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Bolting the AW4 Transmission Pan Back Up...

w0mps

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Edison, NJ
I'm about to bolt it back in and fill her up. What a pain it was getting it out, had to drop the crossmember, and take the exhaust off in order to manuver it out with the dipstick attached. Finally got it out, and seperated the two, cleaned the o-ring and bolted the half back to the firewall. Now I have the pan ready to go back on. I am using MOPAR Silicone RTV only, so I have a couple questions about how I can make this a clean, straight-forward install.

1) Best way to get it to seat back on? Dipstick attached? Slide it back in while its bolted to the firewall?

2) Should I put the RTV on before I even get under the truck to bolt it up? I don't want RTV all over the place.

3) Bolt pattern and torque spec? What kind of pattern should I bolt it up in for the 19 bolts? And what torque? I don't want to strip it and they felt fairly light when I was taking them off.

I searched and really didn't get a straightforward answer. Thanks in advance for any input.

Andrew
 
Well I just did this twice, one with the dipstick not able to be separated and the second time with the dipstick separated so here's my answers...

1.) Leave the upper part of the dipstick dangling, don't even worry about it. Worry about getting the pan seated properly without moving the gasket. You may need to undo the bolt from the upper bellhousing in the engine bay to keep the two from interfering. Attach the upper part of the dipstick to the lower part LAST.

2.) I put RTV on the pan and laid the gasket on that to help keep it from shifting around on me while I was under there.

3.) I first started ALL the bolts (starting with the four corner ones to hold the pan up) and then proceeded to work my way from the center ones, out to the front and back ones. I didn't use a torque spec, but just watched the gasket. As SOON as it even flinched, that was enough. It's VERY easy to overtighten these and squeeze out the gasket. I think the torque spec is something like 15-20 in lbs but don't quote me on it.
 
Okay, so your saying get the rubber gasket as well, lay the RTV on the lip of the pan, then the gasket over that, then straight to the bottom of the trans, no more RTV? I was told to just use rtv only, no gasket. I guess for the $2 it's cheap security and keeps the mess down. I tried lining up the pan just now without anything and the only way it lines up with all the holes is if the dipstick tube is between the two tranny hard lines, which keeps some downward tension on the whole pan. I don't remember this tension when I took it off, and I highly doubt I bent the tube on the pan itself, it's pretty sturdy. Can anyone provide some input on where the tube goes to comfortably fit on the trans? I just don't want to cause any damage know what I mean?
 
I used four small studs (M6-1.0x20m/m) to locate things as I assemble them. I also use a cork gasket with NO RTV, and it's behaved well for me so far.

The studs go more or less in the corners, and you set the gasket in place on the pan, set the pan and gasket in place on the case, and then install the four stud nuts (loosely.) Go around installing the screws, and then you can tighten them once you get them all in place. I don't recall the torque spec - but it's on my site under Tech Archives (culled from FSMs, which is why all years aren't there. Pick a year close to yours, and use a torque wrench!)

I don't like to use RTV on "maintenance/access gaskets" (axle covers, transmission pans, ...) because it makes it that much more of a pain in the arse to get clean for reassembly.
 
my results have been different than those from above, and i know 5-90 and mopar maniac both seem to know what they are talking about but here goes my two cents anyway. i tried using a cork gasket and it failed almost immediately, even with very little torque. (i seem to remember 15 inch lbs) it was a napa gasket and needless to say i was a little irritated, in my haste to finish the project after it failing once before i even got out of the garage, i rushed into doing it with just RTV, and that failed some 50 miles later, probably due to improper RTV setup time, and the wrong RTV. the third time, i took my time, make sure everything was very clean ( i have some very tried and true methods for removing RTV in a hurry and its called a razor blade!) i also made sure to get a big tube of the black RTV, Permatex makes an ATF specific RTV that you might look into, i had no luck finding it. anyway i got it seal well, and stay put with a small bead of RTV allowed to setup at room temp for 15 minutes. as far as the dipstick, i had the best luck pulling it apart, and letting the top half hang, being careful not to mess up the o ring. i haven't had any issues with the cross member, or the exhaust. maybe once you disconnect the dipstick you might have better luck. again, my advice is different from the two experts above, but i know it has worked for me, on two AW4's and one 42re..............


mike
 
I'd much rather NOT use RTV just because of the mess it makes putting it on and taking it off. Now I can't get the tranny pan to sit comfortably on the trans. Can someone tell me where that 4" dipstick tube routes around them 2 hard lines? Between or on either side? It's fitting at some positions, but with lots of tension. It should sit comfortably and line up with all the bolt holes, right?
 
