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Jeep Patriot offroad video

the wheels leaving the ground is my biggest problem with the Patriot. If it had solid axles and suspension like the Cherokee, it would be perfect.
 
camarors8992 said:
That is not off-roading. Any current run of the mill SUV could do the same.
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Granted, but by the same token it is DCX promotional material. Expecting them to show its capabilities would be a stretch.

Take a look at this article. They really gave it a good run, and I have to admit that I'm impressed with what it was capable of.
 
camarors8992 said:
Ya, No thanks. I'll still with my cherokee. That thing this a waste of the Jeep name IMO!
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Okay, time to trot this out again: see this post for the details of where the Patriot meets or exceeds most key stock XJ specs - including ground clearance.

I fail to see how it's a waste of the Jeep name, given its capabilities. Sure, it's not an XJ - but then, is a 2WD XJ, WJ, J-Truck, or DJ a waste of the Jeep name? How about an early IFS FSJ Wagoneer? Or the KJ, 2WD JK, or WK?

If you don't like it, that's fine. But at least try to be objective about it: the Patriot outdoes everything else in its class in terms of off-road ability, and I believe it's also the only vehicle in its class to offer a low range (though admittedly I'd prefer a separate transfer case rather than CVT trickery). No, it's not an XJ, and it irks me that DCX is trying to make it out to be the belated replacement for the Cherokee. But if it means that a buyer chooses a Patriot over a Forester Escape, RAV-4, CRV, Grand Vitara, or other cute-ute, it's keeping Jeep alive - and that person will be able to go places with it that the others can't. It's a Jeep.
 
TrueBlueXJ said:
What is it that causes the wheels to leave the ground so easily? Just curious.
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It's the independent suspension setup. Basically, in a solid-axle design, a push up on the right side of the axle will generally push the left side down by the same amount and vice-versa. However, with independent suspension, one wheel's vertical movement happens - for the most part - without effect on the opposite wheel's vertical movement. If they hadn't gone with a wishbone design (and note that 'not wishbone' isn't the same as 'solid axle'), articulation would've been improved somewhat and we'd see less of the leg-in-the-air stuff.
 
I hear a lot about IFS nowadays. I assume it's a vast improvement on street handling over solid axle design? Aren't Xterras IFS? I know they're used quite a bit off road, so how is flex improved? Sorry to hijack the thread, but I have absolutely no exprience with IFS.
 
TrueBlueXJ said:
I hear a lot about IFS nowadays. I assume it's a vast improvement on street handling over solid axle design? Aren't Xterras IFS? I know they're used quite a bit off road, so how is flex improved? Sorry to hijack the thread, but I have absolutely no exprience with IFS.
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IFS just by its nature only gives a few inches of travel at each wheel and is a lot harder to lift and upgrade. That's why we don't like it. Just wikipedia independent suspension and read up all night, it's good info.
 
RyleyF said:
IFS just by its nature only gives a few inches of travel at each wheel and is a lot harder to lift and upgrade. That's why we don't like it. Just wikipedia independent suspension and read up all night, it's good info.
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Disagreed, and by a long shot. It's the implementation of independent suspension that determines the amount of travel, not independent suspension by its nature.

For exaples to the contrary, there are a couple of vehicles that I'd recommend you research beyond Wikipedia: the Hummer H1 and the Citroen 2CV / Mehari 4x4. There are certainly others, but having driven a couple of the former and owned both of the latter, they all use non-wishbone independent suspension systems (and note that I don't say 'IFS' because they're both fully independently-suspended) and have surprising amounts of wheel travel as a result.

The real issue with the Patriot's articulation is that it uses essentially the same road-biased independent suspension as we've been commonly seeing on passenger vehicles for the last 30-plus years. Had it used something more akin to the almost-portal arrangement on the H1 or the Citroens' leading/trailing arm setup, it would be a very different story altogether. That doesn't mean that it's not capable by any means, however - traction aids can basically make a wheel in the air irrelevant. If they didn't, there'd never be any point in locking an XJ.
 
Last edited:
dam...whats the hurry..there moshin the crap outta that thing...
 
casm said:
Disagreed, and by a long shot. It's the implementation of independent suspension that determines the amount of travel, not independent suspension by its nature.

For exaples to the contrary, there are a couple of vehicles that I'd recommend you research beyond Wikipedia: the Hummer H1 and the Citroen 2CV / Mehari 4x4. There are certainly others, but having driven a couple of the former and owned both of the latter, they all use non-wishbone independent suspension systems (and note that I don't say 'IFS' because they're both fully independently-suspended) and have surprising amounts of wheel travel as a result.

The real issue with the Patriot's articulation is that it used essentially the same road-biased independent suspension as we've been commonly seeing on passenger vehicles for the last 40-plus years. Had it used something more akin to the almost-portal arrangement on the H1 or the Citroens' leading/trailing arm setup, it would be a very different story altogether. That doesn't mean that it's not capable by any means, however - traction aids can basically make a wheel in the air irrelevant. If they didn't, there'd never be any point in locking an XJ.
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I beg to differ, H1's lift tires more than anything which is why they need front/rear lockers and full time 4wd. H1's will never make good rock crawlers because the suspension is designed to make for a good ride on any terrain at high speed and the suspension, while it can travel quite a bit will never equal a well set up solid axle. I'm not saying that there aren't exceptions to the rule (Ford's TTB is the only thing that comes close), but they are very very few and far between.
 
RyleyF said:
I beg to differ, H1's lift tires more than anything which is why they need front/rear lockers and full time 4wd.
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Sorry, but your argument fails. You're comparing apples and oranges in this case, and it flat-out just doesn't work.

H1's will never make good rock crawlers
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Regarding your assertion re: rock crawling, are we to assume that that's the only valid form of off-roading?

because the suspension is designed to make for a good ride on any terrain at high speed and the suspension
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Uh, no, wrong. And *ESPECIALLY* not in an H1. It's good for what it is, but it's sure not a Bentley.

while it can travel quite a bit will never equal a well set up solid axle.
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Two things:

1) Please do your research more carefully; you're not really anywhere near accurate, as it happens.

2) Also understand that we're not playing IFS vs, SFA here - the Patriot is *fully* independently-suspended, so let's keep to people with experience in that area rather than armchair KJ haters who don't consider either one a 'real' Jeep.
 
TrueBlueXJ said:
I hear a lot about IFS nowadays. I assume it's a vast improvement on street handling over solid axle design? Aren't Xterras IFS? I know they're used quite a bit off road, so how is flex improved? Sorry to hijack the thread, but I have absolutely no exprience with IFS.
Click to expand...

Xterras have a solid rear axle, which helps them out quite a bit. They do lack articulation with the front suspension, and I have seen where that hinders them in keeping up with my Cherokee since I wheel with them all the time. I believe the newer Xterras went from torsion bar front suspension to coils, which helps them out even more. One advantage they do have is in rutted out mud. I was getting hung up on my front diff, while an Xterra with the same size tires was clearing it.
 
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