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90 Died again. No spark. Need HELP bad

90woodyxj

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Sebastopol, CA
So, I got my Jeep running again yesterday after going through a lot of crap getting it running again. Didn't have spark before. Broke down on me today with same symptoms. I don't understand what the hell is going on. Any ideas anyone?

CPS replaced.
Ignition coil replaced.
Ignition control module replaced.
Power going to coil but no spark coming off of it.

I'm about ready to dump this thing off a damn cliff. I don't understand how the problem could be "fixed" for two days after replaced the ICM and coil then do the same damn thing. help.
 
Oh, forgot to mention, I've had this intermittent isue where it would die while driving and when I'd start it again it would rev continuously at over 3000rpm. If I shut it off and let it sit for 20 seconds I could start it up and it would be fine. Not sure what causes that. Not sure if that has something to do with it or not.
 
90woodyxj said:
Oh, forgot to mention, I've had this intermittent isue where it would die while driving and when I'd start it again it would rev continuously at over 3000rpm. If I shut it off and let it sit for 20 seconds I could start it up and it would be fine. Not sure what causes that. Not sure if that has something to do with it or not.
Likely the IAC is sticking or the TPS is acting up. You can clean and oil the IAX.
 
90woodyxj said:
So, I got my Jeep running again yesterday after going through a lot of crap getting it running again. Didn't have spark before. Broke down on me today with same symptoms. I don't understand what the hell is going on. Any ideas anyone?

CPS replaced.
Ignition coil replaced.
Ignition control module replaced.
Power going to coil but no spark coming off of it.

I'm about ready to dump this thing off a damn cliff. I don't understand how the problem could be "fixed" for two days after replaced the ICM and coil then do the same damn thing. help.

My best guess would be there is some sort of resistance between the CPS and the ECU.
You can jump the C-1 and D-1 pins at the ECU connector and do an ohm test at the CPS plug between the two pins. This will tell you quick if there is much resistance in the harness or connectors.
Do an ohm test on the new CPS,new doesn't necessarily mean good, I just got a CPS that tested way high on an ohm test out of the box.
CPS can be temperature sensitive. They sometimes get flaky at high or low temperatures. If you have a serious main bearing seal leak, spraying the CPS in hot oil can also have some affect on function.
The CPS is what triggers the ignition module and is most times the cause of no spark. The ignition module rarely fails or the coil. The ignition module and coil is actually one of the better pieces of the Renix system, high performance and dependable.
Double check that you didn't lay the wires for the new CPS on the exhaust manifold (easy to do). I usually cable tie my CPS wires to the speedo cable. Clean the connector with a good contact spray, I use brake cleaner, a tiny brush and scrub.
Next CPS change and I'm gonna chop the wires for the CPS off near the firewall where the ECU harness goes through and wire/solder the CPS wires directly.
 
90woodyxj said:
can u give me some more info about this IAC or TPS? and why/how it would cause no spark? wuts the IAC?
IAC idle air controller, if it sticks it can cause it to rev up high at start up. The IAC is parked partially open at shut down, in preparation for the next start. As soon as the motor fires it closes some (or is supposed to). Turning the motor on and then starting again, resets the hwole process, it can be an intermittent thing. IAC has no affect on spark, you may have more than one problem going on.
Throttle posiston sensor TPS, on the side of the throttle body, sometimes gets water inside and can cause a really high idle, but also has little affect on spark.
 
Hmm. Yeah the CPS is proven good because I used it in my Jeep back when it was running well and put in a new one to try to fix a problem I had a while back, which turned out to be a short underneath my radiator. Swapped out the CPS this time as a first theory. Wires aren't on manifold and seem to be okay. Been trying to get ahold of a decent tester recently again. Just seems funny that I would replace the ignition module and coil and it would run fine for two days then do it again. After having not run for so long.

Im just getting so sick of constant electrical problems. This jeep is a never ending nightmare.
 
Today I had to replace the coil because the engine just started cutting out and then wouldn't start for a few minutes, or if it did, the timing was screwed up and would run rough and not go over 3K. Initially I thought it was a bad ground or bad sensor. My pops suggested the coil and lo and behold the code reader verfied his claim and so I removed the Accel coil that I've had for a year and put in the original coil and it didn't cut out yet. I'll give it the road test tonight.
 
