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  #16  
Old September 27th, 2017, 17:09
tn_outside2003 tn_outside2003 is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Not hard to find a TUPY head. Get one off of ANY wrangler made after 2002 with a 4.0. They are ALL TUPY heads. And for my 2000 XJ it was direct swap. No one would guarantee a direct swap for me, but it was exact. Every bolt. Obviously, individual results may vary. My XJ is east coast and it was exact for me.

Don't harass the parts yard guy. He has no idea what a TUPY head is and does not want to go searching heads for casting numbers. Just get a wrangler 4.0 head from after 2002 and have it remanufactured at your local machine/head shop. The bad heads were swapped over around 2001.5 manufacture year. Supposedly ALL of the 2002s were TUPY heads. Go later than 2002 to be safe.

I'm just some guy with a jeep. I could be wrong.

Last edited by tn_outside2003; September 27th, 2017 at 17:19.
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  #17  
Old September 27th, 2017, 18:43
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ehall ehall is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Around here the junkyard TUPY heads are outrageous expensive, cheaper to buy a new Clearwater Cylinder Head than to buy a TUPY and also pay to have it machined.
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  #18  
Old September 27th, 2017, 19:49
vertrx vertrx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

I'm wondering if I go to the picknpull, I'll have to do the job twice, actually removing the head twice and installing once. There are several vehicles with the TUPY head from what I recollect. Looks like the SOHC with or without cam is $49.95 with $10 core charge.

Just not sure I want to work at this in this heat and humidity.

Of course then I'll have to have it rebuilt as well as was stated above. Then there's that Jeep salvage yard in Ohio that would have them. I'll have to do the comparative shopping.

I do thank you all for the advice and help that you've given me in this quest.

One thing on my mind is that with this event, I'm not sure if I shouldn't part out the vehicle. I paid $3500 for it a couple of years ago. Its approaching 200,000 miles on the body and about 140,000 on the motor for which I paid $1200 including installation. I don't think the Jeep will make that back running ok so if its the head, I'll be upside down in it.
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  #19  
Old September 28th, 2017, 13:15
Green XJ Jeep Green XJ Jeep is online now
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Re: Where would I start??

Quote:
Originally Posted by vertrx View Post
I paid $3500 for it a couple of years ago. Its approaching 200,000 miles on the body and about 140,000 on the motor for which I paid $1200 including installation. I don't think the Jeep will make that back running ok so if its the head, I'll be upside down in it.
Welcome to the automotive hobby. Seldomly do you get back what you put into them
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  #20  
Old September 28th, 2017, 15:52
tn_outside2003 tn_outside2003 is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

A good XJ sells for $10,000 and the prices are going UP, not down. Just saying.....

BTW: I mean a GOOD XJ. Mine is a 2000. Leather front seats. A/C. Cruise. Aftermarket bluetooth radio. Roof Rack. No dents (has minor dings). Good carpets. No damage to interior. Minor rust (mostly under the bumper end on the passenger side, rear. OME lift, transfer case output shaft mod with good double cardan rear drive shaft, new calipers and brake cylinders, front disconnects, Wrangler tires, ready to go. For a jeep like mine....you will pay. People ask me if it is for sell and I tell them to start at 10 grand and go UP. It would cost me $45,000 to get a vehicle as good as the XJ I have. And even then it is debatable. The XJ market has flipped, like a lot of classic car markets. They are increasing in value if they are not rusted out. Recent barn find with 4,500 original miles is about to list at $15,000 and honestly....I have been thinking about buying it. A brand new XJ, smells new inside, for $15,000........... Where can you get MORE vehicle for the same price?

Just saying.

Last edited by tn_outside2003; September 28th, 2017 at 16:06.
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  #21  
Old September 28th, 2017, 15:53
tn_outside2003 tn_outside2003 is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

If you want to part it....contact me. I might pay you cash for it.

As for purchasing a head: Use the interwebs to get junkyard telephone numbers and start calling. Have it shipped. This will cost you more than $600 in parts and rebuild. Plus the cost of swapping out heads if you pay someone. Cars have a body, a tranny, and an engine. Rebuilding any of the three is pricey...but usually worth it if you want to keep the vehicle.
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  #22  
Old September 28th, 2017, 19:08
vertrx vertrx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Yes, I hear what is being said. Mine is a very nice unit. Previous owner put in a three inch lift. I don't know about the SYE, doesn't have the front sway bar disconnects, but has Rubicon wheels and custom rear bumper, front JCR. Leather, etc. So too nice to part out I think. Besides wouldn't get enough for it...thinking out loud. Close to 190,000 on the odometer. Not worth a whole lot in that regard I think. With a Wrangler LJ and a Liberty diesel, I need to thin the herd I think.

