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Collapsed Lifters????

S

sprngfldxj

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Springfield, Colorado
When I start the machine (xj), I get a rattling for a 1-3 second time period, then it goes away. After that it makes a thumping sound through the exhaust that is synchronized with a tapping in the engine.
I have a new APN on it and I cannot see any exhaust leak near the usual places, but how would I check for a leak in other areas?
I also pulled the valve cover off and looked at everything and nothing seems to be ab-normal, but I have to say that I am not used to a push rod valve system. How do I check for a collapsed lifter?
Do I look for play in any part of the valve system?
Please help!!
 
Take the valve cover off and put the cylinder on the exhaust stroke then try to move the exhaust valve push rod up and down...it should be tight against the rocker arm.

Then do the same for the intake stroke......repeat on all cylinders.

A leaky exhaust manifold will make valve like noises......so be sure the manifold isn't leaking.If you still suspect collasped lifters do a search for "marvel mystery oil"
 
Are you using an ORANGE FRAM OIL FILTER?

These have cardboard end caps and the anti-drain back valve in the filter seals against the end cap. Rubber/Silicone does NOT seal well against cardboard. Then the oil in the motor drains past the valve and back into the pan. The next start, the engine and LIFTERS do NOT get any oil for a few seconds as the pump has to pump out all the air in the oil galleys and fill it with oil and then build up pressure.

Lifter noise the first few seconds of start is common with the ORANGE FRAM Filters.

It can't hurt to change what ever filter you have with a better quality one, the anti-drainback valve failing can cause your symptoms. Of course, if this problem has been on-going over several filters of different brands, then yea, look elsewhere.

What viscosity oil are you using? Too thick will NOT circulate into the lifters at first and maybe cause this.
 
Change your filter if its a fram, and if its still there, heres what i did in another thread...

UPDATE:

Turns out that it was not a cracked manifold problem, or anything that an oil additive used in the oil could fix.

As I was growing more pissed off at my 4.0 as the days went on, (been ticking since Oct 07) and after a straight year of MMO, type F ATF, cans of seafoam in the oil, (sometimes as low as 3 qts of normal oil, and a cluster**** of additives and changing my manifold... nothing was close to improving the issue.

Last week I bought another can of seafoam, and instead of throwing the whole can in the oil, I sucked the whole thing into the intake. Took about a minute to use the whole can. I let it sit a half hour. When I fired it up, it didnt tick at first, but when I went to rev the engine to start clearing the smoke, it went "tap-tap-ta" and it was gone. As soon as the smoke cleared, I drove around for a half hour in silence. I can't tell you how many times at red lights I had to look at my tach to see if the engine was still on.

It has been 2 weeks, and I have not had my engine tap since I used one can of foam in the intake.

All I hear at idle now is my injectors and my noisy HB.

Question: What was ticking that mimmicked a lifter tap? Im guessing carbon buildup on valves...anyone?

So thats it, I officially love my 4.0 again. It'll be nice when the girls wont keep reminding me that my Jeep sounds like a ticking time bomb.

The engine's at 186k, and its not "still ticking" as the saying goes...and I couldnt be happier.
Click to expand...
Im guessing it was a stuck exhaust valve, hence changing the sound of the exhaust.

Heres the whole thread...

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=956523
 
I am going to try the ATF- Oil combo in the engine to clean it out and see if that makes a difference.
I removed the valve cover and I am checking the rods and rockers, so far all I have found is the rods with out load on them are able to spin, but not move up and or down (good-I guess). I did get a little movement in one of the Rockers, but not to the eye, only slightly. would that be a cause?
Engien performance doesnt lack, and gas mileage seems good. Oil pressure is good and I have not found any leaks in the Manifold as of yet, but I am interested in the "flex plate". Could there be an issue there?
 
Did you even read my post and the link to my old thread?? I tried trans fluid, marvel mystery oil and seafoam in the oil for a straight year, and nothing helped...I added a whole can of seafoam to the intake, and the noise went away for good. I would try that first, since you said there is no up/down in the pushrods...seems to me like lifters are fine.
 
It seems that you posted while I was finishing my post. I read yours after the fact. I do like the idea of trying the seafoam first. I will try that and see what happens.
I did hear that you can use deisel and or distilled water in very small amount to clean the inside out?
 
I do have a Vacuum gauge, so I could use it. Do you know where i can get the specs as to what I should be seeing and looking for?
Tell me more about the "FLex Plate". I know nothing of it, and would very much like to eliminate it from the list if I can.
 
I think what you are looking for on the vacuum gauge is fluctuations indicating some pulsation in the intake vacuum caused by a valve stuck slightly open (or not closing all the way due to deposits or a sticky stem.) Some info here: http://www.fordf150.net/howto/diagnoseengine.php

The flexplate is the disk plate the torque converter bolts to (instead of a flywheel used with a manual transmission - which made me think, this is an auto, yes? If not then this probably doesn't apply) and which is bolted to the crank. Has a ring of teeth the starter engages with to turn the engine over. Search on flexplate or flex-plate (or "flex plate") it seems to be a fairly common issue. The check is to take the inspection panel off the bottom of the bellhousing and gently pry on the flexplate to see if there's a crack. Rotate the crank (socket on the harmonic balancer bolt or screw driver against the flexplate gear) and try the next section till you've gone all the way around. As far as loose, you could check the bolts that hold the torque converter to the plate while you're down there.
 
Last edited:
Hmmm. My '96 started ticking shortly after changing out my intake to a '99 and the exhaust to a tube-type (unkown make). Looks like a Seafoam Smoke Screen is in my near future.

Jim www.yuccaman.com
 
I checked it with a Vacuum gauge and I have no fluctuations (doesnt look like it is spelled right). I also checked the Flex plate, didnt see any break or loose bolts. I pulled the valve cover and checked to see if I have any movement in the Rods, non there. I went a did the "Whole Bottle" of Sea Foam with the only results of now listening to the lifters cracking and popping after the engine shuts off, and they are loud!
THe rythmic sound of exhaust and engine clicking/clunking is still there and is more pronounced when it is cold outside or at first start.
I wish that I could find out what it is, or have someone listen to it besides a mechanic who desires an extra job.
 
sprngfldxj said:
the only results of now listening to the lifters cracking and popping after the engine shuts off, and they are loud!
Click to expand...

lifters making noise after the engine stops?I don't see how thats possible......maybe you are hearing oil drain back into the pan and/or metal contracting.Both are very normal.
 
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