• NAXJA is having its 18th annual March Membership Drive!!!
    Everyone who joins or renews during March will be entered into a drawing!
    More Information - Join/Renew
  • Welcome to the new NAXJA Forum! If your password does not work, please use "Forgot your password?" link on the log-in page. Please feel free to reach out to [email protected] if we can provide any assistance.

Oil heater/cooler and remote filter mount install.

Talyn

NAXJA Forum User
This is sometime I have been wanting to do for a while, install an oil cooler/heater. For two reasons. 1) It takes much longer than I would like to get the oil up to operating temp, much longer than the coolant. I don't have an over heating issue with the oil though, so its more for the heater portion. Oil needs a minimum temp to get the full benefit from the oil. According to Lake Speed at Joe Gibbs oil he recommends 180* before getting on it and 220* to boil out condensation. 2) If I went with the heat exchanger I would need to relocate the oil filter. This would also allow me to use a much larger filter and easier access. I decided to tackle this while my supercharger manifold is at the welder and machine shop.

The plan is to do this: block --> modified stock 90* filter adapter & bolt --> heat exchanger --> remote adapter --> AN -12 hoses --> remote filter mount and then back.

I plan on running a water to air heat exchanger that sandwiches between the filter (typically) and filter mount. Hesco sells a kit, but I feel its a bit pricy ($187.50) and its a VW cooler/heater and the extended filter mount bolt. The cooler is easy to find but the bolt maybe a custom part as our oil filter bolt mount is recessed about 1/4" into the adapter. I have a 3.25" one and it doesn't seem long enough. Plus I don't know where who makes that cooler, but I know that Dorman does make some replacements. Which I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot stick. After a lot of searching and comparing different oil coolers I have found one that meets most of my requirements. It is made by Dana/Long and the style is used on a lot of modern vehicles. This one in particular was meant for a Dodge Magnum or Chrysler 300. PN 4792912AE. I found a new one with the bolt for $61. The bolt uses the same 3/4"-16 threads. In fact they take the same filter as the XJ, not that this matters much for my use. The only draw back is that the coolant fittings are 5/8" and face toward the rear as mounted in my install. The XJ coolant feed line off the thermostat housing is 3/4". However I will use two 3/4 to 5/8" tees and provide a bit of a bypass between so the stock 3/4" feed line won't be restricted. I haven't gotten to sourcing parts for that yet, but I'm thinking of using a brass PEX tee, which should fit well.

Ideally I would like to have gone with a Mocal/Laminova heat exchanger, but they are a bit over my price range (~$400).

AN -10 lines may have been sufficient but I wanted as little restriction to flow as possible as I will use 90* bent tube an fittings off the filter adapter and a 45* and straigh fitting on the remote filter mount. So I will be using An -12 lines and fittings. The filter bypass adapter that I am using is a Hamburger/Trans-dapt 3320. Its a pretty nice billet piece with some nice flow lines. However, there is some clean up and smoothing out needed which there is plenty of meat on it for. Some time with a die grinder and it will work fine. The filter will be mounted behind the alternator, in front of the passenger side engine mount. There really aren't many options for mounting the remote filter, and I would like to keep it as low as possible to prevent any possible drain back. Sure the filter has an anti drain back valve, but nothing else does. The other option is on the front skid, but I would like to keep the lines as short as possible. I currently have a CV Products CV-745 with has the same threads as the stock filter, 3/4"-16. Which has a .50" opening for the fluid. The stock Wix 51085 or the larger Wix 51515 can me mounted on it or even larger, depending on location. However, I am undecided if I should keep the CV 745 or upgrade tot he larger CV-746 which has 13/16"-16. While the stock ports are around .5" as is the CV-745 the larger 13/16"-16 on the CV-746 may provide less of a pressure drop before it returns back to the block. It will be about $100 or so more provided I can sell the CV -745. I'll have to think about that, opinions?

