Hybrid D44-60 progress

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Last night I pressed the Dana 60 housing ends on my HP D44 housing. The latest pics can be seen here: http://tinyurl.com/rcnts

The full album of project pics can be seen here: http://tinyurl.com/oekaj

I set the housing up with the pinion pointing up at 12 degrees and marked a the vertical point on each axle end. I then drew a line along the top of each tube using a piece of angle iron as a guide. Then I nipped top, bottom, and either sides of the ends of the tube with a portable band saw to leave some definite marks. Then I layed out the housing ends on a piece of paper so that I had a line passing through the center of the king pins. I also layed out two lines at plus and minus 6 degrees on the paper. Finally, I transfered the lines to the back of the housing ends and marked them with the band saw similar to the tube ends. Finally, when the axle was in the press, I simply aligned the correct marks on the housing ends with those on the axle tubes and pressed the ends on. They should be 6 degrees back when the pinion is pointing up at 12 degrees! Jeff

[RCman]

Looks pretty good. :thumbup:

How much longer till you ship it complete to me? :D

Seriously, nice work. What are you other plans for it?

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

The Hybrid front 44 will complement the HP rear FF 60 I am building. I plan to put them under an MJ I have. However, the MJ has no drivetrain of any sort at the moment, so there is a LOT to go before any of this stuff is useable. Jeff

[Goatman]

So you won't be tempted to throw them under the XJ and head west next spring??

:D

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

It wouldn't be unheard of. :) Hell, there is a lot to go (and a lot of spending) just to get the axles operational. Jeff

[smilesyota]

Nice work! what did you use for side gears in the diff? I have an extra 60 laying around and was thinking about the same set-up.

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

I don't have a diff for it yet. I plan to purchase a 35 spline ARB. I think you can get a 35 spline Detroit too, but I'm not sure. Jeff

[Lincoln]

I don't have a diff for it yet. I plan to purchase a 35 spline ARB. I think you can get a 35 spline Detroit too, but I'm not sure. Jeff

No 35 spline detroit that I know about, the ARB is the only option.

[cracker]

Jeff,

What seals do you plan on using

-Avery

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Napa 15292 which is clearly shown in the link provided in the first post. :) Jeff

[cracker]

Napa 15292 which is clearly shown in the link provided in the first post. :) Jeff

My bad. I didn't go through the second URL

-Avery

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

A small bit of progress. I got my shortened stock axle back from Dutchman. Something like $55 to shorten it, $20 to send it there and $25 to have them send it back! Oh well. No, it's not 4130 or 300M or any of that fancy shit, but it is 35 spline and uses a Dana 60 sized u-joint, so it can't be all bad. Oh, it's 32.5" long and will be combined with a stock '89 Ford F350 short side shaft in the D44 housing and end up at 64" wms to wms. Jeff

http://tinyurl.com/yf2laf

Heres a link to the whole album: http://tinyurl.com/yebxt9

[Ghost]

How much shipped to 29550? What will the final cost be? I have been looking into this and am intrested in your outcome. Great Job!

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

You know, I've never been in on the "how much shipped to" joke. It just passes right over my head! :) Anyway, although I probably have the costs jotted down here and there, I specifically haven't tried adding them up! I really don't want to know! :) Although, I will probably do that some day to see how it compares to other means of procuring a similar axle. Jeff

[Ghost]

Funny I was afraid you would say that.... I think this is what I want next if the standard D44 does nto work out. So far though she is holding up with stock stuff. However I am about to step into bigger tires and a bigger engine.

[shortxjdoug]

So far though she is holding up with stock stuff. However I am about to step into bigger tires and a bigger engine.


ya the stock 44 shaft is actually really weak looking, i finally got to see one ( one of brian's spares) in persone and the taper at the splines necks down to about the size of a 30 shaft

[Gaius]

Looks real good. That's been my plan for my emtpy HP44 center chunk I have laying around.

So that's a Ford HP front axle? 3 in 1/2 inch thick tube? What size tubing did you use to step up to the D60 size knuckle?

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

No, I'm using a HP 44 housing that uses 2.75" dia tubes at .5" wall thickness. This is the most common HP44 F150 housing. I believe the F250's used 3" dia. tubes, but I'm not sure what their wall thickness was. What I did to the inner C's was to cut the D60 axle tubes off right at the inner end of the inner C's and then had a friend machine out the piece of axle tube still in the inner C's to be a press fit on the 2.75" Dana 44 tubes. Jeff

[Ramsey]

Hows this coming?

[Goatman]

Yeah, Jeff, what's the latest?

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Nothing! It's still winter up here. I spent my money on a 4L60E tranny with an Advance Adapter rear output with vss speed sensor. I also got a free D300 in pieces with the intent to install the pieces in a STAK 300 case, but they aren't even making them yet! I've got dibs on a KLUNE 4:1 to go between them, but no word on that yet. As for the axles, I picked up some steel to make trusses for them last fall, but just haven't moved on the project lately. I still need to purchase two ARB's, gears, install kits, rear shafts, etc. Cash is always an issue with me.