5-90 said:
I don't like to use RTV on "maintenance/access gaskets" (axle covers, transmission pans, ...) because it makes it that much more of a pain in the arse to get clean for reassembly.

I wish I had your steady hands! Mine always seemed to shift around on me (granted that was with the dipstick tube stuck together) when it came time for reassembly. The only reason for the RTV for me is to help keep it seated when shuffling around. However I think your setup is definitely more ideal for easier maintenance.
 
MoparManiac said:
I wish I had your steady hands! Mine always seemed to shift around on me (granted that was with the dipstick tube stuck together) when it came time for reassembly. The only reason for the RTV for me is to help keep it seated when shuffling around. However I think your setup is definitely more ideal for easier maintenance.

That's what the studs are for - set the gasket in place, set the pan in place, hold it all up with one hand while I reach for the nuts. Put them on loosely, then grab the screws and start them.

I like to think I have steady hands most times, but part of making work easy is making work simple...
 
MoparManiac said:
Mine always seemed to shift around on me when it came time for reassembly. The only reason for the RTV for me is to help keep it seated when shuffling around. However I think your setup is definitely more ideal for easier maintenance.

[FONT=&quot]Another method for keeping a gasket from slipping is to use sewing thread to tie the gasket to the pan with small knots through the bolt-holes.
The diameter of the thread is so small that it does not affect the sealing of the gasket.[/FONT]
 
I ended up getting the pan back in, laying a thin bead of MOPAR Silicone RTV around the entire pan, laying the rubber gasket, lightly pushing it down all around with my fingers, then sat it and loosely put all the bolts in. Then went around and torqued them from one end to the other in a circle motion to ~10 ft/lbs. Gasket seemed to crush and came out the side of the pan all around slightly. This is normal I'm assuming since the gasket is about 3/4" wide. All in all it went alright, hopefully it doesn't leak because I'm NEVER dropping it again. Now onto attaching the dipstick tube...
 
I ended up taking using a small amount of RTV to hold the gasket on the pan. I actually bent the small piece connected to the pan while removing it, and didn't realize it. Anywho I noticed that and bent it back..... after I dropped my crossmember... and my exhaust. Oh well, it's all good now, everythings back to normal with Amsoil in the trans, tcase, and diffs, and mobil 1 in the errl. One really good thing that came out of this though. When I went to take my downpipe off to drop the exhaust, I noticed it was extremely loose. I thought I had the famous cracked header, and the ticking sound was driving me up a wall, so I was very close to getting a new header (I have a banks on there now). After I bolted the exhaust back up, the tick was barely heard. I still hear it at a little higher RPM's than idle, then it disappears.

A couple of questions on that topic though:

1) Would that much of an exhaust leak cause a significant power loss?

2) I was having a problem with the Jeep backfiring through the intake. It only happened when I first started the truck at take-off. It would buck for about 10 seconds and backfire through the intake depending on how I fiddled with the throttle. Would that leak have caused that?

3) Would it have killed some gas mileage?

I have yet to drive the Jeep, because I took out my airaid intake to clean and oil it, also cleaned the engine and bay really well, so I want it to dry completely before I even take it for a ride. Thanks for all the replies guys, it means alot.
 
Hey w0mps, in this I am assuming that you are running a renix engine, if not then it may be a TPS replacement as your symptoms that you are describing all sound like one common porblem. On this site you will find alot of good information: http://www.lunghd.com/On_Site_Tech.htm Please in the future when requesting help give your year and engine as well as the symptoms that you are experiencing (I believe there is a sticky regarding this). The more information that you can provide the easier it will be for others to assist you. good luck and if you need more info PM me as well as posting here and I may be able to email you more of what you may require. Oh and also when checking your TPS make sure that you have good grounding straps. A good upgrade/fix to OEM wiring issues is a kit that 5-90 sells. I would recommend one to prevent further issues down the road as well as maybe even fixing this one.
 
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