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  #46  
Old July 26th, 2017, 20:02
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cal cal is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blondejoncherokee View Post
530$ is just nuts. I would expect a quality 2 row all aluminum to be around 250$-300. Ebay cheapo are like 170$.
Lol

The radiator in my xj is like $700?

Racer price is still more than this.
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  #47  
Old July 26th, 2017, 20:20
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Vanimal Vanimal is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cal View Post
Lol

The radiator in my xj is like $700?

Racer price is still more than this.
my camaro came with a Champion and it's a piece of shit. You get what you pay for with Ebay junk most of the time.
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  #48  
Old July 27th, 2017, 07:21
Mishimoto Mishimoto is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lazyxj View Post
Is there an industry accepted method of testing radiators and how they compare to each other?
The problem with all replacement radiators is that we don't have any real information as to how many BTUs any particular radiator is capable of removing.
Everthing is subjective, without any objective information.

I would spend $500 on a radiator that can be shown to be significantly better than Mopar's HD XJ radiator, PN# Mopar HD XJ radiator 52080104AC, the best of what I have tried.

Got data?
Sorry for the late reply guys, I'm not getting emails for replies or PMs for some reason.

As far as we know, there is no standardized test to compare one radiator to another; and you're right to be leery of claims of "optimized" performance or flow. The efficiency of an automotive radiator is dependent on so many fluid variables that it's nearly impossible to truly "optimize" a radiator. A radiator may be extremely efficient at one flow rate (or RPM, since the pump speed varies with engine speed), with a certain amount of air flowing through the fins; but at another RPM and the same air speed, or vice versa, it becomes inefficient. That's not even considering environmental factors.

What we typically do to develop a radiator is look at the OEM design and the space that it occupies in the vehicle to determine where we have areas to improve. Some improvements are pretty obvious, like if the OEM unit cracks often, but otherwise we look at factors that affect efficiency and durability (core thickness and construction, row height and tube / fin structure). Before we start building a prototype we run efficiency calculations on both the OEM unit and what we plan to build. If the geometry changes are large enough, as they were with this design we can be confident that our radiator will perform better than OEM.

So, long story short, there is no real standard for testing radiator efficiency, yet. Even if there was, there's nothing to say that the rad would perform the same in real world conditions. But what we can do is draw on our experience (of which we have quite a lot by now) and be as thorough as possible in the design and testing that we can do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by souske View Post
Mishimoto,
Looking at your Amazon reviews, there seem to be quite a few complaints about quality issues. Has there been a change to your design/production to remedy these issues?
https://www.amazon.com/Mishimoto-MMR...ustomerReviews
Of course. We always look at issues as a means to learn and improve our products. That particular Wrangler radiator has presented us with some unique challenges, the biggest of which is narrowing down the direct cause of the failures. To put it in perspective, we've sold over 500 of those radiators when I last checked at the beginning of this year. Only a small percentage of those have been returned under warranty - that's not to say we don't think it's an issue though.

One of the improvements we've made to our design process since the design of that radiator has been our use of high-accuracy 3D scanning. Being able to 3D scan vehicles has allowed us to improve our manufacturing tolerances and make sure that we're not excessively loading one part of the radiator, which may cause failures. We've also brought several failed radiators back to our R&D facility for inspection and have realized the need for stronger tubes on some vehicles. That's why we've included strutted / harmonica tubes on the XJ rad. We still don't have a 100% fix for the Wrangler radiator yet, but as we learn from it, we're applying that learning to our newer products and will continue to do so. Of course, if you ever have an issue with a radiator, or any of our products, you'll be covered under our lifetime warranty. That not only provides you with a replacement, but ensures that the radiator you receive will be the most up-to-date version, with any learning applied.

I hope that's answered your questions, feel free to let me know if you need anything else!

