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  #16  
Old February 20th, 2012, 22:20
Boost_Retard Boost_Retard is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

there are bumps on the shock shaft.
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  #17  
Old February 20th, 2012, 22:31
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xj bmx xj bmx is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boost_Retard View Post
there are bumps on the shock shaft.
This, not sure how everyone missed it???

as for the shock angle, we don't need our shocks to work at 100% when we are doing .3 mph over rocks and through trails. Unless you want to win the Baja 5000 your shock angle is fine.



The OP, I also would love to a symmetrical shock setup but its just not worth the hassle unless (as said before) you want to rebuild the whole upper shock crossmember.
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  #18  
Old February 20th, 2012, 23:56
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rockclimber rockclimber is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

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Originally Posted by Boost_Retard View Post
there are bumps on the shock shaft.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xj bmx View Post
This, not sure how everyone missed it???
those =/= bumpstops.

Quote:
as for the shock angle, we don't need our shocks to work at 100% when we are doing .3 mph over rocks and through trails. Unless you want to win the Baja 5000 your shock angle is fine.
maybe, but there is something to be said about running effectively valved shocks. and for those of us that have to run several miles of desert between the trails, you need real shock dampening.

Quote:
The OP, I also would love to a symmetrical shock setup but its just not worth the hassle unless (as said before) you want to rebuild the whole upper shock crossmember.
I will ask again, why?
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  #19  
Old February 21st, 2012, 00:42
bails85 bails85 is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Being that my shock mounting hole are way XXXXed up because of rust I was going to make a new cross member with the shocks at the back of the axle. Why is everyone so worried about axle wrap? The shock doesn't do a damn thing to prevent iAnd they are only used to dampen load and opposing force. How many sand cars, desert buggies, and some tropy trucks have angled shocks? Even some RC cars have angled shocks. Being angled doesn't affect its performance. As long as the shafts protrudes into the shock body dampening will happen. Yes it is out of the norm for an xj but not necessarily a bad thing. And the bump stops are not the end of the world. More needed on a jeep speed than a rock crawler. Over all unless you have to run the shocks symmetrically for a reason I would bother.
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  #20  
Old February 21st, 2012, 07:21
ktm racer 419 ktm racer 419 is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

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Originally Posted by xj bmx View Post

as for the shock angle, we don't need our shocks to work at 100% when we are doing .3 mph over rocks and through trails. Unless you want to win the Baja 5000 your shock angle is fine.

.
maybe if you have 100% traction at all times and dont use any speed or momentum ever,

shocks help keep the tires planted when tracton is lost or speed is involved.

that and i like doing more with my jeep than crawl rocks at .3 mph.
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  #21  
Old February 21st, 2012, 07:33
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beakie beakie is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

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Originally Posted by bails85 View Post
Being that my shock mounting hole are way XXXXed up because of rust I was going to make a new cross member with the shocks at the back of the axle.
Why is everyone so worried about axle wrap? The shock doesn't do a damn thing to prevent iAnd they are only used to dampen load and opposing force.
because the shocks as you say "dampen load & opposing forces" axle wrap is just that. if the axle tries to wrap around the axis of the tubes, staggered shocks can combat that... by "dampen load & opposing forces". make sense?

How many sand cars, desert buggies, and some tropy trucks have angled shocks? Even some RC cars have angled shocks. Being angled doesn't affect its performance.
shocks can be set up properly to run at angles, they can even be set up to run horizontal (think cantilever designs) but they are designed or valved to run in that configuration and a lot of time/money/effort is put into making them work that way. the shocks in the pictures are not designed to run at that angle, so the valving they are designed with is not working as effectively as it could be. will it be noticed at the slow speeds that are used in? maybe not, but as stated why not use them as they are designed to get the most out of them.

As long as the shafts protrudes into the shock body dampening will happen. Yes it is out of the norm for an xj but not necessarily a bad thing. And the bump stops are not the end of the world. More needed on a jeep speed than a rock crawler.
the lack of bumpstops may not be the end of the world, but seeing as they are a simple addition to an already modded rig, again why not add them?
as for jeepspeed more then rock crawling... have you ever been in a rig that drops off a big rock without bumpstops? it's either axle onto frame which is a pretty stiff jolt, or the shocks bottom out which really doesn't bode well for them lasting very long. for about $20 in parts you could atleast grab some after market universal bumpstops that can be made to work on a stock XJ, and would save your back & shocks from a lot of un-needed punishment.

Over all unless you have to run the shocks symmetrically for a reason I would bother.
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  #22  
Old February 21st, 2012, 07:42
XJLI XJLI is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

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Originally Posted by ktm racer 419 View Post
maybe if you have 100% traction at all times and dont use any speed or momentum ever,

shocks help keep the tires planted when tracton is lost or speed is involved.

that and i like doing more with my jeep than crawl rocks at .3 mph.
exactly. hit a bad washout on a exit ramp at a good pace with some weight in the back of your jeep and let me know where you end up.
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  #23  
Old February 21st, 2012, 13:58
xcm xcm is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by bails85 View Post
Being that my shock mounting hole are way XXXXed up because of rust I was going to make a new cross member with the shocks at the back of the axle. Why is everyone so worried about axle wrap? The shock doesn't do a damn thing to prevent iAnd they are only used to dampen load and opposing force. How many sand cars, desert buggies, and some tropy trucks have angled shocks? Even some RC cars have angled shocks. Being angled doesn't affect its performance. As long as the shafts protrudes into the shock body dampening will happen. Yes it is out of the norm for an xj but not necessarily a bad thing. And the bump stops are not the end of the world. More needed on a jeep speed than a rock crawler. Over all unless you have to run the shocks symmetrically for a reason I would bother.

