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This sucks, why don't we wave a white flag?

buschwhaked

buschwhaked

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Colorado Springs
This is a story about the new ROE we have here in Afghanistan. It blows. Basically, now we have to run from a fight and put soldiers at risk vs just dropping a bomb on the bastards. We already have a pretty strict ROE here as it is, but this is ridiculous.

So if someone is shooting at you from a house, instead of blowing it up with a 500 pounder, we either have to fire and maneuver (which is way more dangerous than dropping a bomb) or just withdraw.

This is a war and we are a Army for Christ's sake, it's never supposed to be a fair fight and we're supposed to kill people. Collateral damage is just a bonus.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31492098/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
 
I feel for you brother, I know how shitty a restrictive ROE can be. Human shields, isn't that breaking the Geneva convention? But we can't use waterboarding anymore, go figure.

How stupid is it that ROEs are written by lawyers in DC and then approved at the highest level.

Stay safe.
 
buschwhaked said:
This is a story about the new ROE we have here in Afghanistan. It blows. Basically, now we have to run from a fight and put soldiers at risk vs just dropping a bomb on the bastards. We already have a pretty strict ROE here as it is, but this is ridiculous.

So if someone is shooting at you from a house, instead of blowing it up with a 500 pounder, we either have to fire and maneuver (which is way more dangerous than dropping a bomb) or just withdraw.

This is a war and we are a Army for Christ's sake, it's never supposed to be a fair fight and we're supposed to kill people. Collateral damage is just a bonus.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/31492098/ns/world_news-south_and_central_asia/
Click to expand...

Just remember...you voted for him.
 
Obama levels the field for the taliwackers... he backs the dictators and keeps us from our advantages in the field. He sucks more every day.
 
muddyrocks said:
..., He sucks more every day.
Click to expand...
No, you just notice it more. He hasn't changed his beliefs of strategy since he started out in Chicago.
 
This was actually the brilliant idea of the new general in charge here. Forget his name at the moment. See, I know WHY he did it, but it just doesn't stand up to reason. The Taliban conduct really effective information operations. Everytime we drop a bomb no their meeting they claim it was a funeral or a wedding or some stupid whatever. They'll say that we killed 200 women and children when we actually killed maybe a couple but 30 Taliban commanders.

So to eliminate their ability to make that claim we limit what weapon systems we can use where.

But to me, there is a huge difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. We brought the fight to Iraq (for not very good reason IMHO, but that's a different debate) and the Afghan's brought the fight to us. They allowed al Qaeda to take over their country and run operations from here. So screw 'em. Their all guilty. Not to mention, this place is beyond saving. At least in Iraq those people had an idea of what a normal society was supposed to be, but these people have no clue. The corruption is unparralled, they regularly rape little boys, and are responsible for providing safe harbor and passage to terrorists. And that doesn't even get into the dispicable way they treat their women here.

We should have the most unrestrictive ROE possible.
 
Major changes to ROEs, like what is about to happen, may have started with that new General, but before it is finalized it goes all the way up to SECDEF, he then briefs you know about the changes. If Barry likes what he hears its good to go, if not back to the drawing board. I would also bet that the idea to change the ROE came from DC not from the General.

Regardless, this change is retarded. I do agree with your opinion about blasting all of them even further back into the stone age.
 
[SIZE=+1]YOU MAY BE A TALIBAN IF..........[/SIZE]


1. You refine heroin for a living, but you have a moral objection to beer.

2. You own a $3,000 machine gun and $5,000 rocket launcher, but you can't afford shoes.

3. You have more wives than teeth.

4. You wipe your butt with your bare left hand, but consider bacon "unclean."

5. You think vests come in two styles: bullet-proof and suicide.

6. You can't think of anyone you HAVEN'T declared Jihad against.

7. You consider television dangerous, but routinely carry explosives in your clothing.

8. You were amazed to discover that cell phones have uses other than setting off roadside bombs.

9. You've ever uttered the phrase, "I love what you've done with your cave."

10. You have nothing against women and think every man should own at least one.

11. You bathe at least monthly whether necessary or not.

12. You've ever had a crush on your neighbor's goat.
 
buschwhaked said:
But to me, there is a huge difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. We brought the fight to Iraq (for not very good reason IMHO, but that's a different debate) and the Afghan's brought the fight to us. They allowed al Qaeda to take over their country and run operations from here. So screw 'em. Their all guilty. Not to mention, this place is beyond saving. At least in Iraq those people had an idea of what a normal society was supposed to be, but these people have no clue. The corruption is unparralled, they regularly rape little boys, and are responsible for providing safe harbor and passage to terrorists. And that doesn't even get into the dispicable way they treat their women here.

We should have the most unrestrictive ROE possible.
Click to expand...


Having been there twice before, I have to disagree with the bold above.
They never really had the option to keep the taliban away. The taliban saw a country with no government, no police/military to defend themselves, and an opportunity to come in and take over... which they did. I never once spoke to any Afghan that had anything good to say about the taliban or how they were treated while they were taking over power there.
The corruption, hey you have the option to eek out a living, and live under taliban rule in the hopes you and your family aren't executed for some unknown reason... or live the same life, but get a little more money for being corrupt and probably keep your family safer for doing so... its easy to say we wouldn't do it, but I've been in the situation so who knows.
As for the rapes, well thats just BS, those people should be handed over to the ANA and forgotten about. From my interaction with the ANA, they would spend some time with the rapist and a few choice instruments...