I did manage to make a trip to the Jackson Hole area of Wyoming a few weeks ago though. A friend and I drove my dad's truck out towing my covered snowmobile trailer. We met my dad out there (long story) and the three of us tore up the Salt Range by Idaho as well as a day and a half on the continental divide. It was a great experience but left me empty pocketed! :) The red xj is still working well though. I was up at Lake Superior with it last weekend. Jeff

[Ramsey]

Hurry up and get this done so I dont have to figure it out on my own(even if it took you a year I still wouldn't need to)

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

There's really nothing more to figure out. Purchase the mentioned items and bolt it all together! That's about it. Oh, a bit of welding for the truss and suspension mounts. Then there is the steering which will need some high steer arms and everything else that goes with it. Just follow what money bags Cracker just did! Jeff

[cracker]

Just follow what money bags Cracker just did! Jeff

It was worth every penny :D

[Ramsey]

but there is no pretty pictures to stare at in the mean time

[Ramsey]

What is your reason for going 44/60, the more I think about it the less sure I am. Clearance, weight, cost(still not sure how that works out)? One more than the other? 38-40" heavy bias tires on a 44 ring gear= disaster or need for a light foot? Be a pity to do all that work and have to baby it or tear up things.

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

As stated earlier in this thread, I came upon a HP 44 and HP 60 housing pretty cheap. So, I thought I could combine the two to come up with a front end that used 35 spline shafts and 60 u-joints and king pins as well as a rear Full Float HP 60. Seemed like a decent combination using parts I had found at cheap prices. Once one adds all the cost of the new parts I need, it won't be very cheap, but since the raw material was so cheap I figure I should come out pretty good in the long run. The 44 center section may be a problem at some point, but I've seen a similar 44/60 hold up to a hot V8, large tires, a buggy frame. The guy did blow up the ring and pinion, the u-joint, etc once, but he said it was a bouncing full throttle maneuver asking for it. Jeff

[Goatman]

My opinion is that the HP44 gears should hold up fine, unless you go with 44's. As always, anything is breakable. Given a couple of things.....high pinion front gears are stronger than low pinion, and low pinion rear gears are stronger than high pinion. Also, that a front axle typically takes less abuse than a rear axle since when it's pushed the hardest the front of the rig is usually up on a ledge or climb, so the front tires spin much easier than the rear tires.

I think a case could be made for front HP44 gears holding up as well, or close to as well, as rear HP60 gears. Many, many of us run HP60's in the rear, from Tera, Currie Rock Jock, Dynatrac Pro Rock 60's, etc. They seem to be holding up to quite a bit of abuse, though they have been known to break under severe abuse.

One of my wheeling buddies has run HP44's in both the front and the rear with 36's, for about 10 years. He's not light on the throttle, and he finally broke the HP44 rear gears last year in Moab powering up a ledge. (he now has Pro Rock 60's f&r)

[JeepFreak21]

My opinion is that the HP44 gears should hold up fine, unless you go with 44's. As always, anything is breakable. Given a couple of things.....high pinion front gears are stronger than low pinion, and low pinion rear gears are stronger than high pinion. Also, that a front axle typically takes less abuse than a rear axle since when it's pushed the hardest the front of the rig is usually up on a ledge or climb, so the front tires spin much easier than the rear tires.

I think a case could be made for front HP44 gears holding up as well, or close to as well, as rear HP60 gears. Many, many of us run HP60's in the rear, from Tera, Currie Rock Jock, Dynatrac Pro Rock 60's, etc. They seem to be holding up to quite a bit of abuse, though they have been known to break under severe abuse.

One of my wheeling buddies has run HP44's in both the front and the rear with 36's, for about 10 years. He's not light on the throttle, and he finally broke the HP44 rear gears last year in Moab powering up a ledge. (he now has Pro Rock 60's f&r)

If you're going to run HP gears in the back, what can be done to strengthen them? Cryogenic treatment? Do they make R&P's out of anything stronger now than what they've been using for years?
Billy

[xj92]

IMO if you're going to run HP in the rear the ultimate would be the thrust block and extra pinion bearing the true hi 9 uses. If you don't do that, you just need tons of extra beef to handle the deflection that comes from running on the coast side of the ring gear (such as HP60 on a light jeep with reasonable-sized tires).

[Joe]

Any progress on this?

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Not a bit! I am however, working on the rig that the 44/60 will go in. Jeff

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

I scored a slightly reduced rate RD109 35 spline ARB from a guy off Pirate.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z94/fourliter/D44-60%20project/P4290192.jpg

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z94/fourliter/D44-60%20project/P4290193.jpg

35 spline shaft next to locker:
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z94/fourliter/D44-60%20project/P4290196.jpg

Shaft in locker:
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z94/fourliter/D44-60%20project/P4290195.jpg

Other end of Locker:
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z94/fourliter/D44-60%20project/P4290194.jpg

Jeff

[Gravesdiggerxj]

glad to see your still at it