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Harmonic balancer question

Ecomike

Ecomike

NAXJA# 2091
NAXJA Member
Location
MilkyWay Galaxy
I noticed a ticking sound, sounded like the mechanical cooling fan striking something at variable times.

Found a thin piece of dried brittle rubber coming out ( hanging out) of the front of the harmonic balancer. Looks like it is sandwiched in between two round metal parts of the harmonic balancer. I cut off the part that was hanging out and striking the fan, drove it 35 miles with no problem, but it looks like more may come out over time. Anyone know what that piece of rubber does or why it is there?
 
The piece of rubber, from my limited knowledge is very important to the harmonic balancer and is the thing keeping the metal wheels together. Sounds to me like it is time to replace it. They are around $35-$40 at rockauto.com

--Alex
 
its a 2 piece harmonic balance and the rubber is a dampner. it is very common for the 2 pieces to seperate because the rubber fails. the harmonic balance can seperate and dig into the timing cover. i would replace the HB before you run into more problems.
 
Stallacrew said:
The piece of rubber, from my limited knowledge is very important to the harmonic balancer and is the thing keeping the metal wheels together. Sounds to me like it is time to replace it. They are around $35-$40 at rockauto.com

--Alex
Click to expand...

How difficult is it to replace? I wonder if I could use RTV on top of it to hold it in place longer. I only lost a small piece so far, like 5% or less.

Back to my RTV / Duct tape question (LOL, yes I am a duct tape person). Looking at this thing (so far at least) the rubber seems to be a 1/6" thick piece sandwiched between the two steel parts along the inner and outer radius, and 95% of that rubber is still in there, good and tight. I don't know how deep it goes front to back, but so far all I lost was a single 1/2" x 1/2" piece. My thought was to cover the exposed outer face with an adhesive layer of adhesive RTV like material to keep any more from coming out. So far I am not having any other problems. Would be nice to be able to delay the permanent fix several months.
 
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Ecomike said:
How difficult is it to replace? I wonder if I could use RTV on top of it to hold it in place longer. I only lost a small piece so far, like 5% or less.
Click to expand...

your only asking for more trouble trying to repair it with rtv. there is no way rtv can hold the 2 piece HB together. rtv will only fill the void.

to replace, you need a harmonic balance puller. i didnt remove anything but the belt when i did mine. its easy to get to if you remove the front bumper and also cover the radiator to prevent damage from a tool slipping.
 
Hallo Jeepers. I found: to prevent vibration, a harmonic balancer is attached to the front part of the crankshaft. The damper is composed of two elements: a mass and an energy dissipating element. The mass resists the acceleration of the vibration and the energy dissipating (rubber/clutch/fluid) element absorbs the vibrations.

Over time, the energy dissipating (rubber/clutch/fluid) element can deteriorate from age, heat, cold, or exposure to oil or chemicals. Unless rebuilt or replaced, this can cause the crankshaft to develop cracks, resulting in crankshaft failure.
I renewed mine 2 years ago. Easy job with the right tools. Replace also a new oilseal!!
:roll:
 
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Yeah doing the job is super easy. I actually have to do it over thanksgiving so that I can replace my timing chain. The process is simple:
1.Remove the belt from all the accessories and set it aside.
2.Remove the bolt from the end of the crankshaft that secures the HB
3. With the HB puller tool, thread the three bolts into the three spokes of the HB.
4. Place a thick washer over the crankshaft bolt hole to prevent marring it. Thread main bolt into the HB puller.
5. Use a wrench to turn the main bolt which will pull the HB off.
6. Put the new HB on, there is a key slot so you really can't mess up the orientation. Honestly the orientation is only for setting timing easily.
7. Put the crankshaft bolt and washer back on and tighten the HB down. Line it up with the other pulleys
8. Replace the belt.


Easy job. Maybe 30 minutes. Hardest part is getting the belt back on.
 
So you don't repair the old balancer (replace the rubber)?

THanks for the nice easy to follow write up!:cheers:
 
I was told just to replace the whole thing if the rubber was messing up. I think you CAN fix it, but I have no idea how. RockAuto has a repair kit or something for like 6 bucks, but I don't know how it works.
 
its easy, just DONT get a Dorman brand balancer. i went to 3 different stores, and all of them were .005 smaller than my original on the ID, and wouldnt go on. got an OEM one and it went on no problem.

and the tourqe spec. on the bolt is 80 lb/ft. i just did this last weekend :D
 
Stallacrew said:
I was told just to replace the whole thing if the rubber was messing up. I think you CAN fix it, but I have no idea how. RockAuto has a repair kit or something for like 6 bucks, but I don't know how it works.
Click to expand...
the repair kit is a sleeve that goes over the outside of the balancer to stop the front crank seal from leaking.
 
Hi,
I would get it changed as soon as possible, the balancers have been known to come apart and cause a lot of damage to things like the radiator and who knows what else. Get it fixed quickly!!!!
 
YOU can't rapair the harmonic balancer, but it can be done...

The two pieces are vulcanized together. In order to get any kind of usable repair you would need to pull the balancer, and also you would need access to vulcanizing rubber and a special "stove" used for vulcanizing.... A lot of work and a lot of equipment..... an exercise in silliness when the new replacement balancer is available at such low cost....
 
Before you try and press it on boil it in hot water, this will increase the diameter of the hole. If you are tempted to hit it use a wooden block and a BFH.
 
2x what GrimmJeeper said. All the aftermarket ones I found where Chinese junk sold through Dorman. The one I first picked up was made with such a bad alloy that the metal flange was broken off in two places while still in the box.

If you have a Renix motor there is oil flinger ring inside the timing chain cover that isn't used in newer engines.
The current FACTORY balancer nose is too long and will need around 20/1000 (IIRC, look it up) removed to fit properly.

Keep checking the balancer to be sure the outer ring hasn't moved. If the serp. belt starts to shred it's time . . .

I started and finished a thread with many of the problems that can and did go wrong.
 
So is the HB external to engine, or does it extend past the lower oil seal? I thought it was external? If it matters mine are Renix.

I get the vulcanizing issue. While I am one of the people that could probably pull it off ( I have lots of toys), It does not sound like it's worth the hassle.

So are we saying it should only come from a Jeep dealer to get a god one?
 
i've got a "pioneer" brand harmonic balancer on my 92, no troubles in 15k.
Chinese junk, just the same as dorman.

edit: Pioneer is made in Australia...whaat?
 
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Yes, the HB is external. I don't have a blow up picture of the thing, but it does seal on the lower front end, above the oil pan. It's just a pulley with ~ 2 inch long hollow shaft that seats on the end of the crank. The outside of the does through the TC cover and seals the hole off. The inside of the shaft has the crank occupying it, so it deals that way.

Kinda hard to explain, but that is the best I've got. There is no major teardown involved, but I would reccomend removing the HB and the TC cover to replace that round seal on the TC cover, just to make sure you don't leak out of that hole.

Easy job, if you get a replacement TC cover gasket set, and an HB I think you can pull it off in under an hour. If you mess it up terrible (which I HIGHLYdoubt) I am sure there is someone from here that is near that can lend a hand.
 
It's totally external to the engine. It presses onto the crankshaft. It is a hassle, you need a puller to get it off. Definitely heat it up before trying to press it on. Go to NAPA, they sometimes they have higher quality parts.
 
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