I hope your tour goes well, and you return safe and sound. I understand the reasoning behind the ROE change, as shitty as it is... I hate having to tell idiots here that the news reports are never accurate, and only bad news sells. I tell people exactly what you said, and they just shake their heads and say 'well I saw the news, it says it was a wedding party/funeral, so that must be true'

best of luck man.
 
beakie said:
Having been there twice before, I have to disagree with the bold above.
They never really had the option to keep the taliban away. The taliban saw a country with no government, no police/military to defend themselves, and an opportunity to come in and take over... which they did. I never once spoke to any Afghan that had anything good to say about the taliban or how they were treated while they were taking over power there.
The corruption, hey you have the option to eek out a living, and live under taliban rule in the hopes you and your family aren't executed for some unknown reason... or live the same life, but get a little more money for being corrupt and probably keep your family safer for doing so... its easy to say we wouldn't do it, but I've been in the situation so who knows.
As for the rapes, well thats just BS, those people should be handed over to the ANA and forgotten about. From my interaction with the ANA, they would spend some time with the rapist and a few choice instruments...

I hope your tour goes well, and you return safe and sound. I understand the reasoning behind the ROE change, as shitty as it is... I hate having to tell idiots here that the news reports are never accurate, and only bad news sells. I tell people exactly what you said, and they just shake their heads and say 'well I saw the news, it says it was a wedding party/funeral, so that must be true'

best of luck man.
Click to expand...


Fair enough, but I'm living down the street from the hometown of Mullah Omar. Screw 'em.

These people have plenty of good things to say about the Taliban. And the Chi boys live with the ANP here. I know that things are much different in the cities like J-Bad, Bagram, and Kandahar, but out here at this place, these guys are straight freekin Taliban.

And it was Al Qaeda that saw a country with little/no government except the Taliban. And the Taliban opened their arms. The Taliban aren't foreigners, they're native Pashtun's.

Even the Candadians here hate all these people. And the corruption...ok it's all good ripping off travelers at the CP's, but believe me, the level of corruption here is way beyond that. I can't go into it all. There is a certain moral tolerance we have to have, but what goes on here is way beyond that.

But that could be because the previous unit just occupied this area 6 months ago, so it's like OIF II out here.
 
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Sorry for the hard luck keep your head down. Our ROE has always been jacked up If politicians want to fight this war they should go fight it or let soldiers do there job. Going downrange you always have the thought "am I going to squeeze and get thrown in jail for it?" Something that should never go through a soldiers mind in combat but our nation makes it that way. Too much V
 
MpSlayer said:
Actually back in 93 it was estimated that an AK-47 could be purchased for 14 American dollars in Somalia. I'm assuming the RPK is a little more. Because of the mass production in Russia also there are Iraqi versions that are cheaper (and crappier) they copied the dragonov aswell
Click to expand...

You go across into the border areas and you will find markets where the AK, springfield, enfield, etc are HAND MADE by craftsman, give them any gun and some time and they will copy it right down to the same serial number with hammers, chisels, files and basic hand tools.
 
RichP said:
You go across into the border areas and you will find markets where the AK, springfield, enfield, etc are HAND MADE by craftsman, give them any gun and some time and they will copy it right down to the same serial number with hammers, chisels, files and basic hand tools.
Click to expand...

Yeah but I was talking about Iraqi's theres not word in Arabic for precision :)
 
buschwhaked said:
This was actually the brilliant idea of the new general in charge here. Forget his name at the moment. See, I know WHY he did it, but it just doesn't stand up to reason. The Taliban conduct really effective information operations. Everytime we drop a bomb no their meeting they claim it was a funeral or a wedding or some stupid whatever. They'll say that we killed 200 women and children when we actually killed maybe a couple but 30 Taliban commanders.

So to eliminate their ability to make that claim we limit what weapon systems we can use where.

But to me, there is a huge difference between Iraq and Afghanistan. We brought the fight to Iraq (for not very good reason IMHO, but that's a different debate) and the Afghan's brought the fight to us. They allowed al Qaeda to take over their country and run operations from here. So screw 'em. Their all guilty. Not to mention, this place is beyond saving. At least in Iraq those people had an idea of what a normal society was supposed to be, but these people have no clue. The corruption is unparralled, they regularly rape little boys, and are responsible for providing safe harbor and passage to terrorists. And that doesn't even get into the dispicable way they treat their women here.

We should have the most unrestrictive ROE possible.
Click to expand...

If your attitude is "they're all guilty" you shouldn't even be IN the military. Is there any way to report statements like that to your commanding officers?
 
winkosmosis said:
If your attitude is "they're all guilty" you shouldn't even be IN the military. Is there any way to report statements like that to your commanding officers?
Click to expand...

I think he was mostly venting when he first wrote that, and you have no idea what he is dealing with over there.

You might want to take the time to try and understand why he is making such a statement. Maybe you should raise your right hand, and take your happy as* to the Stan.

But don't worry you can sit in your nice place and type on your pretty computer while he is over there.

Jack ass
 
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