So some pics:

Filter/adapter side of the heat exchanger.
DSC_6957.JPG


Block side of the heat exchanger:
DSC_6963.JPG


CV745 filter mount:
DSC_6979.JPG


DSC_6980.JPG


Hamburger 3320 adapter:
DSC_7004.JPG


DSC_7022.JPG


Adapters and heat exchanger together:
DSC_6987.JPG


DSC_6993.JPG


I also took a look at the stock oil passages and felt there could be some improvement. The main oil galley is ~.5" as is the feed passage from the oil filter adapter. The stock oil adapter bolt ID is .38" diameter and the feed holes in it are .317" diameter. I felt that there was some room for improvement here. Keep in mind that the inner diameter is only half the stork as the oil sees the area as well, which is more important. I opened up the bolt's ID from .38 diameter (area of .1134 square inches) to .468" diameter (.172" sq in area). That is roughly a 65% increase in flow area. I also opened up the feed holes in the bolt from .317" (area of .1578 sq in, there are two) to .365" (area of .209 sq in). I also massaged the oil filter adapter a bit, opening up the port as well as smoothing out the rough edges. Even with out the oil cooler/heater and remote filter mount these modifications should show an improvement. If my block was torn down I would have done some internal modifications to the oil pump to block passages as well as the adapter to galley passage. Maybe in the future. The only thing I am concerned about is how the bolt will hold up since so much material was removed. I will be supporting the rear of the filter adapter/heater/stock adapter to reduce stain on the bolt and stock mount.

Pics of the modifications:
DSC_7031.JPG


DSC_7033.JPG


DSC_7074.JPG


DSC_7076.JPG


It is not finished and installed yet as I need to do a mock up, decide on fittings and hose lengths, work out the coolant flow, order the rest and install it.
 
Interesting idea, and nice job on the oil port mods. My uncle and I opened up the stock pickup on my 440 block to the Hemi size and used a larger pickup as well as opened up the galley all the way to the pump. Still holds 80 psi cold idle and 20 psi hot idle after a 2 hour race with 10-30w.

What made you want a heat exchanger? I'm using a sandwich style adapter to keep the oil filter in the stock location on my 440, and the adapter contains a thermostat to keep the oil from flowing through the cooler until it reaches 180ºF (I think...can't remember the temp offhand). I was worried about the reliability of the thermostat, but it fails open so that's nice.
 
I am impressed. After all of the discussion we have batted back and forth, you are the first to pull the trigger and go.

My hat is off to you Sir and I await the installation thread.

As some of you out there know, I am a major fan of engine oil coolers. Some Manufacturers include them as standard equipment. My Mercedes has one for instance.

This is a major upgrade to the idea as it will be using engine coolant as the heat exchange medium rather than the more complex oil to air exchanger. That idea requires a thermostat be installed into the lines a as to not over cool the oil.

Far and away, this is the elegant solution. I will be more than interested in seeing where the hot idle oil pressure goes up to. With the oil temperature being controlled, one would expect to see better pressure at idle.

Anti-drain back. A check valve could be installed to prevent the back flow. They are inexpensive and fool proof.

Example:
http://www.amazon.com/Control-Devices-Brass-Check-Female/dp/B007IVRPZC/ref=sr_1_17?ie=UTF8&qid=1403101745&sr=8-17&keywords=3%2F4+check+valve
 
Last edited:
What made you want a heat exchanger?
Mostly for quicker warm ups. Quicker warm up = less gas consumed, less engine wear, less oil pollution, able to get on the skinny pedal sooner.

It will also keep the oil cooler, not that I have a oil heat problem, but it will stabilize the temp and keep it at that viscosity.

This is a major upgrade to the idea as it will be using engine coolant as the heat exchange medium rather than the more complex oil to air exchanger. That idea requires a thermostat be installed into the lines a as to not over cool the oil.
That and the air will only cool the oil, not heat it.
Far and away, this is the elegant solution. I will be more than interested in seeing where the hot idle oil pressure goes up to. With the oil temperature being controlled, one would expect to see better pressure at idle.
At a fully warmed up idle I currently have an oil temp of 195-210*,and pressure of 37-35 psi. The hottest I have ever seen it was 239* after a highway drive, pressure of 29 psi. Second hottest was 233* and 30 psi, again highway. Those temps are well with in the limit of the oil as well.
 
CV-745 filter mount sold on ebay this morning. Purchased the CV-746 with the 13/16"-16 filter threads for a larger filter outlet. Comes with AN adapters, so that is one less thing to purchase.
 
My boss just took delivery of a BMW X3. Interestingly the dash doesn't have an engine coolant gauge. Instead it has an engine oil temp gauge instead.

This is such a German thing.... The tune up Specifications for the Mercedes ('72 280SEL 4.5 Litre gas V8) stated, firmly, a minimum oil temperature to be achieved prior to starting the tune.