OK, so, called Clearwater Cylinder. They carry another rebuilt 0331 that they guarantee for life. They said they build these to avoid the issue and the TUPY would give me the same issues. (Only repeating what he said, I don't have any facts on that last statement). Stated that the head would be $455 need gaskets and head bolts. So he said they sell that could do it for $620 shipped. (So $600 not far off)

So, I just received my compression tester and will so a search on how to do the compression test unless someone offers up a quick how to
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  #23  
Old September 29th, 2017, 06:39
RCP Phx RCP Phx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

I bought mine new from CCH! 510$ w/ free shipping.
https://www.amazon.com/BRAND-CHEROKE...d+for+jeep+4.0
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  #24  
Old September 29th, 2017, 15:40
tn_outside2003 tn_outside2003 is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

I would not fool with a 0331 head. They are defective. Shaving it and doing a valve job does not address the inherent weakness of the head. And the TUPY head WILL NOT give you the same problem. The TUPY head was recast with thicker walls between the trouble cylinders specifically so it WOULD NOT give the same problems. They just want to sell you a head. Lifetime warranty means they will ship you another rebuilt head if the one you have fails. Plus, they want the failed head back, at your $100 shipping expense, before they ship you ANOTHER 0331 head that will likely fail. And then, when you get your "free" replacement, you have to do all the work or pay someone else to. And the warranty does not include the head gasket, which is also expensive. Replacing a head is a hassle. I would not want to replace one twice on the same vehicle...even if the replacement IS free. I would put on a good one the first time around. That means getting a TUPY head. I have never heard of a TUPY head failing due to cracks. Valves wear out. Head gaskets can fail. But heads should not EVER fail. Unless they are poorly made....like ALL of the 0331 heads were.

I understand that you can get a head, ready to go, from Clearwater. But shortcuts will not really be shortcuts in this instance (IMO). I would go the long route by getting a used head, paying to have it remanufactured, and then swapping them out.

Just my opinion. I'm just some guy with an XJ. Individual results may vary.
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  #25  
Old September 29th, 2017, 18:03
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ehall ehall is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Quote:
Originally Posted by vertrx View Post
OK, so, called Clearwater Cylinder. They carry another rebuilt 0331 that they guarantee for life. They said they build these to avoid the issue and the TUPY would give me the same issues. (Only repeating what he said, I don't have any facts on that last statement). Stated that the head would be $455 need gaskets and head bolts. So he said they sell that could do it for $620 shipped. (So $600 not far off)
That's about what my buddy here paid for it. One thing is the warranty is only good if you get it installed by an ASE certified mechanic (need a receipt), and they won't honor the warranty if you do it yourself.

TUPY is a corrective casting and will not have the same problem; if you can find one for a couple hundred go for it and get a machine shop to work on it.

I would be comfortable doing either one. Whichever is cheaper. You should replace the head bolts either way.

Quote:
So, I just received my compression tester and will so a search on how to do the compression test unless someone offers up a quick how to
Remove the spark plugs, screw the gauge into cylinder #1, crank the starter a few times (enough for ~3 full rotations), and then read the gauge to see the compression on that cylinder. Reset the gauge and move it to the next cylinder, repeat as needed.
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  #26  
Old September 29th, 2017, 22:01
vertrx vertrx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

So even though Clearwater was a recommendation per one poster, it seems that when you drill down into the facts and look at what other's experiences are, its not a good way to go.

I specifically asked about the 0331 heads they use and they stated the heads were strengthened. Nothing about having them installed by a professional mechanic to protect the warranty. Sounds like a deal made with hidden requirements.

Guess I'll find a TUPY head at the yard.

Thank you for providing the procedure for the compression test. That was definitely needed and much appreciated!!
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  #27  
Old September 29th, 2017, 23:16
RCP Phx RCP Phx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Quote:
Originally Posted by RCP Phx View Post
I bought mine new from CCH! 510$ w/ free shipping.
https://www.amazon.com/BRAND-CHEROKE...d+for+jeep+4.0
These are another vendors casting of the TUPY head and have a great reputation!
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  #28  
Old September 30th, 2017, 05:50
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ehall ehall is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Quote:
Originally Posted by ehall View Post
Remove the spark plugs, screw the gauge into cylinder #1, crank the starter a few times (enough for ~3 full rotations), and then read the gauge to see the compression on that cylinder. Reset the gauge and move it to the next cylinder, repeat as needed.
BTW you should pull the fuel pump relay too
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  #29  
Old September 30th, 2017, 12:22
vertrx vertrx is offline
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Re: Where would I start??

Fuel pump relay! Check!

Also, that amazon reference is for a 0331 head by Clearwater Cylinder, the company that we have been talking about. Not sure, based on what I've been reading here, that the 0331 head is for me since I've been through one already...actually two by now since the first motor had that issue and I had to pick up my son in Nebraska with the trailer after that one gave up the ghost. Best part: January! What a fun trip that was!

Ralf
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