-Steve
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  #49  
Old July 27th, 2017, 07:24
burntkat burntkat is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blondejoncherokee View Post
530$ is just nuts. I would expect a quality 2 row all aluminum to be around 250$-300. Ebay cheapo are like 170$.
Ebay cheapos are a crap shoot. They may look pretty but the quality just isn't there, and the "lifetime warranty" is BS. How's China going to help you when you have to get to work on Monday?
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-89 S-10: SAS, D44s front/rear. 5.7L V8. 700R4 with 4L60E upgrades. Built in my driveway.
-90 XJ 4.0, AW4, 231J: Clayton's longarms, RE 5.5" coils, hybrid 6" leaf pack, 33/12.50/15" MTs, Rancho 99012s and 99624s, Tera HD SYE, custom sliders, BW flares. Next: finish front, build rear bumpers, Dana 44's front and rear.
-94 ZJ: Budget boost, 31's. The wife's mall crawler. She's gotten inchitis over my S10 though...
-97 XJ: Son's DD. Mild mods for the new driver.
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  #50  
Old July 27th, 2017, 07:25
burntkat burntkat is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cal View Post
Lol

The radiator in my xj is like $700?

Racer price is still more than this.
What radiator are you guys using, and did it come with an indentured redhead servant of prurient intent?
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-89 S-10: SAS, D44s front/rear. 5.7L V8. 700R4 with 4L60E upgrades. Built in my driveway.
-90 XJ 4.0, AW4, 231J: Clayton's longarms, RE 5.5" coils, hybrid 6" leaf pack, 33/12.50/15" MTs, Rancho 99012s and 99624s, Tera HD SYE, custom sliders, BW flares. Next: finish front, build rear bumpers, Dana 44's front and rear.
-94 ZJ: Budget boost, 31's. The wife's mall crawler. She's gotten inchitis over my S10 though...
-97 XJ: Son's DD. Mild mods for the new driver.
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  #51  
Old July 27th, 2017, 08:01
burntkat burntkat is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mishimoto View Post
.... Of course, if you ever have an issue with a radiator, or any of our products, you'll be covered under our lifetime warranty. That not only provides you with a replacement, but ensures that the radiator you receive will be the most up-to-date version, with any learning applied.
Obviously you guys can't do anything about the "broke on Sunday at 6pm and I have to get to work at 8am tomorrow" warranty repair- but let's say I claim it on Monday, how long am I waiting till the part is in hand?

IE, are they stocked and ready on the shelf, typically, or do I have to wait for the next container of radiators from China to arrive?

I'd love a lifetime warranty- but if my junk is deadlined for 3 months I won't be happy...
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-89 S-10: SAS, D44s front/rear. 5.7L V8. 700R4 with 4L60E upgrades. Built in my driveway.
-90 XJ 4.0, AW4, 231J: Clayton's longarms, RE 5.5" coils, hybrid 6" leaf pack, 33/12.50/15" MTs, Rancho 99012s and 99624s, Tera HD SYE, custom sliders, BW flares. Next: finish front, build rear bumpers, Dana 44's front and rear.
-94 ZJ: Budget boost, 31's. The wife's mall crawler. She's gotten inchitis over my S10 though...
-97 XJ: Son's DD. Mild mods for the new driver.
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  #52  
Old July 27th, 2017, 08:59
turbobrick turbobrick is offline
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What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

$500 for a reliable radiator in an XJ is very reasonable IMHO. I was fed up with all the options when building my XJ, so I spent $1k and waited months for Ron Davis. Honestly it was worth the wait, and I'd do it again. Everybody being so cheap is huge negative in the XJ community, good parts cost.
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  #53  
Old July 27th, 2017, 11:27
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by burntkat View Post
What radiator are you guys using, and did it come with an indentured redhead servant of prurient intent?
I'd have to go digging for the invoice, but off a quick search I think this one:

http://www.griffinrad.com/load_detai... y_id=8-00168
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  #54  
Old July 27th, 2017, 16:41
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blondejoncherokee blondejoncherokee is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

So would there be a 1-row all aluminum with a single 2" row and a really high fins per inch count for say 250$ ? and a 2 row all aluminum with (2) 1.25" rows with a really high fins per inch count for say 500$ ?



if we can be sure its high quality I suppose it will be worth the price. Ive had good luck with the eBay cheap 2 rows myself, but I also replace radiators every 3 years or so regardless one way or the other .

