Camera Inquiry

[MTNTECH]

Being a DSLR Challenged person I have been looking at upgrading my point and shoot capabilities. Looking at few models from Canon and Nikon. To keep cost down and use AA batteries my favorite choice is #1 Nikon Coolpix L100 though Canon Powershot SX110IS is also a possibility. To go overboard both Nikon Coolpix P90 and Canon Powershot SX10 might be on the list. I'm just trying to get a little closer to some of the "professional" IC photographers without classes on DSLR use. What's the thoughts here?


http://www.nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Nikon/Product/Digital-Camera/26170/COOLPIX-L100.html

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=17480

http://www.nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Nikon/Product/Digital-Camera/26171/COOLPIX-P90.html

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=17630

[DrMoab]

my suggestion...go with Cannon for P&S cameras...period.

My SLR is a Nikon but my P&S is a Cannon.

I'm also not a fan of cameras that use AA batteries. I understand the idea of being able to replace them on the trail but I find cameras that use Li-ion packs last 5 times as long and usually will go for a weekend of heavy shooting without needing a recharge. It's also nothing to throw the batt on a charger hooked to an inverter if you are out on the trail.

[Magus2727]

The Zoom is whats going to be your friend. The P90 has some amazing zoom with the high MP count.

I would go with the P90, but realize that its not a true SLR and will not have interchangeable lenses.

[MTNTECH]

my suggestion...go with Cannon for P&S cameras...period.

My SLR is a Nikon but my P&S is a Cannon.

I'm also not a fan of cameras that use AA batteries. I understand the idea of being able to replace them on the trail but I find cameras that use Li-ion packs last 5 times as long and usually will go for a weekend of heavy shooting without needing a recharge. It's also nothing to throw the batt on a charger hooked to an inverter if you are out on the trail.

Both of the Canon's use AA's. The SX110IS uses 2 and the SX10IS use's 4 and the Nikon L100 use's 4 AA's. The Nikon P90 use's EN-EL5 Lithium-ion Battery (rechargeable). I can use a solar charger for AA's. If there was a car/solar charger for the non-AA batteries that would negate the AA battery preference. Does your Nikon charge from the USB connection? They do make solar chargers for USB connected devices. I'm just not familiar with camera power.

[MTNTECH]

The Zoom is whats going to be your friend. The P90 has some amazing zoom with the high MP count.

I would go with the P90, but realize that its not a true SLR and will not have interchangeable lenses.

Zoom is a major factor in my purchase. I do want the best non-interchangeable lens setup that I can get.

[DrMoab]

Both of the Canon's use AA's. The SX110IS uses 2 and the SX10IS use's 4 and the Nikon L100 use's 4 AA's. The Nikon P90 use's EN-EL5 Lithium-ion Battery (rechargeable). I can use a solar charger for AA's. If there was a car/solar charger for the non-AA batteries that would negate the AA battery preference. Does your Nikon charge from the USB connection? They do make solar chargers for USB connected devices. I'm just not familiar with camera power.

No, my Nikon charges of a seperate cord that plugs into the wall but... I have two batteries. With those two batteries I took over a thousand pictures in Colorado last summer and never needed a recharge.

I didn't look at the links for the cameras you posted but make sure you are looking at optical zoom not digital. All the digital zoom gets you is a cropped photo from the same image. And...it looks that way.

My money is still on the Cannon, the photo quality I have seen come from the several people I know who own them is incredible. The one I have, quality wise pushes the quality on my big camera. I don't get the power over depth of field or quite the contrast but the quality is outstanding.

[DrMoab]

Zoom is a major factor in my purchase. I do want the best non-interchangeable lens setup that I can get.

Have you ever considered going with a little bigger(but not interchangable) lens and going with something like the Cannon G10 or the Nikon P6000?

Nikon...
http://www.nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Nikon/Product/Digital-Camera/26135/COOLPIX-P6000.html

Cannon...
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=17624

Both of these cameras are now in the sub-400 dollar range and both of them give you so much more control over what you can do. They have slightly bigger sensors and higher quality and bigger lenses than most of the P&S cameras on the market and will get you much much closer to the features of a true DSLR but still in a compact package.

If I was buying a new pocket camera today it WOULD be one of these two cameras, no questions asked.

If you ask around you will find that the G9, the older model of the G10 is probably the most packed around pocket camera by wedding photographers and other professionals who mostly think a regular P&S camera is beneith them.

[DeadEyeJ]

I'm also not a fan of cameras that use AA batteries. I understand the idea of being able to replace them on the trail but I find cameras that use Li-ion packs last 5 times as long and usually will go for a weekend of heavy shooting without needing a recharge. It's also nothing to throw the batt on a charger hooked to an inverter if you are out on the trail.