Talyn,
What I see here is that you will be controlling the oil temperature. One might even say that you will be conditioning it. I see ZERO downsides to this. And I am, again, eagerly awaiting your results. Should be very interesting.

Enough so that I may run with it myself result dependent...
 
No concerns about dumping the oil heat into the coolant? XJ cooling systems don't seem to have a lot of "overhead".

I prefer separate heat exchangers for the oil and the tranmission fluid.
 
No concerns about dumping the oil heat into the coolant? XJ cooling systems don't seem to have a lot of "overhead".
Don't see a problem. It handles the stroker fairly well. If its a problem I'll upgrade the rad.
I prefer separate heat exchangers for the oil and the tranmission fluid.
The thread details why I am not using an oil to air cooler for the engine oil.
 
Talyn is dead on the money. For what he is attempting to do, only a water to air device will work. If he was only interested in cooling the oil, then an external heat exchanger could be used with a thermostat to operate the external pump so as to not over cool the oil.

As the purpose of the exercise is to bring the oil up to temp faster, tying it into the engine coolant system is about the only practical way.

I am wondering, could the 90 degree adapter at the block be eliminated if a remote filter were to be used? Have not seen that done.
 
I believe there is room to replace the stock 90*adapter with just a remote adapter. However, a heat exchanger + adapter won't fit. I did think about this idea for a bit. Decide not to go with it for a few reasons.

1) If you look at the pic below the of the heat exchanger you will see a raised lip on the out side of the seal. That won't mate up to either of the CV filter mounts due to their wide filter flange. The lip would hit the mount before sealing. A different adapter would be needed. I am sure there are ones that would cover that aspect, but a lot of them have other draw backs as well. Namely the angle of the ports coming in. Many of those adapters have ports that enter the mount flat then turn a 90* into the filter. Flow loss there. Also, many of those are cast and I have read that they can leak. Both the adapter and mount were analyzed and selected to avoid both of those problems. Now, machining the mount to fit the exchanger could be an option.
DSC_6963.JPG


2) Adding the exchanger to the end of the filter mount would mean I would have to either go with a shorter filter or position the mount higher. I would also have been forced to use the 745 mount.

3) Every time the filter is changed there is a chance you will be loosening the through bolt on the exchanger.

Eliminating the stock 90* adapter and just running a remote filter is not a bad idea though.
 
Well, to tell the truth....

This is what has been rattling around in the old pea brain for quite some time. As long as the filter is remote, it should aught to work. Given the selection of fittings available, plumbing it should not be a complete nightmare.

Except, of course, for the complete lack of room in which to work.

Were I a much younger and healthier man, I do believe I would give it a go...

In the meanwhile, it will be interesting to see your results. I am assuming that you have a method to verify the speed at which the oil comes up to temperature?

IMO, for a vehicle that is a daily commuter, this mod has an overwhelmingly large benefit attached to it. There has always been a caveat attached to oil change intervals when it comes to short drives. And that is due to the oil not getting hot enough to drive out the volatiles...
 
More great tech. I suggest one more mod to the adapter bolt......weld a nut on top.
 
Except, of course, for the complete lack of room in which to work.
There was plenty of room at the rear of the engine until I installed the Viper coil, Catch can and two Oil pressure sensors at the end of the galley.
In the meanwhile, it will be interesting to see your results. I am assuming that you have a method to verify the speed at which the oil comes up to temperature?
A bit of high tech and low tech. OBDII for the coolant temp, my Arduino multigauge for the oil, a Nexus 7 tablet with voice count down timer, and a tape recorder. Due diligence and all. Time is in minutes. Temp is in F.

Two samples from today:
Code:
[b]Ambient: 	84	EGT:	79.6 [/b]
[b]Time	Coolant	Oil	AW4[/b]
0	80     	72	84
1	102    	74	88
2	130    	76	93
3	152    	79	95
4	183     84	98
5	187    	93	110
6	195    	104	120
7	208    	115	122
8	210    	134	128
9	210    	140	133

Code:
[b]Ambient: 	89	EGT:	87
Time	Coolant	Oil	AW4 [/b]
1	96     	94	92
2	131    	93	96
3	157    	93	101
4	180    	97	107
5	185    	104	118
6	190    	115	120
7	195    	121	122
8	201    	125	129
9	209    	132	143
10	210    	144	152
11	210     152	156
12	210	160	161
13	210	166	164
14	210	170	160
15	210    	175	157
16	210    	180	160
17	210    	183	159
18	210    	186	164
19	210    	188	166
20	210    	190	160
21	210    	191	158
22	210    	193	162
23	210    	194	157
24	210    	197	165
25	210    	200	168

I got some grinding done on the filter adapter. Just smoothing out sharp angles for improved flow. Every time I grind something, by the end I'm tired of it.. but I just can't get away from it.