I suppose I would not mind the price tag as much if I knew for a fact that these things are leagues better over the eBay cheap-os in every way possible.
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  #55  
Old July 28th, 2017, 07:03
Mishimoto Mishimoto is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by burntkat View Post
Obviously you guys can't do anything about the "broke on Sunday at 6pm and I have to get to work at 8am tomorrow" warranty repair- but let's say I claim it on Monday, how long am I waiting till the part is in hand?

IE, are they stocked and ready on the shelf, typically, or do I have to wait for the next container of radiators from China to arrive?

I'd love a lifetime warranty- but if my junk is deadlined for 3 months I won't be happy...
For 99% of our products you'll never have to wait more than the time it takes to ship from our warehouse in NV. We ship UPS ground in most cases and do ask the customer to pay $30 shipping for replacement radiators - but if you get a hold of me through here or ask for me when you contact customer service, I can usually figure out a way to at least get it there faster.

Hope that helps,

-Steve
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  #56  
Old July 28th, 2017, 07:06
Mishimoto Mishimoto is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blondejoncherokee View Post
So would there be a 1-row all aluminum with a single 2" row and a really high fins per inch count for say 250$ ? and a 2 row all aluminum with (2) 1.25" rows with a really high fins per inch count for say 500$ ?



if we can be sure its high quality I suppose it will be worth the price. Ive had good luck with the eBay cheap 2 rows myself, but I also replace radiators every 3 years or so regardless one way or the other .

I suppose I would not mind the price tag as much if I knew for a fact that these things are leagues better over the eBay cheap-os in every way possible.
Don't forget that, even after the pre-sale ends, our distributors can get you a pretty good discount off the MSRP, and it will still be covered under the lifetime warranty through us.

-Steve
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  #57  
Old July 28th, 2017, 08:15
burntkat burntkat is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Well it seems promisinig, I remain hopeful that this is the way to go. How do you think these would work out for a Chevy 350 V8 swap?
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-89 S-10: SAS, D44s front/rear. 5.7L V8. 700R4 with 4L60E upgrades. Built in my driveway.
-90 XJ 4.0, AW4, 231J: Clayton's longarms, RE 5.5" coils, hybrid 6" leaf pack, 33/12.50/15" MTs, Rancho 99012s and 99624s, Tera HD SYE, custom sliders, BW flares. Next: finish front, build rear bumpers, Dana 44's front and rear.
-94 ZJ: Budget boost, 31's. The wife's mall crawler. She's gotten inchitis over my S10 though...
-97 XJ: Son's DD. Mild mods for the new driver.
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  #58  
Old July 28th, 2017, 08:35
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cal cal is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mishimoto View Post
For 99% of our products you'll never have to wait more than the time it takes to ship from our warehouse in NV. We ship UPS ground in most cases and do ask the customer to pay $30 shipping for replacement radiators - but if you get a hold of me through here or ask for me when you contact customer service, I can usually figure out a way to at least get it there faster.

Hope that helps,

-Steve


wait. you make customers pay freight on warranty repairs?
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  #59  
Old July 28th, 2017, 15:14
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XJEEPER XJEEPER is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

Interesting dialog.

Many XJers don't have a problem dropping $1,000 on aftermarket lighting and audio equipment.
They also spend several thousand dollars on lifts, tires, wheels, armor, roof racks, etc, which add weight and rolling/wind resistance to the rig and make the engine work harder, which taxes the stock cooling system.

Spending $500 on a better radiator to offset the additional cooling demands created by all of these mods and to keep your engine performing at designed operating temps for over 100k miles seems like a pretty good deal.
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  #60  
Old July 28th, 2017, 15:16
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Kejtar Kejtar is offline
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Re: What happened to the Mishimoto radiator thread?

But you cant show off a radiator
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