Front End Questions

Hi all,

Well, in an attempt to try and rid myself of the dreaded "Death Wobble", I went out and took measurements of toe (Way off, I think I'll measure it again with a helper to ensure accuracy as I came up with a toe in of 2 5/8" of toe in). and went to adjust the toe. Since a picture is worth 1000 words, here's a pic of the steering linkages.



Now here's my problem: I went to the go jeep site, and this looks a bit off to me. I'm still not 100% familiar with this type of steering setup, so if my terminology is wrong please correct me. The linkage that is attached the drag link, I believe it's called (Linkage from pitman arm -> passenger side knuckle), and goes to the driver side knuckle is the tie rod tube correct? Now my question is this, shouldn't this be straight, and not bent as in the picture?

It seems to me that with this being bent there's no possible way to set the toe, as the length will change as the tube is rotated. this would also explain the huge amount of toe in, correct, since the bend is effectively pulling in the tires. I know that the alignment is way off as the front tires have a lot of wear on them compared to the rear.

If this tube is the problem can someone clue me in on the actual name of it so I know what to order from the parts store.

Thanks in advance.

Pat

Edit: duh, it's an '87 MJ 4.0L, 5 speed, NP231, D30 front, D35 rear.

its not supposed to be bent. yes draglink goes frompitman to pass.knuckle. tie rod is the bent peice. it doenst matter if its bent, as long as you have the right toe in., but its probably likely it will bend easier next time it takes stress.

Thanks for verifing my suspiscions! As I said it seems like my toe is way out of whack between the death wobble (it occurs any time I go above 25 and hit anything but glassy pavement) and the fact that I have a great deal of feathering, I guess you'd call it, on the front tires.

Given the fact that if I do try to adjust the toe the tie rod will swing in a wide arc, I'll have to pull it to try and set it. It seems to me that it'll be just as easy to pull one from a junkyard, and remove that weak link in my steering!

Thanks again,
Pat

OK, I'm going to be heading to my local pick and pull tomorrow, and I had a couple of questions. First, as I said, it's a 87 MJ 4WD, so I'm wondering what would be compatible for replacement. I'm assuming that the tie rod is interchangeable between the XJ and MJ and for all years, but I'd like to verify this.

My plan is to hammer the old tie rod straight(ish) and hold on to it on the of chance that I bend/break/damage the replacement on the trail, that way I have a spare to limp home on. I realize that it's not very likely that something would happen to require me to swap it out, but with my luck if I throw it out that's exactly what would happen . My concern is that if I hammer it out I further stress the metal and it really wouldn't be safe, so I want a second opinion. If it would be unsafe, I can leave it as is and still be able to limp it home, as the truck is driveable right now with the exception of the DW.

Thanks for the input.

Pat

That's a TJ front end, but its still all the same parts, it just looks a little different.
Now you'll know what people are talking about

Phager said:

OK, I'm going to be heading to my local pick and pull tomorrow, and I had a couple of questions. First, as I said, it's a 87 MJ 4WD, so I'm wondering what would be compatible for replacement. I'm assuming that the tie rod is interchangeable between the XJ and MJ and for all years, but I'd like to verify this.

Pat

Click to expand...

Yes the MJ front suspension is the same as the XJ. Most of the suspension is interchangeable through most of the years. Just bring a tape measure to be sure.

While you're under there, have someone crank the steering wheel back and forth while you inspect and feel all the tie rod ends, bushings, etc for play. Especially check the upper track bar end and mount. Given the age, it's pretty likely you have a few worn parts to content with that are contributing to the wobble.

87manche, thanks for the pic, even color coded for us slower than average folks

lawsoncl, Surprisingly most of the front end components seem to be in pretty good shape. The track bar is nice and tight, the bushings do show some wear, but nothing out or the realm of reason. It seems to me that the root cause if my wobble is the 2.5 inches of toe-in. I went out yesterday with my wife and measured it two more time, just to be certain, and it came out to the 2 5/8 that I measured originally.

I also measured the actual length of the tie rod and then the effective length (in a straight line from the draglink to the drivers knuckle) and it's right around 2" shorter with the bend in it.

As money allows I'll be swapping out ball joints and bushings, but for now I think this will take care of the worst of the wobble.

I'll give an update on the situation in a couple of days

Pat


Edit: Oh and no one sees any problems with attempting to straighten the old tie rod and keeping it as a spare?

I wouldn't hammer out the old tie rod, but I think if you can unbend it roughly using leverage, it probably would be all right as a spare. It's very tough steel, and a gentle bending and unbending should not work harden it. On the other hand, the same thing would be true of a tie rod you bent on the trail, and whatever you did on the trail you'd have to readjust the toe at least roughly, so I'm not sure what you gain by carrying it, unless you envision actually breaking the thing.

While you're underneath with a buddy wiggling the wheel, check the pitman shaft of the steering box (the bottom, in other words) for side play. It's a common problem. A little bit is ok, but once it starts getting conspicuous, you'll have light sloppy steering even when all is aligned perfectly.

Thanks Matthew. I'll definetly check the box for play while I'm down there. I just picked up the new (used) tie rod and ends ($15, I was expecting it to be a little more, No play in it at all) and I'm going to go out and clean it up with some brake cleaner. I'll hopefully get an update up later today with the results of my work.

Pat

UPDATE: New tie rod is in! It appears that I have a bit of toe out, approx 1/2". I need to get a pair of Vice grips so I can fine tune the alignment. But all in all, not bad for a junkyard piece! I'll edit this later with driving results.

Pat

Phager said:

UPDATE: New tie rod is in! It appears that I have a bit of toe out, approx 1/2". I need to get a pair of Vice grips so I can fine tune the alignment. But all in all, not bad for a junkyard piece! I'll edit this later with driving results.

Pat

Click to expand...

Do yourself a favor and have a shop do an alignment with a machine. Ask them for a summary printout, it will give you the before and after measurements of camber, caster, toe, cross measurements, and SAI. An alignment at home with a tape measure isn't nearly as accurate no matter how hard you try. I've done it before on several vehicles, but it was always in a pinch or just to get it close enough to drive to an alignment machine. I'd never leave it that way. The price of tires should make the $70 alignment worth it.

Final update. After driving it around for the last couple of hours, and hitting every section of road that resulted in DW. The results: No more DW. I haven't fixed the toe at this point, and next week I'll likely take it in for a professional alignment. If for no other reason than to give me a solid base line, and verify that there are no other questionable front end components.

On another note, while testing for the wobble and hitting various size dips and bumps and a greater than crawling speed, I discovered that my rear bumper wasn't exactly secure! Thankfully I didn't lose it on the road. Apparently it was only secured to the frame rails by one nut and a very big washer on one side, and an allen wrench wedged in to one of the holes on the passenger side frame rail! The funny thing is, it took all of 5 minutes to pull the bumper, move a couple of the plastic nut type inserts in to the existing holes in the bed and reattach the license plate. I still need to get a couple of lights back there to be completely legal. I tell you, there ought to be a law against previous owners like this guy. I've only put about $20 into this truck since I traded it and maybe 2 hours of labor. He really could have gotten a lot more for it than an early '90s dodge with a blown head gasket.

Oh well, his loss my gain

Pat