FULL OF SHIT, as allways, trophy trucks dont run shocks like that, for one.

You guys are taking the lazy approach to building a jeep, and preaching that it's best. NO, your rig wont explode, sure, it'll work at .3mph. But your still wrong in 3 differant ways.

If my posts offended you, SORRY. Where i come from, i want people to critique my pictures, and if they see a problem, i wanna be the first to know, but you guys just want to get a pat on the back... that'd be fine if you did shit right!

If im an asshole, for calling you out on not having bumpstops, and a shitty shock angle, i dont wanna be the polite jackass that feeds you compliments despite the 2 outta 5 hit rate...
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  #24  
Old February 21st, 2012, 14:13
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ocean_jet ocean_jet is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

What do people do if they move the rear axle back a bit? Would you mount both shocks to the front of the axle?
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  #25  
Old February 21st, 2012, 16:11
zachandandy zachandandy is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

I just finished moving my axle back 3" and swapping in a Dana 60. My shocks will go on top of the leaf spring plates and through the floor to shock hoops. The people who argue shock angle doesn't matter are the same people who think that good shocks are a waste of money. Ride in a jeep with a quality mono tube shock mounted near vertical and tell me that crap shocks mounted at a 45 are even in the same ballpark.
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  #26  
Old February 21st, 2012, 18:59
ktm racer 419 ktm racer 419 is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by zachandandy View Post
Ride in a jeep with a quality mono tube shock mounted near vertical and tell me that crap shocks mounted at a 45 are even in the same ballpark.
fo serious. my 2.0 heavily valved remote resis were worth every penny even just if i was trail riding. i can comfortably cruise through rock strewn access trails that i used to have to crawl through at a snails pace.hell driving fast with good shocks is more comfortable than crawling with cheap shocks.
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  #27  
Old February 21st, 2012, 21:14
bails85 bails85 is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

I have seen tons of trophy trucks and big money sand cars have angled shock setups. Most of them are running a arms for long travel type suspension setups but the shock works the same way. Shaft goes in shock is working. It doesn't matter if you put the shock sideways if the shaft is being pushed onthe shock is dampening whatever is pushing it. Yes bump stops are a suspension component that should be there.... But so are sway bars and how many people remove them or disconnect them. That why currie and jks have systems that cost over 500 dollars to stop swaying. Your dick head remarks are old. Go kick your dog. Just because you second guess your work and would like to be assured that it is correct doesn't mean you have to pop off on everyone who doesn't do things to your liking. I'm not saying that the above pics are the best setup but don't trash him because you don't like the idea.






Quote:
Originally Posted by xcm View Post
FULL OF SHIT, as allways, trophy trucks dont run shocks like that, for one.

You guys are taking the lazy approach to building a jeep, and preaching that it's best. NO, your rig wont explode, sure, it'll work at .3mph. But your still wrong in 3 differant ways.

If my posts offended you, SORRY. Where i come from, i want people to critique my pictures, and if they see a problem, i wanna be the first to know, but you guys just want to get a pat on the back... that'd be fine if you did shit right!

If im an asshole, for calling you out on not having bumpstops, and a shitty shock angle, i dont wanna be the polite jackass that feeds you compliments despite the 2 outta 5 hit rate...
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  #28  
Old February 22nd, 2012, 00:13
Jeep450r Jeep450r is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Bails, sorry to pick on you.... but come on..

Quote:
Originally Posted by bails85 View Post
I have seen tons of trophy trucks and big money sand cars have angled shock setups.
Yeah sure, but those are completely different suspension set ups with custom valved coil overs that have stiffer valving to make up for the slight angle they are at. Or are you saying that you see shocks angled at 45* (/\) on prerunners and dune buggies? Yeah right.

Quote:
Shaft goes in shock is working. It doesn't matter if you put the shock sideways if the shaft is being pushed onthe shock is dampening whatever is pushing it.
I guess. It will still dampen, but not nearly as much it was designed to.

Quote:
Yes bump stops are a suspension component that should be there.... But so are sway bars and how many people remove them or disconnect them. That why currie and jks have systems that cost over 500 dollars to stop swaying.
Sway bars are removed/disconnected to improve off road stability and performance. Removing your bump stops can only hurt. Why even compare the two?

Oh and:
Quote:
Why is everyone so worried about axle wrap? The shock doesn't do a damn thing to prevent iAnd they are only used to dampen load and opposing force
Serious? Go tell that to the Jeep engineers.


Look, we aren't here to bash people and point out bad ideas just to piss people off. We are offering our opinions and knowledge, and the OP (and others) can take it or leave it. No point in getting all butt hurt because we are trying to save someone the trouble of doing something twice... Not to mention the money we could potentially be saving them from spending on new shocks and tires.
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  #29  
Old February 22nd, 2012, 05:31
XJLI XJLI is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

this thread sucks
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  #30  
Old February 22nd, 2012, 05:42
ktm racer 419 ktm racer 419 is offline
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Re: staggered rear shock conversion

Quote:
Originally Posted by bails85 View Post
Shaft goes in shock is working. It doesn't matter if you put the shock sideways if the shaft is being pushed onthe shock is dampening whatever is pushing it.
are you saying that a shock is just as effective when say 5" or less of the travel is used as opposed to 10"?

try again

Last edited by ktm racer 419; February 22nd, 2012 at 05:57.
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