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HELP WITH PINION ANGLE

Parkian

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Central Ontario
I recently raised my 2000 XJ 3” in the back and got some pretty serious vibes. I installed 3* shims and they definitely help but I’m still getting some vibes. I don’t have an SYE for now and I really don’t want to do a transfer case drop.

I have the 231 TC and 8.25 axle.

Could someone who has/had a 97+ with a 3” lift, without a SYE or TC drop let me know if they were able to use 5* or 6* shims to correct the pinion angle????? My pinion is pointing up about 2* right now.

Will this pull my yoke out too much????? potentially causing more vibes????
 
I feel for ya. I raised my 97 about 2.75" on both ends ant opted for a homemade 1" TC drop. I think I need 1,25" drop to get the last of my vibe out. I was told that the angle of the pinion should be the same degree as the TC angle. Was going to use shims but it appeared my driveshaft may have been too short. HTH...Al
 
I recently raised my 2000 XJ 3” in the back and got some pretty serious vibes. I installed 3* shims and they definitely help but I’m still getting some vibes. I don’t have an SYE for now and I really don’t want to do a transfer case drop.

I have the 231 TC and 8.25 axle.

Could someone who has/had a 97+ with a 3” lift, without a SYE or TC drop let me know if they were able to use 5* or 6* shims to correct the pinion angle????? My pinion is pointing up about 2* right now.

Will this pull my yoke out too much????? potentially causing more vibes????

2000XJ + Lift = vibes very often. Best solution = SYE.
 
Pinion angle isnt whats causing most of your vibes, so higher degree shims arent going to help. Whats causing the vibes is most likely the angle of the tcase output with the driveshaft, not the angle of the driveshaft with the rear pinion
 
The angles have to cancel each other out. You could have a ujoint operating at an angle one degree shy of where the yokes bind, and you could have absolutely zero vibration at that extreme angle IF: the ujoint at the other end is at the same angle AND: the driveshaft is long enough for good slip yoke engagement. With a 2 ujoint shaft, the angles have to be equal or maybe one degree down from equal on the pinion end to account for pinion rise under torque.

With an SYE = 3 ujoint driveshaft, all the angle compensation is taking place at the transfercase end of the driveshaft. The angle is split evenly between the two joints in the double cardan assembly while the pinion should be pointed straight up the shaft- or one degree low for pinion rise, same as a conventional driveshaft. Interestingly this causes SYE users with proper angles to have accelerated rear ujoint wear. Why? Because the needle bearings don't really move around as there is near zero angle. This can cause a brinnelled spot in the ujoint and requires more frequent greasing.

So, given a 97 with a 3 inch lift and stock shackles the pinion angle will probably need to go DOWN 1 or 2 degrees to achieve the perfect parallel angles. However this isn't gonna work because the slip yoke is now pulled too far off the poorly supported end of the rear output shaft. The limited spline engagement causes the upper end of the driveshaft to track in an ellipse, setting up a vibration- angles be damned. Then you get the nasty transient noise on trailing throttle, when there is neither accel or decel torque being applied through the poorly engaged slip yoke.

The answer? There are two, either tcase drop or SYE. I frankly don't like hack and tap SYE's, the HD SYE is the only way to go. There have now been so many of them built that the tooling was paid for long ago and we're paying less for them than 10 years ago. The junkyard front driveshaft option is a good one. XJ front shafts are .120" wall and well balanced, which you can't always say about the aftermarket ones. The factory front slip spline is weak compared to a custom shaft, though, but if it makes it more palatable to use a $20 dollar part to get you by until you're ready for the $300 one- perfect. Then use your old one for a spare for front or rear once the custom shaft is in hand.
 
Pinion angle isnt whats causing most of your vibes, so higher degree shims arent going to help. Whats causing the vibes is most likely the angle of the tcase output with the driveshaft, not the angle of the driveshaft with the rear pinion

On a Non-SYE set-up,driveshaft angle doesnt matter,only the TC to Pinion angle!
Btw:a Tc drop on a 2000-01 can make things even worse because of the LP D30.I tried a H-n-T at the first but ended up with a HD SYE kit.
 
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It's all dependent on the jeep though. I currently run 5.0" out back and 4.5 up front. No Tcase drop/shims. 98xj. Very minimal vibes on stock DS. When funds prevail again (no thanks to RE) I will be getting a H&T system (NP242:bawl:). I just lived with my vibes, but SYE isn't to far away.
 
It's all dependent on the jeep though. I currently run 5.0" out back and 4.5 up front. No Tcase drop/shims. 98xj. Very minimal vibes on stock DS. When funds prevail again (no thanks to RE) I will be getting a H&T system (NP242:bawl:). I just lived with my vibes, but SYE isn't to far away.

LP D30's on 2000XJ's make it worse than your 98 HP D30.
 
My pinion is pointing up about 2* right now.

Equal and opposite my friend, equal and opposite.

Go to the hardware store and buy an angle finder. Get a socket out of the tool box. rotate the DS so the TC yoke is pointed up and down. Place the socket inside the u-joint cap hole, put the angle finder flat on the top of the socket and take a reading. Do that for the TC side of the DS. Subtract the two measurments. That is your front angle.

Now go in the back and do the same thing there. The angles should be equal and opposite. Meaning, if the front slopes down 2 deg, the back should slope up 2 degrees like this -\_ . At no time should the rear pinion be above the drive shaft.

Other notes: Make sure the slip yoke is lubed! Also, sometimes after you do a lift, you have to replace worn u-joints (because they are used to running in the same orbits and are now asked to rotate to a greater orbit.
Using the above methode, I was able to just about eliminate vibrations entirely. I really didn't mind an occasional "vibe", but dropping the TC with a Rustys 1" drop cross member really smoothed things out. That cross member looses no ground clearance, and is more sturdy than a stock one.

Ron
 
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