Another HP D44 build

[traitor5150]

Ok I just wrapped up my stroker motor so not It's time to Start of the front axle seeing I dont have one And I really want to try out the new motor. Im Leaning towards a ford HP because im currently running 35's but im stepping up to 36-37's soon. I fould A 74 f100 housing about 1 hour away that Im going to look at tommorow. And Before I get flamed I have done my research and Used the search function but I still have some questions.. What are the exact parts I will Need what years exacly. Im going to go Hi steer so chevy knuckles Those dont need to machined?>? Or do they??? Next Hubs ford 5 on 5.5 can those be used from The 74 axle im buying or probbaly no so I need hubs off What year??? Spindles Chevy small bearing right.. OK what years will work?? Anything Else I need to get started?? IM going to run the tnt brace and use stock waggy shafts Ill probbaly buy new warn hubs new everything else I hope to be able to get used... If possible. That it or did I miss something I just want to be shure I get the right parts the first time..

[XJ_ranger]

Call randy's ring and pinion


they have all the parts you need to do what you want...

[MontanaXJ]

Ok I just wrapped up my stroker motor so not It's time to Start of the front axle seeing I dont have one And I really want to try out the new motor. Im Leaning towards a ford HP because im currently running 35's but im stepping up to 36-37's soon. I fould A 74 f100 housing about 1 hour away that Im going to look at tommorow. And Before I get flamed I have done my research and Used the search function but I still have some questions.. What are the exact parts I will Need what years exacly. Im going to go Hi steer so chevy knuckles Those dont need to machined?>? Or do they??? Next Hubs ford 5 on 5.5 can those be used from The 74 axle im buying or probbaly no so I need hubs off What year??? Spindles Chevy small bearing right.. OK what years will work?? Anything Else I need to get started?? IM going to run the tnt brace and use stock waggy shafts Ill probbaly buy new warn hubs new everything else I hope to be able to get used... If possible. That it or did I miss something I just want to be shure I get the right parts the first time..

Chevy outers - Driver side will be already setup for studs. Passenger from early 70's will usually have to be machined, drilled, and tapped so that studs can be inserted. The late 70's Chevy passenger outer can't be machined.

Chevy small bearing spindles and late 70's Ford Hub/Rotors will give you 5x5.5. Go with the NAPA hub/rotors as the are made in U.S.A. My Duralast crap was made in China and exploded on Hell's Revenge last year. You can get spindles through www.completeoffroad.com, here is the spindle http://completeoffroad.com/wsm/i-373_chevy_spindle_72-76_12_dana_44_k10.html

TNT Bridge is set up for full width and to run it on a narrowed D44 you have to narrow equally on both sides, ie. you can't run waggy shafts. See Cruzin Illusions thread for all the details on his build which you should be able to copy.

I went with Dedenbear Ford knuckles to counter the 2 degrees of camber Ford builds into their D44. From the front the tires looked like this \ /, now my front tires are straigt up and down. They are super beefy, but require quite a bit of grinding for clearance around the inner C for full steering. When running a Ford knuckle you then run a Ford spindle http://completeoffroad.com/wsm/i-375_76-79_broncof150_spindle.html

Greg

[Goatman]

After scrounging through the wrecking yard for spindles and rotors, I found that they are nearly as cheap new. The Chev flat top knuckles will be cheaper at the wrecking yard.....if you can find them. You still have to factor in cost of maching and taping the pass side knuckle, it will be basically flat, but still needs machine work and doesn't come with the holes drilled. Five lug Ford rotors can come from virtually any year, mine are from an '82 TTB axle. If the '74 axle has disc brakes, you can use the rotors, but it probably has drums.

Since you're going through the work and expense of building a stronger front axle, there's no sense using stock Waggy axles. The u-joints and axle yokes won't be any stronger than the D30 stuff, and you say you want to run 36-37's. Better to just go ahead and factor in the cost of chromo shafts, and even if you use 760x joints you can snap ring them in the chromo shafts and then you'll actually have a stronger axle. Of course, running 36's or 37's you really should have aftermarket axle joints.

[Starboard M]

Chevy small bearing spindles and late 70's Ford Hub/Rotors will give you 5x5.5. Go with the NAPA hub/rotors as the are made in U.S.A. My Duralast crap was made in China and exploded on Hell's Revenge last year. You can get spindles through www.completeoffroad.com, here is the spindle http://completeoffroad.com/wsm/i-373_chevy_spindle_72-76_12_dana_44_k10.html

TNT Bridge is set up for full width and to run it on a narrowed D44 you have to narrow equally on both sides, ie. you can't run waggy shafts. See Cruzin Illusions thread for all the details on his build which you should be able to copy.

Ok, so if I were to go looking for small bearing spindles, how exactly do I know if they are the smaller ones? Mr. N has a compairison picture on his site, but I have searched almost everywhere and not seen any specs on them. Is there a major difference that I can find while Im at a junk yard?