Mine wouldn't run for shit awhile back , and it turned out that my coil was bad . It happens ...
 
Yeah I replaced the coil. I don't get why it would run for a day with the replacement parts then repeat the problem. Next step is to go through alll connections and wires to look for shorts and issues. Thoughts about the CPS not being able to function properly due to something else are definitely there.

Gordon, lemme know how the road test goes. I did the same thing and started headed home "before my luck ran out" and it crapped out on the way home lol
 
I have had CPS nightmares. Not s'posed to run at all. Ha! not true. I have a new one in the glovebox I should put on as since my cracked flexplate was replaced, I have an acceleration problem above 2800 rpm. I think I could do it blindfolded. I did find out since i notched mine, I have to squeeze down hard while tightening it. Very close working design, like less than a mm.
 
Interesting. What kind of CPS nightmares? Could you describe? I'm still convinced I'm going to sell the darn thing, just because I haven't been able to trust it to get me home for about two years straight. Something always goes wrong as soon as I fix a problem.
 
90woodyxj said:
Hmm. Yeah the CPS is proven good because I used it in my Jeep back when it was running well and put in a new one to try to fix a problem I had a while back, which turned out to be a short underneath my radiator. Swapped out the CPS this time as a first theory. Wires aren't on manifold and seem to be okay. Been trying to get ahold of a decent tester recently again. Just seems funny that I would replace the ignition module and coil and it would run fine for two days then do it again. After having not run for so long.

Im just getting so sick of constant electrical problems. This jeep is a never ending nightmare.

Possible no spark,
CPS not giving a good signal, wiring or heat (or cold/temp.). Mine once refused to start and I dumped a bucket of water on the CPS. After it cooled back down it started just fine. Don't even ask how I came up with that idea, just a hunch.
Coil or module, most times it's power in, in the wiring or the ignition switch or maybe the trigger wire (small yellow wire at the module).
Coil to cap wire, shorting to ground (or another wire), which can be a sometimes thing.
Really weak spark, back to the wiring again.

You really need a digital volt and ohm meter, they really don't cost much. You can get a decent one for $20.
Fifty percent of the time, the problem is in the wiring or a connector.
The wifes old 87 would periodically crap out, turned out to be a wire at the firewall end of the injector harness. A known trouble spot that is often overlooked. The harness flexes every time the gas pedal is moved. I've found broken wires under the insulation in this area. But this is actually not a likely cause of your no spark though.
Three XJ's with a combined age of 50 years and I've never replaced a coil or ignition module in any of them. My 88 gets a motor mud pack at least once a week and a high pressure motor wash nearly that often, the coil is doing fine.

Ignition coil facts, 35,000 volts is 35,000 volts whether it is made by a stock coil or an after market coil. Much more voltage than that isn't going to ignite the fuel air mixture any better, but will likely just burn the electrode off the end of your plugs much quicker. Also excess high voltage isn't necessarily a good thing because the voltage may have a higher tendency to find alternate ground paths.
In summary, enough high voltage to reliably ignite the fuel air mixture is enough, more just burns up plugs and causes lightning storms in the distributor cap and the plug wires.
Adding more high voltage without increasing the diameter of the distributor cap isn't recommended. the spark has a tendency to jump to adjacent poles inside the cap or even to ground inside the cap.
More spark isn't necessarily better. Most of the performance coils are designed for very high compression ratios and/or very high RPM's or designed to work outside of the normal envelope. And are likely to cause problems at low to mid RPM's. And when hooked up to a stock module, may cause premature failure (they may be a poor ohm match).
 
hmmm, so, however long its been since the jeep died on me again, i went to work on it today.

put a charge on the battery and while i was waiting for that i eliminated the little CPS connector plug. just wired the things together for now, will solder later. soo....put the battery back in, and the damn thing fired right up. after running rough for a min from sitting, it smoothed out.

im about to start taking bets on how long people think it will stay running for...
 
alright so heres the deal. the damn thing died again.... wtf? cps connector is now eliminated.

so, im thinking computer may be getting reset when i disco the battery... so wut is sending shatty readings?
 
Did you ever solder the CPS connections after you eliminated the connectors?
 
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