of the general engine characteristics more than anything.

I was not aware that the Renault 2.1 turbo diesel was installed in any years other than 1984 through 1987 (even then 1984 and 1987 are questionable). This is at least true for USA market cars (possibly canada as well?). It is a unique engine based on an all aluminum gasoline engine design that was fitted with iron sleeves to accomodate the high compression ratio of the diesel. They have a good reputation in europe but a mediocre reputation stateside - widely attributed to the lack of training amongst Jeep mechanics with the engine.


I am waiting several days for the power steering pressure hose to arrive - once it arrives I will post some video footage of mine running. I promise it is real though!

True, i was being unclear on the Tdi.. What i meant was Turbo Diesel, intercooler. The same engine was used in Renault road cars and vans as late as 1996 i've been told.
It doesn't posess a lot of power but for a DD it's got enough. The mileage is also really good for a 4x4.

Mr Norwegian - does your cherokee still drive? I am curious what kind of fuel mileage you see. I've heard stories of these ones returning 30+ miles per gallon stateside but I have a hard time believing that it would do that well - especially considering the relatively crude (by today's standards) injection system it uses. Then again you never know. It is after all only as big as some motorcycle engines in displacement these days.

Mine is a runner, well not just now as i'm tearing it down for rustrepairs...
They do get good mileage. 33mpg highway cruise in 2wd with a light foot is absolutely doable.

One more question there my friend - are you stateside currently? I've had a rough time tracking down a timing belt. Even though it was claimed by the original owner to be replaced not long before the impact, I want to do the timing belt as a security measure. After all the motor sat for a good 5 years out in the elements and I distinctly recall an article in one trade megazine suggesting that when the timing belts sit on their sprockets in one place for extended periods of time, they have a tendency to break.

If you have good advice on a timing belt that is appreciated. I did find one source for my timing belt - a vintage parts warehouse that sells at $106 appiece. They claimed to have roughly 90 units available. I was hoping to find a better price and a more steady source of belts since it is a relatively frequent service interval item.

Yesterday I got the back brakes fixed up except I am waiting on new drums. The old set of shoes had worn past the rivets right down to the steel shoe itself. I have never in probably 15 years of doing auto repair seen shoes this bad. It destroyed the old drums.

I got 4 new tires for it too - Kumho highway pattern tires that claimed a good treadware rating and that got decent reviews too.

Tomorrow I should have my power steering hose. IF not then definitely by Friday. I will be cleaning up the wiring and hopefully I will make it out to the neighboring town where the wrecked '86 chasis is parked - I need to get the mount bracket fot the coolant reserve tank, the hood, and the instrument cluster. Also gotta see if that pesky 4wd linkage is to be found anywhere too... Only a few loose ends to tie up before I'm ready to bring it out on the streets!

Nope, i'm on the other side of the Atlantic..sorry.
From here $100 for a belt doesn't seem that bad. It's apx the same price as i get from a local partsdealer. I assume it's just for the belt.
It is however recommended to chance both "tightener/tension wheels" (don't know the exact name) while changing the belt. Those things are insanely expensive! I'm looking at apx $600 for the whole kit!
Might have to go for it tho, i don't know how long it's been since they were changed.

Dude that's awesome. I actually have a spare timing belt in my '85 diesel, but I'm afraid to part with it. The previous owner (it sat at two used car dealers for six months) told me that there's enough clearance for the valves if the belt goes, so things won't get mangled. I've only had her a month, and just got her tagged historic in VA last week, had to wait for the tags, monster thick aluminum , solid black, with boxy white lettering, pretty cool looking for plates. and they're permanent!

One little problem, and I haven't diagnosed it yet. I started running veggie and diesel blend in it today, and it was a little rough at higher rpms, so i changed the fuel filter. It started once after that. The "WATER IN FUEL" light came on with the glow plug light, and when the buzzer stops and I turn the key all the way, notta. Now this same problem happened maybe twice over the last month, minus the water in fuel light, but she always started after a pause. I took a chance and rolled her down the street & dropped her in second...bingo, fired right up. So my quess is either, 1) Starter is bad (or a solenoid?), or 2) there's some sort of sensor related to changing the filter that is bad or needs resetting.

Now if the light goes on in the dash, the owners manual (what The mouse that ate it left me to read, anyway) says to "Loosen vent valve (B) on top of filter housing. Open draincock (A) on the bottom. As much as 1/2 pint may be drained from the filter at one time. Close draincock (A) and vent valve (B)... Caution: If the WATER IN FUEL light again comes on when you start your vehicle, see your dealer immediately."

So what do you guys think? Sensor, or Starter/Soleneid, or something else?

Seems like I always get to typing at night, I should take some pics of her runnin', but resolving this issue is paramount...duhhh!

So, I grabbed the Belt out of the back of my non-starting Jeep. Reads, T0663544, dated 07/07/2004, with a Mopar label on it. But the label inside says Renault on it, and the underside of said label says Gates Powergrip. Oh, it says made in U.K., v/c 60989. Maybe that is still a viable source, not sure.

If you need the Renault manual for the 2.1 just let me know and i'll send you a link.

Hi!

I've owned a diesel Cherokee (2.1TD 1989) since last fall and have been busy fixing and lifting it.

Anyways, I live in Finland and the prices you're telling you have to pay for timing belts seems kind of unacceptable. Or are you talking about original Renault belts? I replaced my timing belt, water pump and tensioner and think it cost me roughly 200€. The belt was a ContiTech belt, so it should be of some quality. The belt alone cost about 60€, and I've seen them cheaper.

Currently my Cherokee is leaking coolant between the block and the head, so I'll be taking the head of next week.

http://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Espace/vault/J63/MRmotj8s.pdf

Found a little engine tech info...