Also, I plan on using the TnT truss, but narrowing the axle to waggy width. I beleive that it will make the axle sit .66'' to the pass. side. Not sure if thats right or not. Im just going to use the track bar to suck it in a little bit. Wont be exaclty strait, and the coils might lean a bit, but I dont think it would be a big problem. Input anyone?



edit: Picture I was talking about
http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/images/Dana44flatops/Spindle_paint.jpg
From
http://77cj.littlekeylime.com/flatop_knucles.html

[TNT]

Get the truss without the mounts welded on and you can set it up for your combo yourself. You'll just need to put the mounts where they need to as required.

[TNT]

I would also raise the mounts 2" for better control arm angles and ground clearance.

[traitor5150]

Ok I got all of the parts I need Im ordering the truss from tnt monday. Does it have provisons for a trackbar mount?? I assume it dosent so what has everyone done about that? Also m I better off makeing it waggy lenght so I can run off the shelf axle shafts or am I better off centering the pinion so it is not offset .66 and running custom shafts that just sucks because If one breaks I have to wait to get another vs just thowing a stock waggy in to save the day.. Any bad side effect of having the pinion offset????

[TNT]

Check out this link. The offset won't matter at all.

http://www.madxj.com/MADXJ/technical/technicalfiles/JAfrontD44arb/FrontD44arb.htm

[traitor5150]

Ok so waggy width it is but what about the trackbar should I do everything then mount it up and mark where to put the trackbar?? Has anyone here seen the tnt brace in person

[Starboard M]

TnT has axle side track bar mounts. They have two availible, one for high steer, and one for stock steering. Let them know what you are going to do, and they will set you up.

Im going to be ordering mine on monday as well. Im not worried about the axle being offcenter. I figure I can adjust it somehow and make it fairly strait.

[Cruzin Illusion]

Ok so waggy width it is but what about the trackbar should I do everything then mount it up and mark where to put the trackbar?? Has anyone here seen the tnt brace in person

Here are a few pictures of mine:

http://www.thexota.org/d/3156-2/100_2594.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3153-2/100_2593.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3177-2/100_2602.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3198-2/100_2610.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3401-2/100_2676.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3404-2/100_2677.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3407-2/100_2678.jpg

If you have any questions feel free to PM me.

Tom

[traitor5150]

Cruzin id that a tnt trackbar mount or a homemade one. What about the trackbar looks like a custom made with re endsand adjuster?? nver seen a straight one like that. Also is that downpipe out of a tj the way it goes under the oil pan looks like it... Thanks

[Cruzin Illusion]

Cruzin id that a tnt trackbar mount or a homemade one. What about the trackbar looks like a custom made with re endsand adjuster?? nver seen a straight one like that. Also is that downpipe out of a tj the way it goes under the oil pan looks like it... Thanks

That is a TNT Trackbar Bracket. It was the first one of it's kind. I worked with Matt and Bob from TNT to come up with the TrackBar Bracket on the Axle side, Trackbar Barcket on the frame side and the Trackbar with RE Joints on both ends to work with a high steer set up. I know that these are all still on file and can be made. The trackbar bracket fits perfect with their truss set up. It wraps over the truss and is welded on all sides. I is way stronger than the JKS Above Axle Trackbar Bracket. I have since attached tabs onto the brack for my hydraulic ram for my hydro assist.

The exhaust was done custom in town when I did my triangulated 4-link in the rear. We ran the exhaust that way to give more clearance for the upper control arm on the drivers side (did not need to).

[traitor5150]

Ok So tnt pretty mutch has me hooked up there. What aboutn steering is my best bet just to buy dom locally then then get the threaded inserts and weld it up?? I have some flat tops here is one it is not is the greatest shape the other side is mint thought This is the best I could Find around here take a look I might just mill down the top and drill tap it. My question how mutch needs to be taken off the top just enought to make it true??? I sandblasted it and found that it is very thin in the spot picured there is accualy a hole. So If I screw it up machineing it ill jsut get a new one online ebay or something but if it works ill run it untill I find a better one..

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep047.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep046.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep045.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep044.jpg

[traitor5150]

Ok So tnt pretty mutch has me hooked up there. What aboutn steering is my best bet just to buy dom locally then then get the threaded inserts and weld it up?? I have some flat tops here is one it is not is the greatest shape the other side is mint thought This is the best I could Find around here take a look I might just mill down the top and drill tap it. My question how mutch needs to be taken off the top just enought to make it true??? I sandblasted it and found that it is very thin in the spot picured there is accualy a hole. So If I screw it up machineing it ill jsut get a new one online ebay or something but if it works ill run it untill I find a better one..

