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ax15 noise

O

outlander

NAXJA Forum User
Location
Columbus,Ohio
(1989 xj 4.0 5 speed)I swapped in a remanned ax15 recently and a fresh motor/luk pro gold clutch.I noticed a high pitch whine that goes away when I push in the clutch pedel.It's heard constantly while idleing in neutral...but will go away completely when the clutch is pushed in.It's loud enough to be heard while standing outside the vehicle....I'm thinking transmission input bearing??Does anyone else notice any kind of noise that goes away when you push in the clutch on your jeep?

The trans. is filled with redline mt-90......
 
Dr. Dyno said:
Definitely the clutch release (aka throwout) bearing that's making the noise.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the response...

Are you sure?I just put the new clutch kit/t.o bearing in 300 miles ago how could it go bad so quick?I didn't think the throwout bearing is in contact with the clutch fingers while idleing with the clutch not pressed in(clutch engaged)....but wouldn't the noise be more pronounced while pressing in the clutch if it is the throwout bearing???


It shifts fine and clutch engagement is great without any chatter or pulsing at the peddel.....

Any one else want to give a second oppinion??
 
Anyone else want to chime in?I just spent the last hour searching the forum.Can somebody tell me if the throwout bearing(mine is external slave,btw.)is in contact with the pressure plate while idleing in neutral with the clutch peddle out(clutch engaged)?
 
My AX15 now makes the same whine when in N,1,2,3,R and goes away when the clutch pedal is depressed. The tranny had less than a qt of oil in it due to leaky rear seal. I just installed a centerforce df clutch kit, throwout bearing, master + slave cylinders, turned flywheel, new rear tranny seal, mt90. Still have noise, so I figure it's a bearing inside the tranny. It now shifts better than any of my previous XJs (espec w the Hurst). I have a "spare" ax15 w/ possibly 277K mi on the ticker in my other XJ. I'm researching options short of a rebuild, thus might have to ride it out. If only it hadn't rained the weekend I originally planned to install them. By the way, the "old" clutch and pressure plate are in excellent condition w at least 75% life left in them if anyone's interested. 94 XJ SE 2WD 116K
 
Mine was making a similar whine when the clutch was out in N and in gear with the xfer case in N. I also had a grumbling noise with the clutch pushed in and occassional problems with the clutch not releasing. In my case it was a fragged pilot bearing (explains the grumbling noise and clutch release problem). The whine was the input bearing which developed 1/8" of side-side play becasue the shaft wasn't being supported by the pilot bearing.
 
lawsoncl said:
Mine was making a similar whine when the clutch was out in N and in gear with the xfer case in N. I also had a grumbling noise with the clutch pushed in and occassional problems with the clutch not releasing. In my case it was a fragged pilot bearing (explains the grumbling noise and clutch release problem). The whine was the input bearing which developed 1/8" of side-side play becasue the shaft wasn't being supported by the pilot bearing.
Click to expand...


Oh no....now I'm starting to really worry since you mentioned all that.You know I never thought about putting the t-case in neutral,I'm glad you mentioned that...I'll try that tommorrow.At first I thought it was the cj5 pilot bearing I have in there making the noise but that's not possible because while idling in neutral the input shaft is not turning inside the pilot bearing....the whole assembly is moving together while in neutral.

I'm leaning towards the front input bearing being bad.Too bad the case has to be split to put a new bearing in.
 
jeepdeepfreak said:
Oh no....now I'm starting to really worry since you mentioned all that.You know I never thought about putting the t-case in neutral,I'm glad you mentioned that...I'll try that tommorrow.At first I thought it was the cj5 pilot bearing I have in there making the noise but that's not possible because while idling in neutral the input shaft is not turning inside the pilot bearing....the whole assembly is moving together while in neutral.

I'm leaning towards the front input bearing being bad.Too bad the case has to be split to put a new bearing in.
Click to expand...

Splitting the case isn't too bad. It really helps to have a FSM in front of you, though. I rebuilt the AX15 in my Comanche right after I bought it as the synchros were badly torn up. Probably why it had a brand new clutch. In hindsight, either the shop that did the clutch didn't replace the pilot bearing or I damaged it reinstalling the tranny. I didn't pull the clutch and just shot some fresh grease in there. It went about 30k miles before the noises started and I pulled the tranny. The dead tranny is still sitting on my shop floor.
 
I know it's not that bad I've been inside two of them.....

Yea I think I screwed up my input bearing while installing/pulling my motor.I was lazy and didn't want to drop the tranny so I left it in and the input shaft got hung up on the clutch fingers while I was lifting the motor out.I think that put a lateral load on the bearing.....but I didn't think I had it caught that bad.
 
The noise is definitely coming from inside the tranny. It gets louder with higher RPMs. My ? is why doesn't it make noise in 4th or 5th if it is the input shaft bearing?
 
==============================
doesn't it make noise in 4th or 5th if it is the input shaft bearing?
==============================

The 4/5 gears may load shaft/bearing differently then the rest of the gears. Some trannys will only wine when slowing or going down hill. As a tranny gets older they can make all kinds of sounds.
I see you said the tranny was remanned. But that means very little. luck
 
I just answered your PM, with my guess that after running low on oil it might be the needle bearing between input and output shafts, or the combination of that and the input shaft bearing.

As for the throwout bearing, I cannot find any sure answer on that, but I know that some other similar clutches (i.e. diaphragm clutch with self-adjusting hydraulic actuation) do keep the bearing spinning when the clutch is engaged, so it is at least possible.
 
gradon said:
The noise is definitely coming from inside the tranny. It gets louder with higher RPMs. My ? is why doesn't it make noise in 4th or 5th if it is the input shaft bearing?
Click to expand...


The 4th gear collar just locks the input shaft to the output shaft, so there's no side load on the shafts. The fifth gear synchros is right behind the mid plate so maybe it's not putting too much of a side load on the input bearing as well.

I doubt you damaged the input bearing during the install. It's a pretty stout bearing. The balls in it are about 3/4" round. Perhaps the needle bearing between the input and output shaft, though. A damaged pilot would put excessive side loads on the input and in/out needle bearing and wear them out though.
 
So after putting up with the noise for a couple of months, it now makes noise-- not the whine when accellerating but a low grind--when off throttle and decellerating in gear. So I've got a couple days free here and want to drop the tranny. Will Chilton's be enough of a guide or do I need a FSM? ANy special tools required to rent/buy?
 
Chiltons should be ok as a guide for dropping the tranny. If you're only dropping the tranny and not opening it up, you'll probably only want the clutch alignment tool.

When I rebuilt the tranny at 180k, the bearing/synchro/seal kit was $180. I did mine without a bearing press and really wished I had one. Instead I made do with a gear puller, which I modified to lengthen the arms. I highly recommend getting a copy of the AX15 section of the FSM for the rebuild. Chiltons isn't very good and I doubt it covers rebuilding the tranny. Make sure you replace the pilot bearing as well.
 
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