If you're talking regular old alkaline batteries you are completely correct. However, I use the lithium batteries and they do (as advertised) last about 7-8 times as long in a camera. I shoot roughly a hundred shots a day at work with a Nikon point and shoot and I change my 2AA batteries once a week or even longer. Alkaline batteries last a day or less.

The good rechargeable AA's last about 4-5 times as long as alkalines and you can get them that recharge fully from dead in 15 minutes flat. They sell them at Wal-Mart for about 15 bucks with a charger I believe.

Jared:patriot:

[XJEEPER]

Big fan of the Energizer NiMh AA batteries. Use them in the P/S camera, Wii controllers, GPS, Hair clippers, Altec Lansing Sansa speakers.....got about 12 of them.

[5-90]

My Canon really likes the Energizer Titanium batteries. I've not had any reason to try anything more expensive than that, but there's a "high-grade" Titanium, and the Lithium AA as well (I remember using Kodak Lithium AA batteries in my Walkman yonks ago - amazing life.)

I haven't gone DSLR yet - but I have shot SLR before. I've still got my old Pentax K-1000, so I'll probably go K-mount Pentax when I go DSLR (saves money, I won't have to buy another set of lenses and adapters.)

Digital zoom can be divided into two types - optical zoom and digital zoom. My Canon A550 is 8x total zoom - 4x optical (the first part) and 4x digital (after full optical zoom.) I don't usually run it past the 4x optical zoom - I take technical pix, and using digital zoom can cost detail (since it's not done by optical mangification, but by "computer guesswork" and interpolation of visible picture elements. Get as much "optical" zoom as you can - 4x or 5x is usually about the limit for P&S cameras (for most people, that's sufficient. I can get gross surface textures with 4x optical zoom.)

[MTNTECH]

Have you ever considered going with a little bigger(but not interchangable) lens and going with something like the Cannon G10 or the Nikon P6000?

Nikon...
http://www.nikonusa.com/Find-Your-Nikon/Product/Digital-Camera/26135/COOLPIX-P6000.html

Cannon...
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=17624

Both of these cameras are now in the sub-400 dollar range and both of them give you so much more control over what you can do. They have slightly bigger sensors and higher quality and bigger lenses than most of the P&S cameras on the market and will get you much much closer to the features of a true DSLR but still in a compact package.

If I was buying a new pocket camera today it WOULD be one of these two cameras, no questions asked.

If you ask around you will find that the G9, the older model of the G10 is probably the most packed around pocket camera by wedding photographers and other professionals who mostly think a regular P&S camera is beneith them.

For Canon the G10 has 5X optical @ 14.7MP, SX110IS has 10X optical @ 10MP and the SX10 has 20X optical @ 10MP. For Nikon the P6000 has 4X optical @ 13.5MP, L100 has 15X optical @ 10MP and P90 has 24Xoptical @ 12.1MP. My Olympus 3X optical @ 4MP proved a long time ago that there is no such thing as Digital Zoom IMOP. Both of the models you pointed out I did look at but it was lack of optical zoom that turned me away. Keep pointing stuff out, you might have me talked into a Canon SX1 10MP CMOS 20X optical with 1080P HD @ 30FPS movie capability.

[Magus2727]

I am not sure if this is true for cannon but when I was looking at there P&S cameras they still had time limits for video recording (20-30 second max, and sometimes less for higher quality). I have not looked to see if that is true for the higher end ones, but on there web site it does not say anything about length of video time. with that said though a camera is meant to be a camera not a camcorder... The Nixon one says it will record till your card is full.

Cannon does not mention the use of a SDHD card but would imagine that they would. Wish both cameras stuck with a high speed CF card like in DSLR..

The Nikon has a GPS Tag feature that will tag where the picture was taken. That would be cool for those jeep shots so it could be cataloged and people not know could find exactly where the image was taken, along with the Nikon one alloing for 2 gigs of free uploads to there online image storage.

If you cant tell I am Pro-Nikon. Regardless the two cameras will get you the shots you want!

Its all the little things I guess... The Nikon also to me looks better, and may be smaller (Cannon does not have weight or size listed on there tech sheet)

Let us know what you get!

Edit: Just looked on BestBuy and the Cannon sells for $50.00 below MSRP the cannon is $25 less then MSRP. So The Nikon is 25 cheaper (but is also an online only so you will have to pay for shipping, the Cannon looks like you can pick it up in store)

[DrMoab]

For Canon the G10 has 5X optical @ 14.7MP, SX110IS has 10X optical @ 10MP and the SX10 has 20X optical @ 10MP. For Nikon the P6000 has 4X optical @ 13.5MP, L100 has 15X optical @ 10MP and P90 has 24Xoptical @ 12.1MP. My Olympus 3X optical @ 4MP proved a long time ago that there is no such thing as Digital Zoom IMOP. Both of the models you pointed out I did look at but it was lack of optical zoom that turned me away. Keep pointing stuff out, you might have me talked into a Canon SX1 10MP CMOS 20X optical with 1080P HD @ 30FPS movie capability.

