How to identify Bad Starter?

I've been having intermittent starting problems lately. I keep thinking I've got the problem licked by having found a not-too-tight battery connection or re-seating the starter fuse... but it's getting worse. When I turn the ignition - the panel lights come on until in the full-on start position - at which time my instrument panel goes dead too (not even any clicking - but sometimes it just starts right up). Though I can't recall if it does this normally when starting. I tried re-seating all the cables/lugs (except the small one with the phillips screw near the pos. starter terminal.

Anyway - I'm wondering if this is the sign of a near-dead starter, or if this sounds more like a contact problem, since it seems to run strong when it DOES run. Any ideas?

BTW - I was having some starting problems a few weeks back, and I traced it to a dead battery - so that was replaced and it was FINE for a few weeks until this...

urgh!!

Did you have your alternator checked when you replaced the battery?

It sounds like a fully charged battery (when you had it replaced) supplemented by a weak output from your alternator and it eventually (a few weeks later) goes dead and doesn't have enough voltage to kick over the starter.

Tried putting a battery charger on it or jumping it?

Your symptoms don't sound like a starter to me. Sounds more like a bad battery or possibly the alternator as RedHeep said. Just pull the altenator off and carry it to the parts store. They can check it. Take your battery with you while you're at it. Both of those are easy to take out. The belt is the hardest part of it.

What year?

Sounds like ignition switch sir. Intermittant contact problem.
How many keys/stuff do you have on your keychain? Extra weight wears them out pretty fast.

Sorry - I guess I didn't make the sequence of events quite clear maybe...

The battery is a brand new red top and has lots of juice. I DID try to jump just as a check - but it did absolutely nothing at all.

The alternator was just rebuilt - and seems to be doing it's job. The battery doesn't seem to be wavering from a topped-up state (isn't losing juice).

So far the ignition switch theory gets the nod from me (yeah - I've got a whack of keys on there)... that or a bad starter... though I'm not sure the starter would be acting that way if that were the case. (anybody know of any way of checking the starter? i.e. for an open circuit or what the resistance should be, etc...?).

The only other curious thing is that I seem to have more problems starting at night than day - so who knows - maybe condensation and cold is exacerbating the problem...

Anybody know what's involved in replacing the ignition switch??

try this:

next time you cant get it started, try tapping the starter with a hammer or similar blunt object. if it starts after that then yes it is your starter.

if you dont know where it is, its located on the lower end of the engine on the pass side. follow your batt cables and it will lead you right to it (and the alt).

i was able to get a new starter (not reman) at NAPA for just over 100 bucks. a couple bolts and all was well.

hth
stewie

You should be able to check whether it's the ignition switch by putting a test light on the starter solenoid terminal (the little one). If it lights when you turn to start, then the ignition switch and the starter relay are working. If it doesn't, you need to troubleshoot your way back, starting with the starter relay and then back to the ignition switch. If (with connections confirmed as good) you consistently get voltage to the solenoid terminal, but don't hear the solenoid click, or don't get starter action when it does, then suspect the starter.

How about the headlights? If you try to start with headlights on, does it put the lights out when it fails to crank? If it does, then the ignition switch is working, and I would recheck the battery terminals first (scrape off the oxidation layer and lube with vaseline), and don't forget the grounds. They may look good without being good.

Beating on a starter with a hammer is a good way to permanently destroy it! XJ starters use ceramic field magnets that will shatter when hit. I had starter problems with my old '88 4.0. When I disassembled it for rebuild, I found the magnets shattered, and upon closer scrutiny, I could see hammer marks on the case. I've heard of unscrupulous mechanics purposely hitting the starter with a hammer to render it useless, thereby setting up the customer for a starter replacement job. Use a volt/ohm meter and logic to troubleshoot problems.

Thanks for the input so far, guys. I appreciate it!

Sounds like there can be any number of causes for a starter to go bad. So maybe looking at the behavior isn't quite the way to go. I do have a really great Tektronix VOM (volt-ohm meter) I can use. That makes a lot of sense, though I was hoping to take the lazy man's way out and have someone tell me what the problem was... but I guess I'll have to tackle it myself (!). LOL.

Even if hitting it with a hammer WAS safe, the problem seems intermittent enough that I don't think that would be able to determine anything. And yes, don't worry... I do know where my starter is, Stewie... I've replaced it myself a few times before... although it's been a few years (probably 5 or 6... I even did an engine transplant!)

I'll try the headlight thing. I'm thinking that it might confirm the ignition switch being 'good', since the panel lights go off at the 'on' position... but who knows for sure from that..? I'll just have to try.

Jonathan

I tested the continuity between the solenoid and the field coil in the starter (both positive lugs) and measured an open circuit. While I'm not ENTIRELY certain about the diagnosis, I think this means, if I'm interpreting the service manual correctly, that the solenoid is bad.