[traitor5150]

Ok Why cant I just run this knucke im thinking about it and those chevy ones are scareing me espically since I want to run hydro assist. I have the small bearing spindles and everything but can I run these Im not Shue It looks like it may work but im a little unshue im not shure if that flat area is enought to mount the arm on is this a big no no seems like it may be to me.
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep.jpg

[TNT]

Ok Why cant I just run this knucke im thinking about it and those chevy ones are scareing me espically since I want to run hydro assist. I have the small bearing spindles and everything but can I run these Im not Shue It looks like it may work but im a little unshue im not shure if that flat area is enought to mount the arm on is this a big no no seems like it may be to me.
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i138/traitor5150/jeep.jpg

It doesnt have enough material on it to be used hor a high steer setup.

Stick with you other knuckle and have it machined. It looks like it should work fine once it's milled and drilled.

[traitor5150]

Can I run chevy Inner C's because I have some in mutch better shape than my ford ones plus the ford ones have 2 degrees of camber built in to theirs.

[Starboard M]

Can I run chevy Inner C's because I have some in mutch better shape than my ford ones plus the ford ones have 2 degrees of camber built in to theirs.
If you want to use the small bearing spindles, you have to use chevy knuckles.
The C's are all the same, so it doesnt matter what you use.

[traitor5150]

O ok I thought the camber was in the inner c guess not.

[rehab]

If you want to use the small bearing spindles, you have to use chevy knuckles.
The C's are all the same, so it doesnt matter what you use.

i remember reading somewhere that some fords had 2 degrees of camber built into their inner c's??

[traitor5150]

Bob at TNT told me to run 5 Degrees of pinon angle same as stock and -5 caster same as ford stock. Said this is the best way to run it for my lift about 6 1/2 in with 35's. I see others running arond 13 pinion angle and more than 5 caster between 5.5 and 7. Where the best place to be from experiance???? Also anyone run ino issues with the tierod hitting the steering box/pitman under full compression looks like it could get clsoe unless there is alot of bumpstop... Im think im going to run crossover steering for this reason..

[TNT]

I beleive its more like 8 degrees at the pinion and 5-6 degrees of caster.

Stock pinion angle setting will be too low.

[Prepmech]

I'm set at 13 degrees for my pinion angle, and 6.5 degrees of caster, running 6.5" lift.

My pinion points just above the centerline of my front driveshaft, which is the correct angle for a front CV driveshaft (you want your pinion pointing just below the centerline of the driveshaft in the rear).

5-8 degrees of caster is the stock setting for cherokees.

This seems to be what most others are running too:
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=52219&highlight=dana+44+tech

Mock everything up and make sure it looks good before you weld everything up.

I am also running the TnT truss.

It sounds like Bob at TnT may be giving you measurments from another reference point. Although, that is 10 degrees seperation between pinion angle and caster, I am only running 6.5 degrees of seperation and everything is working out.

[traitor5150]

It would seem to me at least, that you want yor axle side U joint to have some range of motion because if it's a straigt shot it will wear out fast because none of the needle bearing will have any range of motion so they will wear unevenly.. Am I correct in thinking this way or is this not feasable????

[Prepmech]

It would seem to me at least, that you want yor axle side U joint to have some range of motion because if it's a straigt shot it will wear out fast because none of the needle bearing will have any range of motion so they will wear unevenly.. Am I correct in thinking this way or is this not feasable????

You want about one degree of difference between the pinion angle and drive shaft angle. Anything too much more than that will give you vibrations.

If you ran it with more than one degree of seperation, you would just have to unlock your hubs before driving at higher speeds. The vibrations would wear out the u-joints faster then them not being stressed evenly.

[Prepmech]

Ok so waggy width it is but what about the trackbar should I do everything then mount it up and mark where to put the trackbar?? Has anyone here seen the tnt brace in person

Offset does matter if you are using the TnT brace with the mounts already on it. There is no way to adjust the horizontal location of the pinion. Your axle will be centered, but one of your wheels will stick out more than the other. You can try to compensate for it by adjusting your track-bar length, but then your control arms will be in a bind.

Just making sure that if you are planning on going Waggy width you plan on making your own control arm mounts, and spring perches.

[traitor5150]

I have the truss and everything now. Stock xj width WMS is 60 in correct? ANd the ford full width is 67. So If I cut 2 off each side will take me to 63in in the front then If I run some 5x4.5 to 5x5.5 1.25 thick wheel adapters in the back that will make the back 62.5 that should be perfect...Did eveyone else cit 2.5 ?? I dont think that extra 1 in is going to matter but thats my thinking...

[adamusmc2002]

Here are a few pictures of mine:

http://www.thexota.org/d/3156-2/100_2594.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3153-2/100_2593.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3177-2/100_2602.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3198-2/100_2610.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3401-2/100_2676.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3404-2/100_2677.jpg
http://www.thexota.org/d/3407-2/100_2678.jpg

If you have any questions feel free to PM me.

Tom

Very nice Tom!!