What the both of those cameras lack in optical zoom they totally make up for in lens quality and camera functionality.

A lot of this is personal shooting style but I've found that most of the cameras that offer great zooming abilitys suck in wide angle shooting. If you plan on doing a lot of landscape style shooting or shooting a lot of the trail, wide angle is pretty darn important.

[DrMoab]

I am not sure if this is true for cannon but when I was looking at there P&S cameras they still had time limits for video recording (20-30 second max, and sometimes less for higher quality). I have not looked to see if that is true for the higher end ones, but on there web site it does not say anything about length of video time. with that said though a camera is meant to be a camera not a camcorder... The Nixon one says it will record till your card is full.
Video should be shot with a video camera IMO. Whether a P&S camera shoots video is irrelivant to me. Like I've said before, its all about the features you are looking for. Everyone has a different need.

Cannon does not mention the use of a SDHD card but would imagine that they would. Wish both cameras stuck with a high speed CF card like in DSLR..
Anything sold now will take SDHD cards. My new cannon does but my old Pentax P&S that I bought three years ago does too.

The Nikon has a GPS Tag feature that will tag where the picture was taken. That would be cool for those jeep shots so it could be cataloged and people not know could find exactly where the image was taken, along with the Nikon one alloing for 2 gigs of free uploads to there online image storage.
This is one thing I wish both of my cameras had.


If you cant tell I am Pro-Nikon. Regardless the two cameras will get you the shots you want!
I'm also pro-Nikon but not when it comes to small cameras. I think Cannon has it all over nikon in image quality, which to me is a thousand times more important than all the nifty features you can get.

Its all the little things I guess... The Nikon also to me looks better, and may be smaller (Cannon does not have weight or size listed on there tech sheet)

Smaller is not any indication of better. I would rather pack a little bulk and know I was getting the best quality pic possible.

[MTNTECH]

A lot of this is personal shooting style but I've found that most of the cameras that offer great zooming abilitys suck in wide angle shooting. If you plan on doing a lot of landscape style shooting or shooting a lot of the trail, wide angle is pretty darn important.

Landscape/trail shooting was the primary reason for looking at the zoom capabilities and lens quality was why I was only considering Nikon or Canon. Do you know of any site that could detail the limitations of wide angle shooting with this type of P&S Zoom lens? I have already found some info detailing lack of control for DOF shooting on P&S cameras. With what you have pointed out it makes the Canon SX110IS with only 10X optical zoom @ 9MP seem the better choice for a compromise in lens quality/zoom capabilities. I don't intend on reaching your level of photography but would still like to be able to post few threads below without degrading the overall content. After reading a post on the Overland site (gleamed DOF info) I considered moving to full DSLR but just can't justify the cost for different lenses and what I want to do. The Canon G10 is 5X optical, would I see a big difference in Zoom from 3X to 5X given the idea of what I am going for here?

[DrMoab]

Maybe what you should do is go into a good camera store and compare the different cameras side by side. Everyone has a different style.

One thing I would suggest is stay away from anything higher than 10MP in a sensor the size the normal small camera has.

I found this on dpreview.com (which is my favorite Digital camera review site)http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/Q408enthusiastgroup/

They test both the SX110is and the G10 along side the P6000 and others. These guys are pretty fair. You might get a better feel for what you want there.

Landscape/trail shooting was the primary reason for looking at the zoom capabilities and lens quality was why I was only considering Nikon or Canon. Do you know of any site that could detail the limitations of wide angle shooting with this type of P&S Zoom lens? I have already found some info detailing lack of control for DOF shooting on P&S cameras. With what you have pointed out it makes the Canon SX110IS with only 10X optical zoom @ 9MP seem the better choice for a compromise in lens quality/zoom capabilities. I don't intend on reaching your level of photography but would still like to be able to post few threads below without degrading the overall content. After reading a post on the Overland site (gleamed DOF info) I considered moving to full DSLR but just can't justify the cost for different lenses and what I want to do. The Canon G10 is 5X optical, would I see a big difference in Zoom from 3X to 5X given the idea of what I am going for here?

[DrMoab]

On reading that review I forgot about the Panasonic LX3. I have been hearing rave reviews about this camera.

Funny they also said it was the winner of the bunch too. You might take a serious look at one of them also.

They don't have a very great zoom but the lens is quite fast, giving you better low light shooting ability and a way better ability to control DOF.

[JeeperG]

FWIW I just bought the powershot SX10IS and am loving it so far, I am a newb to the digicam experience so my opinion don't mean @#%#. So far this seems to be an excellent camera. Have not had it long enough or used it enough yet to make any opinion on batteries.

