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Upper tri-link build

87xjco

87xjco

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Denver, CO
Well I don't know how well this is gonna work, but i'm trying a home built upper arm with my HP44 install. I hope to get more articulation and be able to eliminate the track bar. But I hear this only works with full hydro steering, so I may end up going back to 4 link and track bar.

I started with some 1.5" tube and made a few bends
DSC04133.JPG


I didn't plan on using this joint, with bolt facing forward like this, but theres just not enough room to turn it sideways, this joint uses a 3/4" bolt, it's BIG.
DSC04147.JPG


I have the axle stuffed all the way up to the stop on the left side so I can check for clearance, looks good
DSC04149.JPG


DSC04150.JPG


I made a mirror image of that tube and then spent alot of time getting the tubes to fit good
Dsc04152.jpg


The tubes are tacked in place, i'll pull everything out as a unit and hope it doesn't move when I weld it.
Dsc04156.jpg
 
Terry,

Beezil tried something VERY similar back in the day on that cool buggy he built and IIRC, he chalked it up to a complete failure. Or maybe it was just his home-brew swivel joint that didn't work out well...... :dunno:

Dunno if our Search feature will bring that thread up, it's been probably 4 years ago.

I'll look around for it - hopefully someone else will remember what it was titled or where the thread is but I think you'd benefit from reading it before you start buring those pieces home and scrap a perfectly good SF joint.
 
Last edited:
Found pics over on XJDB:

19_hbone61108.jpg


19_hbone60107.jpg


19_hbone48116.jpg


19_hbone36113.jpg


"WanderinWillys" built this:

3rd_link_bushing_mount2.jpg


Dunno if he's still around or running that set up anymore.

I can't find the thread about Beezil's details of how his wishbone worked out.
 
Thanks Troy, I knew it has been done but I didn't research it as much as I should, and i'm not running full hydro steering, so I expect that it's not gonna be very street friendly.

But I guess i'm stuborn and want to at least drive it (carefully) with this arm and see what it feels like. But Truely I think the odds are against me on this one.

I feel the 5 link I had worked well, but I always felt the arms kind of worked against each other when articulating. And now with hydro assist steering, there's alot more room without a track bar.

Maybe it's one of those things that seems easy and will work great on paper, but not so easy in the real world!
 
Why not just remove one of the upper links from your 5-link setup?

Take a look for XJ_Ranger's build, I think that's what he did. He reinforced the frame and axle side mounts on the passenger side and got rid of the driver side arm entirely.

That turns it into a 3-link with panhard, which is what a lot of us are running now. I've been more than pleased with the way mine is holding up.

edit: this one.
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=934580
 
I considered that and may end up running that set up, the builds i've seen here on Naxja all look like they work well.

I guess I just don't like the track bar, it's geometry of moving the axle sideways as it moves up and down bugs me on some weird level. And it would be nice having the space open that a trackbar occupies.
 
YELLAHEEP said:
Beezil tried something VERY similar back in the day on that cool buggy he built and IIRC, he chalked it up to a complete failure. Or maybe it was just his home-brew swivel joint that didn't work out well...... :dunno:
Click to expand...

Beezil did go through several joints, but his wishbone was a success! He did eliminate the trackbar and run full hydro too.
Billy
 
YELLAHEEP said:
Found pics over on XJDB:

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/d/2163-2/19_hbone61108.jpg

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/d/2161-2/19_hbone60107.jpg

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/d/2159-2/19_hbone48116.jpg

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/d/2153-2/19_hbone36113.jpg
"WanderinWillys" built this:

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/d/2520-2/3rd_link_bushing_mount2.jpg

Dunno if he's still around or running that set up anymore.

I can't find the thread about Beezil's details of how his wishbone worked out.
Click to expand...

Add VintageSpeed to the wishbone crew...
19_326954103_0_ALB103.jpg

19_326954103_0_ALB106.jpg

http://www.xjdb.com/gallery/v/xjs/?g2_page=81

Billy
 
David Taylor said:
I wouldn't want to load that joint that way. I think you need to turn it 90 deg.

I feel it should be as Jim did it.
Click to expand...
Man, haven't seen those pictures in awhile. How did these setups work out, I don't even remember. As for the orientation of the joint why's that? Typically you don't want the loads to go through the retainers. And since you have loads coming from all directions, it's tough to get it in the right spot.
 
I think you may have some bumpsteer problems. It's not a matter of whether it will work or not, it's how well you want it to work on the road. Why no go full hydro and not worry about it?
 
Kaczman said:
I think you may have some bumpsteer problems. It's not a matter of whether it will work or not, it's how well you want it to work on the road. Why no go full hydro and not worry about it?
Click to expand...

why would that be? no trackbar, steering should remain pretty much spot on, no?
 
I know what Kaczman is saying. And I am worried about road driveability.

I believe the problem comes from the way the body can pivot at that upper center mount.

When a drag link exerts force against the axle, the body is gonna try and move away from that force, it can't go straight sideways, but the body can roll. The same is true when the road exerts force on the wheels.

That's why track bars need to be mounted at the same angle as drag links

Full hydro would eliminate that connection between the body and the axle.

But I haven't heard alot of good things from people with full hydro, when it comes to road stability either.

The load on the joint end caps worries me some to, I don't know if they are designed to take force in that direction.


So to recap..................

I'm screwed :sad1: :sad1: :sad1:

Likely bad/dangerous bump steer, possible catastrophic joint failure, bent tubing that may collapse, a severe accident waiting to happen.

Other then that, I think it will work great, I just need to find someone to test drive it for me on a deserted road :jester:
 
Flatten your drag link as much as possible, should help reduce your jacking. The joint in that direction may be ok. The loads are going to be trying to keep the axle from rotating. Might be the leaset of the forces involved. With the joint in the direction that David shown, the joint ends have to resist the weight of the axle pulling down or pushing up, so the wieght of the axle dropping or bottoming. If slow probably not a problem but given any speed and you could have problems.
 
Also moving the shock out as far as possible will help with the jacking, bumpsteer isn't jacking though, it's the wheels moving left to right as you run through your travel.
 
Weasel said:
Might be the leaset of the forces involved. With the joint in the direction that David shown, the joint ends have to resist the weight of the axle pulling down or pushing up, so the wieght of the axle dropping or bottoming. If slow probably not a problem but given any speed and you could have problems.
Click to expand...
You might want to rethink this. That joint would carry no load in the up -down
of the axle. It's only job is to keep the axle from rotating and keeping the axle under the rig
 
These brackets need some gusseting, but they are centered and the tubes are welded to the joint now. Man it would be a shame to have to cut all this stuff off:(
DSC04169r.jpg


DSC04170r.jpg


The axle is hanging at the same position as when the spring are in and the vehicle is on the ground (ride height)
DSC04172r.jpg
 
The only loads that joint will see is side to side & front to back. It's oriented great for side to side, but oriented very badly for front to back. The only time you'll have trouble is when you put a lot of stress on the front end. That is a big joint, but I think it will get beat out pretty fast.
 
David Taylor said:
You might want to rethink this. That joint would carry no load in the up -down
of the axle. It's only job is to keep the axle from rotating and keeping the axle under the rig
Click to expand...

yeah late night, I was thinking if the joint maxes out...i think. :) The travel up and down will be taken by the shocks or limit straps.
 
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