I'm also planing to do the install in stages to not oil pressure changes as I have enough data for oil temp vs. oil pressure that I can see what changes. 1) modified stock filter adapter and bolt. 2) 1+ heat exchanger and oil filter crammed on the back some how, if it can fit, 3) 1+2+ relocated oil filter and its plumbing.

More great tech. I suggest one more mod to the adapter bolt......weld a nut on top.
That is an excellent idea. Except I already blasted and painted it.
 
Last edited:
WOW. I didn't realize it took that long for the engine oil to get up to temperature. I will *definitely* not be installing an engine oil cooler without a thermostat or heat exchanger - I only get my stuff up to temp maybe 2x a month as it is, based on those numbers.
 
This is really cool.
Where is the 'air' part? it looks more like a water-to-oil exchanger.
Are the numbers in the chart with it sitting idling in the driveway? If so, what do they look like when driving?
What is an acceptable 'up to proper oil temp' temp?
Sorry for all the newbie questions.
 
WOW. I didn't realize it took that long for the engine oil to get up to temperature. I will *definitely* not be installing an engine oil cooler without a thermostat or heat exchanger - I only get my stuff up to temp maybe 2x a month as it is, based on those numbers.

I have attempted to make this point on several occasions. There absolutely MUST be a T-Stat in an oil to air heat exchanger installation. The oil must come up to an acceptable temperature or damage will follow.

Acids form in the oil that can attack the bearings which are made out of "babbitt". These metal composite was invented in 1839 right here in the US of A. It has been used for bearings ever since.

Little History:
Originally, automotive bearing were poured into place and then line bored for size and alignment. Today's shell bearings still use babbitt metal with either tin or aluminium added depending on which bearing is being made.

In any event, the contaminants that naturally form in oil will destroy the bearing unless the oil is brought up to temperature.

On a personal note, I am well chuffed by this modification. IMO, all engines should come from the factory with oil temperature control.
Also on a personal note, I trust Talyn's work implicitly. His attention to detail/accuracy is beyond reproach. "Due diligence" is the word and Talyn practices it religiously.
 
WOW. I didn't realize it took that long for the engine oil to get up to temperature. I will *definitely* not be installing an engine oil cooler without a thermostat or heat exchanger - I only get my stuff up to temp maybe 2x a month as it is, based on those numbers.
This is why I tell people that they need an oil temp gauge before they install a air to oil cooler. It would be interesting to compare notes with someone else that has an oil temp gauge.

Where is the 'air' part? it looks more like a water-to-oil exchanger.
You don't say? It is a water to oil exchanger, don't know where you got the air part.
Are the numbers in the chart with it sitting idling in the driveway?
That would be one way to help kill a performance camshaft. No, this is while driving. Stop and go city driving mostly.
 
Two more time/temp tables:

Code:
7 miles
[b]Ambient: 	83	EGT:	79.3
Time	Coolant	Oil	AW4 [/b]
0	80	73	85
1	131	74	87
2	135	77	92
3	160	79	94
4	181	86	104
5	187	96	121
6	200	107	134
7	210	117	142
8	210	130	147
9	210	146	153
10	210	155	155
11	210	163	158
12	210	168	160
13	210	172	155
14	210	175	149
15	210	178	150
16	210	184	157

Code:
15 miles, about a 4 hour cool down since first table
[b]Ambient: 	90	EGT:	100
Time	Coolant	Oil	AW4[/b]
0	128	110	99
1	142	109	109
2	184	111	119
3	190	115	130
4	200	125	145
5	210	141	152
6	210	152	158
7	210	163	162
8	210	170	166
9	210	175	158
10	210	182	164
11	210	187	160
12	210	190	160
13	210	194	162
14	210	195	161
15	210	197	161
16	210	199	162

Unfortunately the tape ran out on the last one and didn't click off. About 8 minutes late the oil came up to temp. So, about 24 minutes for the oil to get up to temp.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top