[DrMoab]

FWIW I just bought the powershot SX10IS and am loving it so far, I am a newb to the digicam experience so my opinion don't mean @#%#. So far this seems to be an excellent camera. Have not had it long enough or used it enough yet to make any opinion on batteries.

Its funny, I didn't know anything about that paticular camera but after reading that DP review, they didn't have anything bad to say about it. And those guys are pretty harsh when it comes to reviews. They are picky as hell.

[JeeperG]

Wait, am I reading the wrong review? They are reviewing the SX110. I have the SX10.

[JeeperG]

Not a good pic or anything but just did a quick outside shot while it was still a little light out to show the zoom capabilities somewhat?
So this is from my front yard which is a good distance from the mountains.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/th_IMG_0224.jpg (http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/?action=view&current=IMG_0224.jpg)
Here is one I snapped last night, just me holding it.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/th_IMG_0201.jpg (http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/?action=view&current=IMG_0201.jpg)
Another moon shot from a few nights ago.
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/th_IMG_0143.jpg (http://s94.photobucket.com/albums/l118/JeeperG/Digicamtest/?action=view&current=IMG_0143.jpg)
I am still learning this camera as you can tell.

[DrMoab]

Wait, am I reading the wrong review? They are reviewing the SX110. I have the SX10.

No you are reading the right review. I thought you had the 110

[Brad M.]

Hey Tom, what did you end up going with? My wife and I are thinking of a new camera in the next few months here.

[MTNTECH]

Hey Tom, what did you end up going with? My wife and I are thinking of a new camera in the next few months here.

Nothing yet, I am saving up a few more dollars and entertaining the thought of a Nikon D5000, otherwise the the DLSR con is working over the point & shoot theory.

[DrMoab]

Nothing yet, I am saving up a few more dollars and entertaining the thought of a Nikon D5000, otherwise the the DLSR con is working over the point & shoot theory.

Are they out yet?

[MTNTECH]

Checked the Nikon site out about them and they are on Amazon in stock for $850 with the max 55mm lens. When I said I was saving up a few more dollars failed to mention how long I will have to save up. Lot of money for a camera needs a lot of time to decide.

[DrMoab]

Checked the Nikon site out about them and they are on Amazon in stock for $850 with the max 55mm lens. When I said I was saving up a few more dollars failed to mention how long I will have to save up. Lot of money for a camera needs a lot of time to decide.

Do yourself a huge hugE huGE favor and spend the extra dough on an 18-200MM lens.

For a DX camera (which the D5000 is) it...IMO is the perfect lens. Yeah, it will cost you close to the same cost as the camera but trust me on this. It's the ONLY lens you will ever need. Maybe not want...but need.

With the exception of doing really really shallow DOF stuff I find it to do everything I want. It's wide enough to get in close on those super tight trails but yet you can zoom way way in too. The cool thing also is the vibration reduction on that lens works killer. You can have it out all the way at 200MM and even with a lower shutter speed you don't get much blur.
Just to give you an idea.
This is at 200MM standing all the way across the canyon.
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g265/DrMoab/Fall%20Fling%202008/DSC_0186-1.jpg

This is from the same spot. Not even all the way zoomed out. Only at about 40MM
http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g265/DrMoab/Fall%20Fling%202008/DSC_0177.jpg

The range is incredible. It's worth every penny of the somewhat steep price tag.

[MTNTECH]

Do yourself a huge hugE huGE favor and spend the extra dough on an 18-200MM lens.

For a DX camera (which the D5000 is) it...IMO is the perfect lens. Yeah, it will cost you close to the same cost as the camera but trust me on this. It's the ONLY lens you will ever need. Maybe not want...but need.

With the exception of doing really really shallow DOF stuff I find it to do everything I want. It's wide enough to get in close on those super tight trails but yet you can zoom way way in too. The cool thing also is the vibration reduction on that lens works killer. You can have it out all the way at 200MM and even with a lower shutter speed you don't get much blur.


The range is incredible. It's worth every penny of the somewhat steep price tag.

One the main reasons I was looking at Nikon P90 was the 24X lens. Having only 1 lens with a lot of Zoom has been a goal during my Camera search. Your pic's are just what I was want to see out of that type of lens - thanks it solves one of my DLSR questions.

[skeptic_always]

I have this camera for a couple years, I'm still quite pleased with it. 12x zoom and a bunch of settings and stuff I haven't a clue about (I'm a point and shooter). One thing I really like about it is it does use a special LI battery pack, but you can also use 2 AA batteries (at a noticeably reduced battery life).

http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-cameras/kodak-easyshare-z712-is/4505-6501_7-32412495.html

edit: it's NOT a DSLR