Gas stuff

[RichP]

Noticed something interesting last night, went out to grab a couple of slices and was staring at the mobil station and noticed that Diesel was $2.72 a gallon, gas was $3.09. Now unless I'm suffering from oldhimers I don't EVER remember diesel costing LESS than gas, EVER. I had also heard a blurb that there was rumour about the tricking industry planning an 'action', that was last week. Wonder if that price difference is the oil industry heading it off at the pass by dropping prices for the trucking industry to get them in line. This was in NJ will check out PA when I get back there on friday.

[IntrepidXJ]

you are suffering oldhimers.......diesel has almost always cost less than gas....except until the last few years at least

[scoobyxj]

You got the same thing here in NW Ohio $2.75 for the oil, and gas is $3.19.

[lilredwagn]

It's been that way for a couple months, but has happened frequently over the years and was that way in the 80's. Has to do with a combination of factors, but is basically supply and demand.

First big reason is the economy is in the process of tanking, and people aren't buying, so transport is down.

Second, diesel is cheaper to refine and easier to handle than gas.

A third possible reason is the quality of crude going through our refineries. We're in the process of running out of good cheap oil. It's possible (I'm not a chem engineer) that the diesel to gasoline ratio is higher in the heavy crude that we may be running through our refineries. Notice the price of asphalt has dropped dramatically over the past couple months as well. (which may have as much to do with the tanking building industry as with refiner capacities)

Now, there's no public evidence that we're refining sludge other than speculation (incidentally the reported refinery downtime for "upgrades and repair" has been to convert the existing machinery to more efficiently handle heavier crude), but you do have to keep in mind that bushco passed a law that allows private companies to cook the books in the "interest of national security", so at this point, I'm not sure I'd take oilco or refiner reporting at face value. Of course if you follow that to its conclusion, you could easily end up on the opposite side of the fence. Very Orwellian.

Also, a cold winter will kick up demand for heating oil and cause diesel to top gasoline (diesel and heating oil refined from the same fractionate). Right now not a whole lot of demand for heating oil. Though if you have oil heat and an empty tank, you might want to fill it now when it's cheap and let it sit until winter. If it's a cold one, it'll save you several hundred bucks.

If you have the time and are willing to entertain the idea that there might be something more to this gas price thing than oilco gouging, I highly recommend checking out the following. It's a real appetite killer.

http://www.theoildrum.com/node/2393
http://www.theoildrum.com/node/2563

Also check out the front page, which is covering the hurricane (cyclone) that none of the mainstream news media are covering, despite the fact that it is bearing down on a significant portion of oil infrastructure.

Considering the economic interest, the climatic interest (that area hasn't recorded a hurricane *ever*), and the military interest (the storm effectively blockades two of our carriers in the Gulf), it is a damn wonder no one is talking about it.

[75SV1]

you are suffering oldhimers.......diesel has almost always cost less than gas....except until the last few years at least
I will agree with this. I think what has caused the increase in price of diesel is the low sulfur and now Ultra Low Sulfur diesel formulations. Notice that the ULS diesel jumped to about $2.80/gal. When gas was going down to about $2.00-$2.25 last summer or so. Now that Gas is over $3, ULS diesel is still about $2.80.
Tom

[89Daytona]

I will agree with this. I think what has caused the increase in price of diesel is the low sulfur and now Ultra Low Sulfur diesel formulations. Notice that the ULS diesel jumped to about $2.80/gal. When gas was going down to about $2.00-$2.25 last summer or so. Now that Gas is over $3, ULS diesel is still about $2.80.
Tom
Not to mention the military runs on diesel...

A few years ago truckers had a rally in DC and then diesel prices stayed almost the same for a few months while regular gas prices increased.

[ECKSJAY]

WTF is oldhimers?

[RichP]

WTF is oldhimers?

I don't remember zactly....

[ECKSJAY]

I don't remember zactly....

Oh, I see...a cute joke about Alzheimer's.

[5-90]

Yes, it's "old-timer's" disease.

Diesel usually cost rather less than gasoline - it's made from heavier fractions, is less volatile, and generally required simpler refining and fewer additives.

The uptick in Diesel prices (when they first passed gasoline about a year and a half ago) was due to their figuring out how to crack the longer HC chains in Diesel oil down to the semi-volatile paraffinoids that make up the bulk of gasoline - it was due to an "artificial" shortage caused by finding an alternative use.

The upticks in Diesel at this point would be largely due to the newer ULS blends that have become required lately as well - but Diesel has cost more than gasoline for at least the last 18 months...

[RichP]

I dont know about the rest of the country, diesel prices were never of any interest to me but here in PA and NJ diesel has ALWAYS cost more than gasoline, generally higher than the mid grade gas. Also very few stations sell diesel here, none of the places like the chain gas marts sell it. In my area of about 20 stations maybe 8 carry diesel. None of the recently build ones carry it at all, only the old established stations.

[5-90]

I dont know about the rest of the country, diesel prices were never of any interest to me but here in PA and NJ diesel has ALWAYS cost more than gasoline, generally higher than the mid grade gas. Also very few stations sell diesel here, none of the places like the chain gas marts sell it. In my area of about 20 stations maybe 8 carry diesel. None of the recently build ones carry it at all, only the old established stations.

That could be why Diesel "always cost more" around you - relative scarcity.

Since Diesel is available from damn near every corner gas station around here, they've no reason to jack up the prices on a local level. Besides, I tend to track things by prices I see at TA, FlyingJ, and outfits like that - that's a little more indicative of things overall, I think.

[scoobyxj]

One of the things I have always wondered is how when stations localy here can be say $3.50 a gallon the stations ten miles up the road in the next town are $.15-$.20 lower, or how the stations on the other side of town are almost always $.07-$.08 lower. That makes no sense to me at all. You know that the gas is all coming from the same distrabution center no matter whos brand it is.

[Rev Den]

Local taxes.

Common place in these parts.

Rev